Klitschko in Top 10 If...?

Cunningham is still a good fighter and arguably beat Adamek at heavyweight and just got a win over a decent Mansour. Chisora, although out of shape was and still is one of the leading HWs on the planet and let's not forget Fury was green as hell, not in his best shape and it was a huge step up for him. He ended up winning it pretty easily in the end. I think vitali ruined adamek. he never seemed the same fighter after that beating

Such as? No wins really are excellent on his resume...a green and fat Chisora, a punching bag in Johnson and a cruiserweight in Cunningham? Other than that he's fought Irish taxi drivers...and been dropped by bums. Cunningham is still a good fighter and arguably beat Adamek at heavyweight and just got a win over a decent Mansour. Chisora, although out of shape was and still is one of the leading HWs on the planet and let's not forget Fury was green as hell, not in his best shape and it was a huge step up for him. He ended up winning it pretty easily in the end.

I don't think it's as bad as i twas a tone point in the middle of the decade, now we have a huge contender with legitimate wins over decent opposition in Fury, Chisora has proven he can hang with the best, Pulev looks decent and good be another good challenger, Povetkin was a former Olympic medalist and title holder, then there's the undoubted KO machine in Wilder, Jennings who is actually very skillful and a well schooled fighter, not to mention prospects in Joshua and Hughie Fury. Such as? No wins really are excellent on his resume...a green and fat Chisora, a punching bag in Johnson and a cruiserweight in Cunningham? Other than that he's fought Irish taxi drivers...and been dropped by bums.

How weak is this era, exactly? I don't think it's as bad as i twas a tone point in the middle of the decade, now we have a huge contender with legitimate wins over decent opposition in Fury, Chisora has proven he can hang with the best, Pulev looks decent and good be another good challenger, Povetkin was a former Olympic medalist and title holder, then there's the undoubted KO machine in Wilder, Jennings who is actually very skillful and a well schooled fighter, not to mention prospects in Joshua and Hughie Fury. Yeah if Wlad can keep cleaning house over the next 2-3 years, then he would be a top 10 heavy based on resume alone and longevity... I dont think he will ever be a top 10 heavy H2H, but in resume department, while not having alot of marquee opponents, the shear length and dominance of his reign would only be comparable to joe louis, who didnt exactly have a stellar list of opponents... H2H is interesting, I think he beats a lot of the cruiserweights who paraded as heavyweights in the early 20th century but as technique and size improved, I guess Wlad would struggle, especially against quick guys with power such as Dempsey. It's a tough, tough call.

How weak is this era, exactly?

The best combined win on that record is Vitali quitting against Byrd. Hardly ATG material. Pulling out of a fight with Fury due to a shoulder injury... Haye fans must be good at repressing things.

This all raises the question, with Tyson desperate for money, why did none of the bros get in touch for a fight? Or did they? The Vitali-Tyson fight was locked in next when Danny Williams knocked Tyson out, 'broke his back' and ruined the whole thing. The fight was pretty much pointless as Vitali at that stage humilliated a fighter who had wasted what was left of Tyson in his previous campaign.

Yeah if Wlad can keep cleaning house over the next 2-3 years, then he would be a top 10 heavy based on resume alone and longevity... I dont think he will ever be a top 10 heavy H2H, but in resume department, while not having alot of marquee opponents, the shear length and dominance of his reign would only be comparable to joe louis, who didnt exactly have a stellar list of opponents...

MMMM, lookin back at it, it may have been more stamina issues than hurt but Wlad did show a reluctance to come back after KDs in previous fights and looked more like David Price in the second TT fight. You're a Klit nuthugger so your opinion is invalid. Look at the guy quoted above, he's Ukrainian too but he ain't "KLITS the greatest" like you. **** the BS and be a boxing fan. You dont know **** about the sport and are just a Wlad/Vitali fan, which is plain sad. I agree, if Wlad had dominated the best guys in his era like he does the mediocre ones then I'd have him a lot higher too. Yea, like most people who are huge fans of a heavyweight champ and/or fighter from a previous era you are just bitter toward the Klitschko's. It's relative. Envy breeds hate.........again.

Wins over... Ray Austin, Calvin Brock, Tony Thompson, David Haye, Samuel Peters (when he was dangerous), Lamon Brewster, Chris Byrd, Alexander Povetkin, Eddie Chambers (before he went down-hill)... Yeah weak division my ass, stop being an ass-hole If neither Klitschko was around you'd be sucking off one of those many names in that list off. The best combined win on that record is Vitali quitting against Byrd. Hardly ATG material.

Benny are you basically saying that Tyson is underrated? I mean I would never have him in a top 10, and I seriously doubt anyone would. There's a hell of a lot of people who would have Tyson as a top 10 heavyweight. But even if Tyson isn't in the top 10, there's still a fair few names that can, at this very moment, get in ahead of Wlad. Key being at the moment.

Actually, those are very underrated eras. Outstanding HOF lock champions, and some contenders that are very good in their own right, who would dominate the majority of todays era besides Wlad. If you go back and compare the contenders, for instance a video of Pulev vs Thompson to ... I dunno ... anyone ... Pinklon Thomas vs Tim Witherspoon (first video that I found). Go to 9.10 They look like a different class of fighter. Faster, more mobile, more active, more skilled, both leading and countering and they engage more too. They're clearly, undoubtedly better in nearly every way. It's basically because there was more competition back then. The heavyweight title was a huge world event still and boxing was incredibly popular, which equals more talent and depth. Benny are you basically saying that Tyson is underrated? I mean I would never have him in a top 10, and I seriously doubt anyone would.

No on the bold part but the rest yeah. I can't place him top 10 for the reasons I've given before but if he manages to beat the best contenders out there over the next couple years, he might just get in. Let me clarify; his resume isn't good in general for an ATG, but its not bad. Vitali has a bad resume. Wlad at least fought everyone in this era, it's just a bad era.

Liston gets in above Dempsey and Lewis and Marciano? Why? I'd love to hear your reasoning. No way does Wlad lose to all these guys, I think the 80s was very weak for HW boxing and most of the 90s, outside of Holy, Lewis, Tyson and sometimes Bowe, it wasn't all that good. Ruddock might give Wlad trouble, McCall with his power and chin possibly, and Ike with his ferocity but I can't see any of the other guys beating the prime Wlad we've seen in the ring over the last several years. Actually, those are very underrated eras. Outstanding HOF lock champions, and some contenders that are very good in their own right, who would dominate the majority of todays era besides Wlad. If you go back and compare the contenders, for instance a video of Pulev vs Thompson to ... I dunno ... anyone ... Pinklon Thomas vs Tim Witherspoon (first video that I found). Go to 9.10 They look like a different class of fighter. Faster, more mobile, more active, more skilled, both leading and countering and they engage more too. They're clearly, undoubtedly better in nearly every way. It's basically because there was more competition back then. The heavyweight title was a huge world event still and boxing was incredibly popular, which equals more talent and depth.

Liston would fcking destroy Wlad. Liston would of ****ing destroyed Muhammad Ali if the fight wasn't fixed and if he never had a shoulder injury in the first fight. Sonny would of probably murdered Joe Frazier if their paths ever crossed but luckily for Joe... That never happened... I wonder why it never happened hmmm...

Wins over... Ray Austin, Calvin Brock, Tony Thompson, David Haye, Samuel Peters (when he was dangerous), Lamon Brewster, Chris Byrd, Alexander Povetkin, Eddie Chambers (before he went down-hill)... Yeah weak division my ass, stop being an ass-hole If neither Klitschko was around you'd be sucking off one of those many names in that list off.

But surely you can't rank someone on what could or should have been. Don't get me wrong, Liston was a monster puncher and terrific fighter but he can't be ranked over guys with established title reigns and better resumes and wins over other champions. You are of course correct my friend. Wouldas and shouldas doesn't count. The sentence was made as info because, IMO, Liston generally is somewhat underrated due to his relative short reign as champ.

But surely you can't rank someone on what could or should have been. Don't get me wrong, Liston was a monster puncher and terrific fighter but he can't be ranked over guys with established title reigns and better resumes and wins over other champions.

Liston gets in above Dempsey and Lewis and Marciano? Why? I'd love to hear your reasoning. No way does Wlad lose to all these guys, I think the 80s was very weak for HW boxing and most of the 90s, outside of Holy, Lewis, Tyson and sometimes Bowe, it wasn't all that good. Ruddock might give Wlad trouble, McCall with his power and chin possibly, and Ike with his ferocity but I can't see any of the other guys beating the prime Wlad we've seen in the ring over the last several years. Liston was a monster. He should have been champion way before he actually did. He had great wins against Williams and Folley prior to Patterson. I feel he was unlucky in being champion late and losing his title to the best there ever was.

I agree with this. I think he could retire now and (should) be a top 10 HW. Vitali no, Wlad yes. Wlad has the skills, the resume and the longevity to be a top ten ATG HW. No on the bold part but the rest yeah. I can't place him top 10 for the reasons I've given before but if he manages to beat the best contenders out there over the next couple years, he might just get in.