Pacquiao has been brutally KO'd and rebounded 3x now.

If Manny loses to Rios he should face Matthysse, that's a fight he could win. What a dumb floydiot style bumsniffer post.:nonono:

I wouldnt speak too soon about rebounding the third time. I think he is going to have a harder time against Rios than most people think. I think he's just about done, same thing with Martinez. You cant go on forever and getting kayoed as badly as he did at this stage of his career is not good. I'd like to see him retire with all his marbles and hope he does very soon.

manny pacquiao is done. he's still great enough to beat a lot of fighters, but the great fighter you saw from 122-147 is gone. he's been aggressive and taken punches in over 61 pro fights. he's been a pro since he was a boy. you cannot compete in this sport forever.

You get Ko'ed when you're young and hungry and just starting out and you get more determined and come back stronger and better. You get brutally Ko'ed when you're mid thirties with the best years of your career behind you, money in the bank and a political career that takes up more of your thoughts and time than boxing...

One, he was getting knocked out by lower tier competition when he made his comeback before, now he's among the elite, so the waters are a lot rougher for an aging fighter on the comeback trail Two, remember when I said aging fighter?

Those were body shots, Pac was KTFO his last fight and is older now. However, being KTFO with one punch is better than taking a beating and eventually getting stopped. And I believe he will bounce back.

:haha: :haha: Why no articles, bumps or anything saying Arum was the problem in 08?Damn, again. When Floyd left Top Rank, how many fighters did he fight while they were still with Top Rank? Hopefully you will understand this.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174247 http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153824 Show me anywhere here about Top Rank or Bob Arum being the problem in 2008 and how Floyd-Cotto wasn't a superfight then? Feel free to bump any article you have that makes your point. I guarantee you you can't because it doesn't exist. I have several that I can bumpDamn, again. Was Cotto with Top Rank in 08? And how do you know that Cotto Margarito never gets made?

There's no going in circles about it. Cotto only fought Margarito because Floyd retired. If Floyd doesn't retire, the Margarito-Cotto fight never happens. I bumped an article for you on the front page to show you how Mayweather just straight said no to Cotto because of his fan base and to show you the atmosphere for that fight "back then". Cotto had more victories at WW and was clearly the more proven fighter at WW pre-plasterman, but Floyd just str8 said no and retired. Don't blame me, blame FloydDamn man how many times are we going to go in circles lol. Was Cotto with Top Rank in 08?

A fight with Cotto summer of 2008 is a superfight. That's as big of a fight you can make at that time; even bigger than the Hatton fight. According to Floyd, Arum wasn't the problem, Cotto's "fan base" was. How did Floyd want the Cotto fight in 2004/2005 when Cotto had no fan base, but didn't want it in 2008 when Cotto did have a fan base? Lastly, as long as you say "Floyd only wanted big fights" and you think that's ok to not fight entire division of options during that time, then I can say "Floyd should've fought Cotto in 08".How many times do we have to go in circles? Floyd Cotto in 08 was not a super fight, lmao. That is a good fight, but again, you're not taking in what I'm saying. Floyd was not going to fight any Top Rank fighter unless they left Top Rank, and even then he only wanted to take on big names. Cotto was starting to become big and a few more victories at ww would've forced Floyd and his fans to take serious consideration of that potential fight. Cotto lost to Margarito. Beating Shane didn't make Cotto Floyd big. How much did Cotto-Margarito sell? Now as far as Floyd coming to 140, Floyd was not ppv material yet. That's what he was looking for. A ppv fight with Cotto who had like 5 defenses at jww or Kostya Tszyu. He couldn't get those fights while he was with Top Rank and that is why Floyd-Gatti was ppv.

@ Frank, Are you going to answer why Floyd never mentioned Paul Williams when Williams wasn't even with Top Rank?There is no reason. The fight didn't get made.

You better hope and pray your hero makes it back because the end is near. I'm talking about the true end is near. That means that you won't care about boxing after Pac loses or retires. I'll be rooting for Pacquiao, but you better pray he wins. I've been watching boxing son, since thrilla in manila when i was just a small kid. I was watching and listening when the announcer said that mike tyson could be the youngest heavyweight boxer before his first championship fight. I've watched hagler wipe the canvass with hearns and many more. Ive been around long enough to know what a warrior spirit is and who has it. BTW i boxed when i was in secondary school.

I agree that Cotto wasn't ready for Floyd in 2004/2005, but I'm talking about 2008. The article you're talking about is from early 2006, nowhere near 2008. Arum was not the problem the fight wasn't made. Floyd said and I quote "Miguel Cotto doesn't have a fan base" as his reasoning for not fighting Cotto. Show me anywhere, just one article, where Floyd names Arum as the problem like he does today with Pac. Just because Arum apply's today, doesn't mean it wasn't something else back then. Oh yeah and I never mentioned Margarito. I'm a firm believer that Floyd didn't duck Margarito. I'm just saying, Floyd should've fought Cotto in early 08 when everyone was screaming for the fight. Floyd was "his own boss", correct? There were tons of options for Floyd at that time instead of retirement. Lastly, regardless of Floyd's reasons for leaving JWW, the fact still remains that he had tons of fights there that he could've fought. I'm not saying he loses any of them, just simply saying that if you think Bruseles, Chop Chop and Gatti is cleaning out a division, you're wrong.First off I'm talking about when Floyd came to 140. Cotto and his people did not want the fight. Please understand this before anything. Floyd was not going to fight ANY Top Rank fighters because of Arum after he left Top Rank. That included Cotto. Do you understand what I'm saying? Floyd saying Cotto had no fanbase is Floyd saying build your fanbase and lets make a superfight. That isn't refusing a fight since both guys are prime. It still would've been hard to make that fight because of Floyd and Arums non relationship. There is no "Floyd should've fought Cotto". That's you talking. Floyd already cleaned two divisions out before he came to 140. He only wanted big fights after that at 140 and 147. Floyd fighting Baldomir should've told you that Floyd was not going to deal with Arum. Instead Floyd's critics used that as a way to call Floyd a coward. Floyd's retirement is the sole reason why he is criticized today by some today. But as I said. Floyd was not going to fight any Top Rank fighter while Arum was the promoter. And your last sentence doesn't even make sense.

I did. There were several more fights for Floyd at 140 before moving up to WW. Kosta being one of them (I know Floyd called him out). But still, unless you provide me with a good argument, I don't consider Floyd an elite JWW at that time. Andre Ward and Carl Froch are elite SMW's. Floyd Mayweather at JWW was not elite because he still had some Spring cleaning to do in the division at that time. Pre-plasterman, hands down, Miguel Cotto had the more proven JWW/WW resume before running into plasterman. When the WW division was the most hottest and had undefeated guys like Williams, Margarito, Collazo, Quintana, Clottey, Mosley, Cotto, Cintron, ect all fighting each other trying to figure out who's best, Floyd fought Baldomir, Ricky Hatton coming up from 147, tried to re-match DLH at 154. Then he said Cotto lived too far, didn't have a fan base and retired when Cotto was clearly the most proven WW at the time. And please don't say "who did they beat" because no one was proven at WW, including Floyd; which is why they all had to fight. Heck, Floyd wasn't even proven at JWW if you take out Gatti. But to add fuel to the fire, instead of fighting Paul Williams when he came off vacation, he fought JMM. Now ask yourself, who was more proven at WW; Paul Williams or JMM?Look, your distortion of the truth does not work here. Floyd didn't want to stay at jww unless he could fight a big name. Floyd was an elite jww the minute he came to the weight. Floyd couldn't get a fight with Kostya, and Cotto's people said that Cotto wasn't ready. This came from Cotto's uncle's mouth and Arum. We understood as fight fans at that time. Cotto needed more schooling. The only big money fight at 140 was Gatti when he couldn't get Cotto or Tszyu. When Floyd came to 147, he clearly wanted the Dlh fight. Floyd wanted a big fight or the WBC title which is what his track record consists of. He did not want to fight an unknown Margarito for his WBO title. He wanted the WBC title, and that is why he fought Baldomir. After he left Top Rank, he didn't fight Arum's fighters because he did not want to do business with Arum. Floyd was still owed money by Arum. Both have accused each other of owing each other money. Floyd had initially agreed to fight Margarito, but Arum wanted options on Floyd's next 2 fights if he beat Margarito, and Floyd clearly did not want that because Arum told him that you won't get 20 mil for a fight with Dlh. Arum also had a grudge against Dlh which is why Floyd had to break from Top Rank to fight Dlh. Floyd wanted out of his contract with Top Rank.

..........You didn't answer my questions.

Beats what, lmao? Pac's ko losses are real. Alll you have is accusations of Floyd. floyd? didn't read his name there!

Problem with that is, when you actually "live" through it, there's no research to doSo what makes you think that he could've done more at 140, and that he should've fought Cotto?

Sure, Floyd could've put in more work at JWW (Corely, Gatti, Bruseles) before moving up chasing DLH. He also should've fought Cotto early 08. I wouldn't argue if someone else thru Williams in the equation along the way. Outside of that, he's done nothing wrong. Do the research. This is not cutting it.

Sure, Floyd could've put in more work at JWW (Corely, Gatti, Bruseles) before moving up chasing DLH. He also should've fought Cotto early 08. I wouldn't argue if someone else thru Williams in the equation along the way. Outside of that, he's done nothing wrong. youre right , floyd has done nothing wrong becuase lets face it , he ducked the right fights ....but him and his fans should'nt demand anymore respect than what he is getting ... he is getting what he deserves...

Pacquiao may very well come back from that KO just fine - after all, it's not like he got "beaten up", he got put to sleep. If he's not constantly doubting himself, that will go a long way. I suspect that much of a fighter's problem after being KO'd is in their head. It plants a seed of doubt and they become much more vulnerable. Hell, even if Pacquiao's chin is "cracked", as a lot of broscientists like to say, I think he's still more than likely got the skill and physical ability to outbox Rios all night (after all, remember that Rios got outboxed by Alvarado for 12 rounds, who he at one point wobbled with a stiff jab and stopped in their previous outing). Rios doesn't have the speed, timing or 1-punch KO power to deliver a Marquez-esque knockout shot so if Pacquiao does get stopped it means he's truly fallen far from his former self. I don't expect that to happen though.