Why don't refs give 10 counts anymore?

I wish Mares would get a real trainer! Had he stayed with Nacho that mistake wouldn't have happened.

They should unless it's a complete waste of time like with smith/buckland and Pacquiao. IMO, give the 8 count and decide from there.... that's just me though

I had one of the highest KO ratios as an amateur, I have knocked people out and they start that snoring sound. I have seen people stunned, and I have seen people just with their bell rung. Respect, C. I did not know you were the actual deal, and not just a keyboard wannabe know-it-all like so many of us. Props! If I might ask, which boxer that I am familiar with would you say your fighting style is most similar to?

i understand what you're saying. you want a ten count, and are saying that simply getting to your feet isn't enough to be allowed to continue. i don't agree with it. i don't need that ten seconds if i know a fighter is unfit to continue. if the ref wants the fight stopped he can stop it at any point, without even a knockdown, and i'm in agreement with that right. if a guy is unconscious, as i've outlined in a post i just finished, you do not need to count. guys have been counted out while unconscious, and it can deprive them of oxygen. if a guy is badly hurt, you don't need to finish the count to get him checked out, get his mouthpiece out, etc. there's nothing "irrelevant," about bringing up the process by which fighters used to be counted out or stopped. it helps to better illustrate the process that refs are going through today. you asked why refs don't give ten counts, and i answered for you. Yes but my point is that he doesn't know for sure and giving a 10 count and allowing Mares to his feet (assuming he even makes it to his feet) would give a better indication. I had one of the highest KO ratios as an amateur, I have knocked people out and they start that snoring sound. I have seen people stunned, and I have seen people just with their bell rung. I also know different fighters recover differently. Look at JMM and his amazing recovery ability. The guy looks out on his feet, and then magically he's ok. I'm just saying, give the fukin 10 count. Nothing is lost by it and only something can be gained. I understand the ref has the decision but if he gives a 10 count, it's the same outcome. Give the fukin 10 count....lol

The only difference between Cuauhtémoc's POV and mine is the profanity! LOL And I have to hand it to C for his perseverance (I pretty much threw in the towel a while ago). I think he's giving you all his version of a 10-count (explaining himself 10 times), instead of being pushed back down after only the 3rd time! More power to ya', C. :biggthump Thanks man, and some STILL don't get it.

counting to ten is harder than it sounds. especially under pressure.

My thing is, why in the FUK don't refs give 10 counts anymore? .He saw the blank stare.....the same blank stare that Mares had 3 minutes after the fight was over where Mares was staring downward with a weird look in his eyes. Mares was out of it 3 minutes after the fight was over. Mares was sent down twice and both times he was hurt. And Mares doesn't have the power to turn things around. He has had 1 KO in his last 7 or 8 fights which gives him a what 13% KO record in those fights! Mares lives to fight another day and can come back.

How did he make the determination that Mares was done by looking at the top of his head? Posted from Boxingscene.com App for Android he's not even in the camera frame, so you can't say what he was looking at. to me it looks like it's quite clear that he's low enough, and far enough away to see mares eyes. he even says "your eyes."

they bring doctors in quickly to open airways, get the mouthpiece out, adjust the fighter's body, etc. when a guy is out you do not need a count. anybody here ever knocked anybody out, or seen it up close? it's not something i'm proud of, but i've rendered several people unconscious playing sports, and a couple in fights. that snoring sound you hear is from an impeded airway. you probably can't hear it on a boxing broadcast. if the head is in the wrong position the airway can be blocked completely. if a guy's nose is broken he may not be able to breath out of it at all. his mouthpiece is still in. oxygen is vital to the brain at all times, but especially during and directly following head trauma. those are a vital 10 seconds. one of your first actions when approaching an unconscious victim is to get an open airway and make sure he's breathing. when a guy is hurt, but conscious, you use your discretion throughout the count. the ref started to count, saw what he needed to see, and stopped the fight. How did he make the determination that Mares was done by looking at the top of his head? Posted from Boxingscene.com App for Android

How was the ref able to see Mares eyes if Abner was facing down just attempting to get up? Posted from Boxingscene.com App for Android He already looked like sht after the first KD, and the ref. probably have him one more chance because he's a champ, but making a mental note that if he got KD again soon it was not worth risking it beyond that. So he takes a good look, doesnt like what he sees in spite of the boxer saying otherwise, and because of whats in the lines gives him one more chance to go at it. The guy goes up, he clearly has heart but the body istn up to it anymore and he goes down again fast. The ref. doesnt need to see anything anymore the fight is over and corretly so.

New England you are a smart guy and it shocks me you of all people still don't get my point. You kind of answered your own point in this response which is even more funny. First off, you cannot compare what happened in the old days to now, that's not a good analogy. You yourself said that today, refs are more prone to stop fights and protect fighters than in older times. I agree 100% but that still has NOTHING to do with my point. Whether or not Mares gets up or not, or can continue or not has noting to do with the point I'm making. I'm just asking for a 10 count when the fighter is conscious and TRYING to get up. He's not hurting or helping Mares anymore or any less by stopping the fight after a 5 count.... There's two scenarios that could have happened. Scenario 1 Mares gets up, he is evaluated by the ref by asking him questions and making him walk a straight line. If the ref sees that Mares cannot continue, then the fight is stopped anyway whether Mares is on the canvas or on his feet. Allowing him to his feet is NOT a guarantee of him allowing the fight to continue. So again, the comparison to the old refs is a bad one. In the second scenario he gets up, answers the questions and walks straight and is allowed to continue. The round ends and Mares gets a full 1 minute to recover. Either way, the ref isn't hurting or helping Mares. He's just making the evaluation when Mares is on his feet, rather than forcing him to the ground which he did. He physically put his hands on Mares and pushed him down. Just give the godamn 10 count, that's all I'm saying. i understand what you're saying. you want a ten count, and are saying that simply getting to your feet isn't enough to be allowed to continue. i don't agree with it. i don't need that ten seconds if i know a fighter is unfit to continue. if the ref wants the fight stopped he can stop it at any point, without even a knockdown, and i'm in agreement with that right. if a guy is unconscious, as i've outlined in a post i just finished, you do not need to count. guys have been counted out while unconscious, and it can deprive them of oxygen. if a guy is badly hurt, you don't need to finish the count to get him checked out, get his mouthpiece out, etc. there's nothing "irrelevant," about bringing up the process by which fighters used to be counted out or stopped. it helps to better illustrate the process that refs are going through today. you asked why refs don't give ten counts, and i answered for you.

I do just want to make one point clear in this my final post in the column: Let's just say that Mares had been given a full count (as I believe he should've been), and then was allowed to continue and weathered the final ten seconds of the round. Do I personally believe that Gonzalez would still have won the fight (on a stoppage)? Yes, I do (w/a fairly high level of confidence). BUT (and here's the key point for me) ... do I KNOW that? I do not. And neither does the biggest talker on this site, whoever he may be. :wave:

Just give the godamn 10 count, that's all I'm saying. I totally agree with everything you're saying, especially in a championship bout where the CHAMPION is counted out after 3 seconds...lol that's ridiculous. I hope this defeated doesn't hurt Mares' future prospects too bad. I'm not a fan of Mares but he was growing on me and he is obviously skilled. He is still young enough to come back.

I always use Pacquiao Marquez I as the best example. The Pacquiao Marquez quadrilogy as the best fight series that almost never was, and we have Joe Cortez to thank for that. Marquez looked done after that third knockdown when he put his gloves up to his face. Thank you, Joe. THANK YOU, Joe. haha yeah and I can't remember the guy for the Khan/Garcia fight but the man was a pro. He knew when to let it continue and when to stop it. Mares/Gonzalez wasn't some fight between a journeyman and a contender, i twas a championship bout, this was one of the worst stoppages I've seen in a championship bout, I'm not sure how many people here know about boxing more than just beyond MayPac but it's tradition that a championship fight isn't stopped in such circumstances and that the champion especially is given every opportunity continue. It may have been semi-acceptable if there was like 1.5 mins left in the round but 10 god damn seconds. come on!

they bring doctors in quickly to open airways, get the mouthpiece out, adjust the fighter's body, etc. when a guy is out you do not need a count. anybody here ever knocked anybody out, or seen it up close? it's not something i'm proud of, but i've rendered several people unconscious playing sports, and a couple in fights. that snoring sound you hear is from an impeded airway. you probably can't hear it on a boxing broadcast. if the head is in the wrong position the airway can be blocked completely. if a guy's nose is broken he may not be able to breath out of it at all. his mouthpiece is still in. oxygen is vital to the brain at all times, but especially during and directly following head trauma. those are a vital 10 seconds. one of your first actions when approaching an unconscious victim is to get an open airway and make sure he's breathing. when a guy is hurt, but conscious, you use your discretion throughout the count. the ref started to count, saw what he needed to see, and stopped the fight.

The only difference between Cuauhtémoc's POV and mine is the profanity! LOL And I have to hand it to C for his perseverance (I pretty much threw in the towel a while ago). I think he's giving you all his version of a 10-count (explaining himself 10 times), instead of being pushed back down after only the 3rd time! More power to ya', C. :biggthump

to more directly answer your question, i'm sure that refs are taught to be liberal with stoppages during the count these days. it's not a change that each ref has individually made no his own. if i had some free time today i'd pull up some examples where fighters from the past were allowed to fight simply because they could stand. it's almost academic that they're on the soles of their feet after 10 seconds. refs today, in my opinion, are taught to make a thorough evaluation of a fighter's fitness during the count. back in the day they were just a clock. get up and you're allowed to fight, if your corner doesn't throw in a towel. today they're making a judgement about a fighter's ability to continue that goes beyond his ability to regain his feet before 10 seconds. i thought it was a great stoppage. mares has almost surely peaked, but he'll be in meaningful fights again. New England you are a smart guy and it shocks me you of all people still don't get my point. You kind of answered your own point in this response which is even more funny. First off, you cannot compare what happened in the old days to now, that's not a good analogy. You yourself said that today, refs are more prone to stop fights and protect fighters than in older times. I agree 100% but that still has NOTHING to do with my point. Whether or not Mares gets up or not, or can continue or not has noting to do with the point I'm making. I'm just asking for a 10 count when the fighter is conscious and TRYING to get up. He's not hurting or helping Mares anymore or any less by stopping the fight after a 5 count.... There's two scenarios that could have happened. Scenario 1 Mares gets up, he is evaluated by the ref by asking him questions and making him walk a straight line. If the ref sees that Mares cannot continue, then the fight is stopped anyway whether Mares is on the canvas or on his feet. Allowing him to his feet is NOT a guarantee of him allowing the fight to continue. So again, the comparison to the old refs is a bad one. In the second scenario he gets up, answers the questions and walks straight and is allowed to continue. The round ends and Mares gets a full 1 minute to recover. Either way, the ref isn't hurting or helping Mares. He's just making the evaluation when Mares is on his feet, rather than forcing him to the ground which he did. He physically put his hands on Mares and pushed him down. Just give the godamn 10 count, that's all I'm saying.

You guys still don't get it.....LOL Whether or not you stop it when he's laying on the canvas or standing in front of you it makes no difference. That's the point. Just because he gets up, doesn't mean he will let him fight. Just give him the 10 count and evaluate him as he's standing in front of you. I don't know why that's so hard to understand. All I can say is that I am with Cuauhtémoc right down the line on this one, and also smh as to why/how the superiority of the logic seems elusive to some (don't mean that to sound arrogant, either). Oh well, that's the reality of forums, and I'm sure others would wonder the same about POV's that I 'fail to grasp'. :pat:

to more directly answer your question, i'm sure that refs are taught to be liberal with stoppages during the count these days. it's not a change that each ref has individually made no his own. if i had some free time today i'd pull up some examples where fighters from the past were allowed to fight simply because they could stand. it's almost academic that they're on the soles of their feet after 10 seconds. refs today, in my opinion, should be taught to make a thorough evaluation of a fighter's fitness during the count. back in the day they were just a clock. get up and you're allowed to fight, if your corner doesn't throw in a towel. today they're making a judgement about a fighter's ability to continue that goes beyond his ability to regain his feet before 10 seconds. i thought it was a great stoppage. mares has almost surely peaked, but he'll be in meaningful fights again.

I don't care what the ref saw, Mares was badly hurt, his eyes looked terrible. Fully agree with the stoppage.