I'm not saying that Holyfield could beat every heavyweight in a 1 on 1 matchup. I'd easily favor Lewis, the Klitchko's, Bowe, Fury over him because of size, but I'm talking sheer skill. Did Holyfield have the least amount of weaknesses of any heavyweight in history?
Also Cris Byrd was very skilled too, he just punched like a super middleweight
- - Grunt level Alchemy ain't science and U ain't qualified to know what skill is if U think Field was skilled.
Mike Spinks is skilled as his 39-1 record attests. He pitched a straight shut out over game champ Qawi using a stellar jab, footwork, and right hand.
Field went life and death with a tubby version of Qawi who put him in ICU as near death as it gets for a disputed split decision.
It's like U was born yesterday for the umpteenth day today.
Gonna be honest QueensburgRules, I threw up a little bit in my mouth when you tried to compare Mike fucking Spinks to Holyfield.
I'm not saying that Holyfield could beat every heavyweight in a 1 on 1 matchup. I'd easily favor Lewis, the Klitchko's, Bowe, Fury over him because of size, but I'm talking sheer skill. Did Holyfield have the least amount of weaknesses of any heavyweight in history?
Also Cris Byrd was very skilled too, he just punched like a super middleweight
- - Grunt level Alchemy ain't science and U ain't qualified to know what skill is if U think Field was skilled.
Mike Spinks is skilled as his 39-1 record attests. He pitched a straight shut out over game champ Qawi using a stellar jab, footwork, and right hand.
Field went life and death with a tubby version of Qawi who put him in ICU as near death as it gets for a disputed split decision.
It's like U was born yesterday for the umpteenth day today.
Evan Fields was a performance enhancing drugs cheater. He was also super dirty. His headbutts did serious damage. Rahman had like a big boob on his head from a Holyfield headbutt. The guy is overrated. He lost plenty of fights while being a cheater.
Prime Holyfield only lost to BOWE, wouldn't have beat Lewis in his prime though. He had a heart issue with Bowe as well as Moore.
He was a cheater though.
He wasn't a concussive puncher.
He had beautiful combos though.
Was lured into some unnecessary slugfests.
He couldn't box his way around Steward and Cooper ?
I'm not saying that Holyfield could beat every heavyweight in a 1 on 1 matchup. I'd easily favor Lewis, the Klitchko's, Bowe, Fury over him because of size, but I'm talking sheer skill. Did Holyfield have the least amount of weaknesses of any heavyweight in history?
Also Cris Byrd was very skilled too, he just punched like a super middleweight
Chris Byrd is paying for the abuse at fighting up at hw. 2 shoulder surgeries and two replaced hips me thinks. With his pillow fistedness he had trouble sleeping the night before the Tua fight (which he won) cause Tua was an impressive specimen of freakish nature upon the weigh ins aka he was huge and Chris was scared.
After his career he dealed with neuropathy for eleven years and needed to smoke cush cause of that. The man who retired him, Shaun George was simply a journeyman. He got sparked his second fight after the Byrd debacle or beat down I should say.
Holyfield - Byrd was a fun fight, mainly because bryd didn't have the punching power to keep off the monster Holyfield. Holyfield was just tough mentally. Evander used to warn Bowe about the leetches on when you make it the big bucks. He told Riddick not to cave in. Evander used to live in a 109 room mansion in Atlanta but now settles in a 2 or 3 bedroom apartment in Florida. He used to have a peculiar habit of not sightseeing. He said he planned to live a long time, so he would catch up on all the places he's been after his career.he planned to do a lot of travel.
He knew he had Tysons number as an amateur, he knew their paths would cross in the pros.
I think Tyson had more stunning attributes: code language in numbers (deceptively un-understandable by the other team. Quick twitch muscle speed and explosiveness. Plus small enough to employ the peek a boo style. In fact Evander once asked how did Tyson do such crazy bagwork? Holy copied it but his arms on his frame were too long being 6 foot 2 or so. He wasn't able to throw those quick combos like Tyson did. Another example of an explosive puncher is David Lemieux.
One poster was right: it takes tons of energy fighting cus' style. Tyson never really knew how to play defense or take rounds off, relax, and chill. He had about one successful round against Lewis before his over weight weight gain stamina was gone.
The 90's was peak steroid usage I'm almost certain. Evan Fields was so roided up I don't know how he would do without the juice.
I agree, Holyfield's heart condition that he had from about 94-96 probably came from a bad batch of roids. Tommy Morrison admitted to using roids, Oliver Mccall admitted to using, Razor Ruddock and a few others.
Holyfield would have won a lot more if he boxed more... When he sat down on his shots he had plenty of power. He just fell in love with his power. He was very well rounded and also very coachable. He beat TYson IMO because, he actually was a bit intimidated, causing him to listen to Turner who told him to push in against Tyson instead of backing off... I honestly don't think most guys could do that... Its like: "Hey see that propellor blade? when it comes you better move towards it, even though your body will scream "away! Away!"
And for all the steriod naysayers in the Japanese chorus: Yes, in that epoche of boxing most fighters were exposed to steriods... Was hardly just Evander. I will say that he could be dirty and deadly with his head butting... But thats why God created the uppercut right?
Interesting, would've been an excellent fight. I've heard a few boxing trainers think Tua would win as well. I think Tua was on the juice though. Crazy stamina and throws a lot of punches. Just speculation though.
Lol, I mean Tua could get lucky... Tyson could throw every punch and move... Tua was essentially a one armed fighter.
He was ether world class, or elite in all areas of fighting.
Punching power = World Class. Combination punch ability = Elite. Endurance = Elite borderline Super Elite. Durability = Elite borderline Super Elite. Jab = World Class. Defense = World Class. Adaptability = World Class. Attitude = Elite i.e level of gameness.
There was no real area where he lacked, he was solid in every single area of fighting.
Which he needed to be, because he was a cruiser weight coming up to fight bigger guys.
Holyfield had no super elite attributes, but he made up for that being ether world class or elite in all area's.
Super Elite i.e Deontay Wilder's power, Mike Tyson's power and offense, Lennox lewis's Jab, Floyd Mayweather's defense, David Haye's punching power, defense and speed. Those are examples of super elite attributes.
There is a possibility that Holyfield's endurance and durability could sometimes be super elite.
The 90's was peak steroid usage I'm almost certain. Evan Fields was so roided up I don't know how he would do without the juice.
lol Holyfields traps and delts were so fucking ridiculous!! :lol1::lol1: You compare cruiserweight Hollyfield to heavyweight Holyfield, he almost looks like a completely different person.
Tyson got lazy in clinches, because you can't fight like Tyson fought for 12 rounds effectively. He punch too much power into each shot. That's why I'd favor a guy like David Tua over Tyson and Tua was never even a champion in my opinion.
Tyson should have fought more like Tua, be explosive SOMETIMES and relaxed others.
Interesting, would've been an excellent fight. I've heard a few boxing trainers think Tua would win as well. I think Tua was on the juice though. Crazy stamina and throws a lot of punches. Just speculation though.
Tyson got lazy in clinches, because you can't fight like Tyson fought for 12 rounds effectively. He punch too much power into each shot. That's why I'd favor a guy like David Tua over Tyson and Tua was never even a champion in my opinion.
Tyson should have fought more like Tua, be explosive SOMETIMES and relaxed others.
Tyson let his conditioning go. That's the problem. He was good at around 215 pounds or so. It was when he went up to around 230 that he didn't have the stamina he once had. He was slower because of that. He weight 235 pounds for Lennox. Those extra 15 to 20 pounds made a huge difference and reflected a laziness to his training. You combine that with the loss of Teddy Atlas and Kevin Rooney or the loss of Rooney, and you have disaster. At that time, only Rooney and Atlas knew how to train effectively for the peekaboo style. His coaches later didn't train effective head movement, or shifting or any of the other things that made Tyson a killer.
So those things combined, along with a messy personal life, led to weaker performances overall and especially in the later rounds.
Holyfield was susceptible to uppercuts and mobile jabbers if he preferred a fight it was he wanted a stationary target to work over . I don’t think there such thing as a single person with the least weaknesses skill wise . If I had to pick one it would really be Mike Tyson under Rooney because the only thing that really you can detract from that fighter was he got lazy in clinches .
Tyson got lazy in clinches, because you can't fight like Tyson fought for 12 rounds effectively. He punch too much power into each shot. That's why I'd favor a guy like David Tua over Tyson and Tua was never even a champion in my opinion.
Tyson should have fought more like Tua, be explosive SOMETIMES and relaxed others.
Holyfield was actually very susceptible to being hit hard with uppercuts, given his propension to fighting head-on. Tyson, Lewis and especially Bowe (see the famous 10th round in their first fight) all found openings for the uppercut, doing damage sometimes.
If anything, Whyte should borrow at least a fraction of Evander's chin and willpower.
Yeah, I was about to say this. Thankfully he had a good chin and even better recovery powers. And, he had the balls to clap back after losing an exchange. Very tough fighter