Who hits harder? Canelita or Brook?

As I said one year ago, that version of Brook defeats A LOT of MWs. Gives Canelo a 50/50 fight. Actually in a fair world I think that version of Brook beats Canelo. But the problem with Brook seems to be that his face bones can't hold a big punch, which is sad. Fair point! And I'm not sure if Kell Brook's face was always that vulnerable. I believe it could be something to do with Golovkin permanently damaging it lol. Now his future opponents are going to have an easier time further destroying and damaging that face of his after Golovkin already permanently destroyed it.

Brook is a fu.cking normal fighter. Canelo will destroy any version of him...

I wouldn't say he 'didnt care', he did. Even the worst boxers with the worst performances care about defense, otherwise they'd all get KTFO in 30 seconds. But it definitely wasn't a huge part of his game plan, and he did get hit much more and much cleaner than usual because he knew he could take the punches. Golovkin has great defense when he wants to have it. It's much subtler than most 'defensive wizards', for example Floyd's shoulder roll or Canelo's lightning fast reflexes. Golovkin's defense relies on trusting his chin to absorb light, grazing punches. 95% of the punches that 'land' on him get either partially blocked by his gloves, or have lost their momentum because he turned far away/rolled with them. I started picking up on this during the Lemieux fight (took me long enough). Lemieux didn't land a lot, but when he did, they looked like big shots. When watching the fight later with different angles, you can see just how many of those shots didn't really land. If you make the effort, you see the exact same thing with Wade, Brook, Jacobs (a LOT in this fight) and to some degree Canelo. In the Wade fight, as short as it was, it looked a lot like a brawl where each guy was getting hit. Watch it again, and most of the punches that Wade threw were blocked. The extreme case was Jacobs fight. Watching it live, I legitimately thought Golovkin lost the belts. Was surprised at the result when they announced it. Saw the fight again the next day and felt foolish, because so many of Jacobs' shots were nothing more than flash and didn't hit anything. This is what makes Canelo so impressive to me. Golovkin definitely stressed his defense in this fight, yet Canelo still landed quite a lot of clean, unblocked shots. You can chalk it up to Golovkin not expecting Canelo to move so much (Sanchez fail), to Canelo being THAT good and THAT accurate, to Golovkin slowing down, whatever. But it did happen, and it's one of the biggest adjustments Canelo can make in the rematch. He rarely sits on his shots and puts his power into it. If he finds his rhythm and starts tagging Golovkin with fully powered shots instead of light counters, Golovkin can easily get knocked out. I agree with what you say about Golovkin's defence, 100%. I always saw it this way. There have been some threads calling on it: https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=732569 https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=750987 But for what some is obvious, for others it isn't so obvious. I agree that Canelo could have won the fight. If he didn't disappear for 6 or 7 rounds in the middle of the fight. He won most of the rounds when he wanted to fight. Though some were close, he did win most of 1-3 and 10-12. Maybe 4, maybe 5 being generous. But yes, I think the same. He can win more rounds next time unless Golovkin does something different. Which I think he will and that's why we saw him skinnier this time. More speed to try to KO Canelo. Who will win? unsure...

So we can agree then that Golovkin got hit against Brook because he didn't care, not because he has no defence. I wouldn't say he 'didnt care', he did. Even the worst boxers with the worst performances care about defense, otherwise they'd all get KTFO in 30 seconds. But it definitely wasn't a huge part of his game plan, and he did get hit much more and much cleaner than usual because he knew he could take the punches. Golovkin has great defense when he wants to have it. It's much subtler than most 'defensive wizards', for example Floyd's shoulder roll or Canelo's lightning fast reflexes. Golovkin's defense relies on trusting his chin to absorb light, grazing punches. 95% of the punches that 'land' on him get either partially blocked by his gloves, or have lost their momentum because he turned far away/rolled with them. I started picking up on this during the Lemieux fight (took me long enough). Lemieux didn't land a lot, but when he did, they looked like big shots. When watching the fight later with different angles, you can see just how many of those shots didn't really land. If you make the effort, you see the exact same thing with Wade, Brook, Jacobs (a LOT in this fight) and to some degree Canelo. In the Wade fight, as short as it was, it looked a lot like a brawl where each guy was getting hit. Watch it again, and most of the punches that Wade threw were blocked. The extreme case was Jacobs fight. Watching it live, I legitimately thought Golovkin lost the belts. Was surprised at the result when they announced it. Saw the fight again the next day and felt foolish, because so many of Jacobs' shots were nothing more than flash and didn't hit anything. This is what makes Canelo so impressive to me. Golovkin definitely stressed his defense in this fight, yet Canelo still landed quite a lot of clean, unblocked shots. You can chalk it up to Golovkin not expecting Canelo to move so much (Sanchez fail), to Canelo being THAT good and THAT accurate, to Golovkin slowing down, whatever. But it did happen, and it's one of the biggest adjustments Canelo can make in the rematch. He rarely sits on his shots and puts his power into it. If he finds his rhythm and starts tagging Golovkin with fully powered shots instead of light counters, Golovkin can easily get knocked out.

Do you think Kell Brook can beat Canelo Alvarez at 160 pounds (barring robberies)? Particularly the version that fought Golovkin? As I said one year ago, that version of Brook defeats A LOT of MWs. Gives Canelo a 50/50 fight. Actually in a fair world I think that version of Brook beats Canelo. But the problem with Brook seems to be that his face bones can't hold a big punch, which is sad.

Canelo without a question, at least Canelo had GGG look ruffled, with Brook he wasn't even bothered

Thanks brother. Do you think Kell Brook can beat Canelo Alvarez at 160 pounds (barring robberies)? Particularly the version that fought Golovkin?

I think people are missing the point of this thread. Golovkin takes a good punch and anyone who truly believes he was "in trouble" against Brook is a fuckin moron. Thanks brother.

Brook's punches definitely bothered GGG way more than Canelo's punches. Brook bruised up GGG as well, and in only a few rounds. GGG looked fresh as a daisy going 12 against Canelito. That being said Canelo does hit harder. The difference is GGG just underestimated Brook's power while he overrated Canelo's power in the early rounds. When GGG realized Canelo's power wasn't as good as he thought, he walked through everything Canelo threw. GGG never took Brook's power seriously before or during the fight, even after Brook did some damage.

Canelo is better than the 95% of the fighters in the history of Argentina. So what you are saying is that Canelo is better than Raul Omar Sena?

Canelo by a mile for me. Look at how Golovkin fought each of them. He walked through everything Brook threw and kept coming. It was a street fight. He was very tentative against Canelo. It took him many rounds to open up and try to look like the Golovkin of old. He respected Canelo's power, and rightfully so. Canelo does not fully commit to many punches, but when he does, he absolutely has 1 punch KO power, and not just against Khan. So we can agree then that Golovkin got hit against Brook because he didn't care, not because he has no defence.

Brook hits hard for a WW. Canelo is average for a MW. I think Canelo does more damage with timing than his actual power. I don't remember him hurting Mayweather once because he couldn't land anything solid. He hit Mosley with everything but never really hurt him. His body shots are more damaging than punches to the head because he really commits to the body.

I think Canelo hits much harder than Brook with either hand to the head or body. He also has faster more accurate punches and a much better chin. They both fought GGG at 160 and the difference in the results was huge. GGG crushed Brook in less than 5 rounds and Brook's trainer stopped the fight to save Brook from a certain KO that was just a few seconds away. The trainer didn't stop the fight because of the eye injury because he already knew the eye was injured when he sent him out for the 5th round. Canelo went the distance with GGG and held his own and some think he won. Canelo is in the same class as GGG and much better than Brook. GGG had no respect for Brook's power and walked right through Brook's punches to get what would have been a KO had Brook's trainer not stopped the fight. It was obvious in GGG's fight with Canelo that he respected Canelo's punching power. Canelo would KO Brook just like GGG did in my opinion.

Canelo by a mile for me. Look at how Golovkin fought each of them. He walked through everything Brook threw and kept coming. It was a street fight. He was very tentative against Canelo. It took him many rounds to open up and try to look like the Golovkin of old. He respected Canelo's power, and rightfully so. Canelo does not fully commit to many punches, but when he does, he absolutely has 1 punch KO power, and not just against Khan.

I have a better question Máxita: Who is the best quitter? Luquita Matthysse or Kell Brook?

This guy does not know SH.IT about boxing. Canelo is better than the 95% of the fighters in the history of Argentina. So... More respect kid. GGG was shook of Canelo punches. GGG had no respect for Brook punches. IDK what this means but its just facts. Exactly... GGG never respected the power of Brook like he did with Álvarez.

Canelos power is pretty overrated but he has pop. More than Brook for sure but not by THAT much. Brook could Ko khan too and he had GGG's head snapping back multiple times.

GGG was shook of Canelo punches. . :rofl::rofl: Canelo hit GGG with his best shot and Canelo was the one that backed off :lol1:

This one has got the haters confused :dance: Yep. I think we are comparing apples and oranges here a bit. I mean, the huge weight gap, the total overload of reasons to say Canelo being offset by significant, immediate damage done in the marquee shared matchup. I don't think the boxing math works on this one. Canelo hits harder.

Canelo. Neither of Brook & Canelo actually hurt GGG.