GGG and the catchweight drama

A few items that need to be addressed: (I know this a bit tldr, but bear with me) 1. Please stop comparing a catchweight with Ward to a catchweight with Cotto/Canelo, especially in Cotto's case. Does Gennady have a belt at 168? Does Gennady fight at 161-165 because he can't make the MW limit? Oh, he doesn't? Then stfu immediately. If Cotto doesn't want to be the MW champ, he can hand his belt over to its rightful owner and avoid the fight altogether. 2. The Ward catchweight is what CWs are for. Champions of different divisions meeting in the middle. The fight offers for JCC jr and Froch were just that: fight offers. For money. Big money. No titles on the line, no p4p status, just money. The Ward offer seemed more like a way to put the ball in his court and shut him up for a bit so Gennady could finish his middleweight campaign without being called a ducker. In fact, even if they did fight at 164 and Golovkin beat Ward, I wouldn't recognize him as the real SMW champ, just as I have a hard time recognizing Cotto as the real MW champ. 3. With all this tough talk from the I-Hate-GGG crowd, why was a fight between Floyd and Gennady so ridiculous for so many to consider? Gennady was willing to come down to a weight where Floyd held titles and Floyd should be expected to defend those titles against the best fighters who can make the weight limit. It seems like the same posters that didn't want this fight to happen are the same ones demanding that GGG go up to 168 (where he's never fought and doesn't have belts) and see the best fighter in the division. Can't have it both ways, guys. 4. Stop assuming that Golovkin fans don't want a Ward fight. Any real fan of Gennady should want this fight to happen. I know what a win over Ward would do for Gennady's status and his legacy (at least among hardcore fans, anyway). Besides, I think Gennady could knock Ward on his ass a couple times, chase him around the ring, and beat him up over 12 rounds. It's not that far-fetched. I know Gennady wrote a pretty big check when he said he would fight anyone at 168, and it made more sense when he didn't have any big fights lined up at 160, but now he does and he wants to get those out of the way first. What's so terrible about that? He will move when he's ready to move up, he'll keep his word about fighting the best at 168, and hopefully Ward can still make SMW and the fight can happen. It's a good fight for both guys and a good fight for boxing. Unfortunately, Ward may not even be able to make 168 anymore. Does that mean Gennady is now ducking a light heavyweight? You know, for a so-called bum crusher with no skills or resume, his detractors certainly hold him to a high standard. In summation, please don't let your personal feelings cloud your judgement. I saw it happen for years with the Floyd/Pac fan feud, and it seems like the whole thing is happening all over again. Let's try to remember that these guys are all brave warriors and deserve our respect. There are times when I post hateful things in the heat of the moment that I later regret. I am going to try my best to see these situations from the perspective of all of the fighters involved and their respective teams, and so should the rest of you. There's no reason we can't be civil. ;) ---------------------

Comments (20)

If Cotto or Alvarez demands a catchweight to fight Golovkin, Golovkin and his team will agree to it. Don't buy into the posturing that Golovin and his promoter are engaging in. They know damn well that he is not moving up to 168 to fight Ward everrrrrrrrr, so the only other way he is going to make more than the $2 million he made Saturday night is to accept a catchweight fight against the winner of Cotto/Alvarez. Hopefully the WBC will force the winner of the fight to defend the belt at the proper weight. And the fans of this fighter (whether it's Cotto or Canelo) should demand that they defend the belt or vacate and give the title back to a real middleweight. And don't apply the same old boxing stereotypes to Gennady. He may want a big payday, but it's not just about the money for him. He wants the titles, the status, the glory, and after he finishes off any MW that dares approach him (or scares the belt from around their waist) he will fight Andre at 168. Maybe after a contender or two to get comfortable at super middle, but hey, Ward wants the same treatment before he gets in with Kovalev, and I don't blame him.

10y ago

big_james10

10y ago

Barcham

It's fcuking disgusting how many of you are defending CW demands for a title unification, for 3 belts and lineal. No shame IF GGG meets and beats Lee in the meantime, it will be FOUR belts and if you include the RING and IBO, that will make it for SIX TITLE BELTS. But some think a catchweight is perfectly fine. Yeah, they are real boxing fans. Total tools is what they really are. There will be no catchweight in this fight and according to Dougie, it is very possible that if Cotto or Canelo duck GGG and vacate the WBC title that the RING belt will be declared vacant. The only way the winner keeps the RING belt is if it is a close fight leading to an immediate rematch. Regarding Cotto and his middleweight titles (RING and WBC), if he beats Canelo next month and does not agree to face GGG, the WBC will strip him of their title. At that point THE RING Editorial Board (with input from our Ratings Advisory Panel) will decide whether or not to vacate the publication’s middleweight championship. Circumstances will obviously come into play. If Cotto barely beats Canelo in a good fight or he wins in controversial fashion, an immediate rematch between the two is likely. I can’t speak for the Board or the Panel, but my guess is that they would be OK with continuing to recognize Cotto as THE RING champ until he settles matters with Canelo.

10y ago

HeroBando

Nobody cares - good fights is all that matters Nobody cares that Oscar/BHop was contested at like 157, we all cared that the fight just happened. The proper fighter will win regardless of weight. The good big man will beat the good smaller man. Its silly overall to get all stressed out over something as minuscule as a CW, especially when one of the fighters has stated numerous times that he'd dominate at 154 as well Many care. Flo mos were tearing into PAC for much less brazen CWs. Floyd said Cotto is undefeated because PAC fought him at a CW. Cotto has whined about that CW plenty. And it's also a disgrace in principle, if the belt is too big, turn it fcuking over

10y ago

JmH_Reborn

It's fcuking disgusting how many of you are defending CW demands for a title unification, for 3 belts and lineal. No shame Nobody cares - good fights is all that matters Nobody cares that Oscar/BHop was contested at like 157, we all cared that the fight just happened. The proper fighter will win regardless of weight. The good big man will beat the good smaller man. Its silly overall to get all stressed out over something as minuscule as a CW, especially when one of the fighters has stated numerous times that he'd dominate at 154 as well

10y ago

JmH_Reborn

Not really true regarding the WBC rules. If, say for example, Canelo beats Cotto. The WBC mandates the Golovkin fight. The two sides then enter negotiations. If neither side agree, the fight then goes to a purse bid. If it goes to a purse bid, it follows the rules - the fight is at 160 - no catchweight. The purse is split based on the WBC rules and so on. If however the two sides reach an agreement prior to a purse bid, yeah, they can agree to whatever catch weight and whatever terms they want and none of that would be violating any rules of the WBC or would require to the WBC to rewrite their rules. So it just depends on whether the two sides can agree or if it goes to a purse bid, that's all. I'm sure it's in both sides own interest to agree, but if one side feels they are getting shafted by unfair demands, they may want it to go to a purse bid. If Cotto wins though, he seems like the kind of guy who honestly doesn't care if he's stripped of his belt and labeled a ducker so GGG might have to agree to pretty much everything just to get the fight. I'm versed enough in the purse bid process - still waiting for the WBC to actually enforce purse bids, knowingly limiting their income potential against A+ draws. Its one thing to pull your weight with someone like Carlos Cuadra who'll make you no dollars, than against someone like Cotto or Canelo who can line up the coffers quite well. None of these ass-clown organizations enforced any rules against Floyd who won their 154 titles 2+ years now and you expect me to believe that they'll enforce silly purse bids against fighters who'll earn enough money in one night to pay all their salaries for the year? Especially Canelo? I think that's naive at best. On November 22, when the dust settles...this is what happens Cotto wins: 1. takes a voluntary 2. rematches Canelo if warranted 3. takes a voluntary 4. Perhaps fights GGG or Canelo wins: 1. takes a voluntary 2. rematches Cotto if warranted 3. takes a voluntary 4. Perhaps fights GGG It is in WBC's best financial interest to have a regular champ and GGG as their silly interim champ and gather 3% fees from both champs. Trust and believe that "unifying" the WBC title is not the top priority.

10y ago

HeroBando

And that, it's the truth right there! It's fcuking disgusting how many of you are defending CW demands for a title unification, for 3 belts and lineal. No shame

10y ago

Basco

Catchweights - you are either for them or your not Cotto started his career at Jr. WW - asking to meet down the middle if that is a proposal seems ok. Money, prestige, status all on the line. But when Golovkin goes up to cruiserweight - you know four divisions like Cotto and he starts demanding CW, then I don't know what the issue is when a past-prime former Jr WW does. I mean Golovkin is going to beat the **** out of Cotto whether its 157 or 160 right? Golovkin brought this on himself 154-168 doe...except for Canelo, Cotto and Ward And that, it's the truth right there!

10y ago

JmH_Reborn

One more time... Cotto CANNOT IMPOSE A DAMN THING IN A MANDATORY DEFENSE!!!!! What will it take to get that through peoples' thick fvcking heads? Sure, Cotto can refuse to fight without a catchweight, but that will cost him his title and make him look like a coward. Is that how anyone thinks he wants to end his career? Running away because he cannot force a fighter to fight him with a handicap? Cotto will ask for a 155 CW, as will Canelo if he wins next month...they will negotiate and either of them two will settle a 157 CW. GGG, like all boxers is about $$$ and will take the gamble. I know that you've read what the WBC "rules" have stated - but the WBC, WBA etc are all irrelevant - they will rewrite their own rules on the spot if it serves their best interest; cash rules all GGG will take the CW and fight either of them two. NSB is funny...everyone hates the belts, then people loves the belts. It doesn't matter. Cotto vs Canelo vs GGG are a trio of good fights, CW or no. And speaking of a Cotto fan - I want him to face GGG, but I wouldn't care either way if he does or doesn't. For me, his place is cemented. He's been written off so many times since 2009, to be back here following the Martinez destruction; its all cherry on top from here. Cotto has been doing this for 15 years; he's got nothing to prove.

10y ago

OnePunch1099

this is preliminary negotiations. if they give cotto an inch at this point then he'll surely take a mile when it actually comes time to draw up the contract. demand 160 now and concede 2 or 3 lbs later if absolutely necessary ^^^ true story

10y ago

PBP

Cotto and Canelo will force the CW. GGG needs them more than they need him. He won't pass on the money in exchange for the belt.

10y ago

NEETzsche

Cotto is in a lose/lose situation if he were to somehow beat Canelo. Either he looks like a b*tch for giving up the belt rather than face GGG or face GGG and get the living sh*t beat out of him. i'd say canelo's in a tougher spot than cotto. he's younger and bigger, so he has no real excuse not to fight golovkin. cotto could up and say "i'm too old/small for this ****" and many fans would forgive him, thanks to the great career behind him

10y ago

Barcham

I rather a catchweight than make a guy jump up 2 or 3 weightclasses or another drop a weightclass. But at the same time if you are fighting someone of a weightclass you have a belt and have fought at numerous times before, a catch weight is just retarded. It's not black and white. Granted Cotto's two fights at middle have been at catchweights, so I find it very hard to believe he wont impose a catchweight for Golovkin, team Golovkin is tripping if they think they'll fight Cotto without a catchweight. One more time... Cotto CANNOT IMPOSE A DAMN THING IN A MANDATORY DEFENSE!!!!! What will it take to get that through peoples' thick fvcking heads? Sure, Cotto can refuse to fight without a catchweight, but that will cost him his title and make him look like a coward. Is that how anyone thinks he wants to end his career? Running away because he cannot force a fighter to fight him with a handicap?

10y ago

Deevel916

Cotto is in a lose/lose situation if he were to somehow beat Canelo. Either he looks like a b*tch for giving up the belt rather than face GGG or face GGG and get the living sh*t beat out of him.

10y ago

NEETzsche

Granted Cotto's two fights at middle have been at catchweights, so I find it very hard to believe he wont impose a catchweight for Golovkin, team Golovkin is tripping if they think they'll fight Cotto without a catchweight. this is preliminary negotiations. if they give cotto an inch at this point then he'll surely take a mile when it actually comes time to draw up the contract. demand 160 now and concede 2 or 3 lbs later if absolutely necessary

10y ago

Contra

Cool,.give up the belt, Cotto. That'll make GGG that.much closer to his goal/excuse to not face Ward, which will make the fight that much closer. I wholeheartedly agree. -----------------------------

10y ago

SplitSecond

10y ago

Deevel916

So it's OK to ask cotto (153) to move up 7 pounds but giggi can only move up 4 for ward Who told Cotto that he has to move up to 160? Cotto can weigh in at whatever weight he chooses so long as its between 154.1 and 160.

10y ago

MPX309

I don't think Cotto fights GGG. . . If he has the 160 title (which he does) He should fight at 160 or vacate. I think if Canelo is successful in November then possibly yes he will fight GGG. Most likely not in a hurry and ODL will be pulling all the tricks out to tilt the odds no doubt, but I think it does happen. As for the GGG and Ward thing, I'll go as far as saying title fight CW are worse. . . But there is sense of hypocrisy when you gather the facts and GGG's stance on Cotto/Canelo. He just could have done without that small tarnish. However, that ship has saled for now and I don't really see much need to discuss it.

10y ago

ThatDude44

Cool,.give up the belt, Cotto. That'll make GGG that.much closer to his goal/excuse to not face Ward, which will make the fight that much closer.

10y ago