Is Wladimir Klitschko a top 5 ATG heavyweight?

a little wlad related news, apparently he's in Ibiza https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BQGItJSCcAAwr7w.jpg and guess who else happens to be there? Cippriani Ibiza twice now I've bumped into wladamir klitschko he is annoying me now— Derek Chisora (@dellboychisora) July 27, 2013 http://cdn2.mocksession.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/CHISORA-SPITTING.gif

I'm sorry but I can't take anybody seriously who A. Believes humans have "evolved" in just a few short decades. B. Believes weight is the end-all and be-all of boxing. C. Believes that a slow, fairly immobile dude with a vertical leap of about an inch like Wlad can be called "athletic". In terms of boxing A. 6foot6 vs 6 feet. Hammers and tires vs modern stregth training, Olympic boxing programs vs pub fights sounds like "evolution" to me. B. Weight divisions are there for a reason. It's been clear that the days of the 200-215lb heavyweight are long gone. C. You are one of the few that believes that Wlad is slow, immobile and has a vertical leap of about an inch... P.S Its funny how you mention athleticism yet seem to defend old timers, for whom athleticism is the last thing on the list of strengths vs weaknesses. WIthouht a doubt modern athletes are more "athletic"...Old timers certainly had a lot more toughness and grit and character than their modern counter parts, which is to their advantage, but athleticism...common man...I guess Mike Ditka was more athletic than Vernon Davis eh? P.S.S.........rince and repeat, I got nothing more for this thread.

Not the point of this thread. If you believe greatness is achieved on fantasy matchups then there's no need to take you seriously. Look at the below post. Have you boxed man? I don't want to turn this into I laced them up vs keyboard warrior, because for all I know you might have trained or you are as we speak... But the bottom line, at Wlads size, and with whatever "limited athletic ability" as some of you perceive him to have, he has just enough to make a 6 foot Dempsey struggle to do jack **** to Wlad. Size is not the end all, but in order to beat size you need to have superior skill, and even than the size disparity cannot be too great...Wlad is no Ali but his style and his strength is all he needs to win fights against 80% of all heavyweights. We have weight divisions for a reason. Pac or Cotto can be p4p fighters, but the bottom line is that in a boxing match they will loose to a number 8 ranked cruiserweight. Until someone comes thats close to his size but with a lot bigger arsenal no one will beat him. What can you do against his jab? What? He has exceptional fundamentals and a jab that can not be overcome. How do you get to him? How would Marciano/Dempsey whoever get to him? Some people just love to hate him and do everything to discredit the guy. He is arguably one of the physically strongest fighters of all time. Someone mentioned evolution.......Well 6 feet vs 6'6" is evolution I guess...or maybe its something to do with the fact that 50 years ago you couldn't find an athlete at 6 foot 6 that wouldn't tip over just walking forget about fighting... For me I'm not the one living in the fantasy world. Its you guys who believe that a 200lb man no mater how talented he might have been could beat a man who is a seasoned 6foot 6 250lb Olympic Gold Medalist who has been a trained athlete since he was in diapers, who has 60 professional wins. You my friend are the one in the fantasy world. On the subject of size. Georges St. Pierre wrestled a 270lb former hockey enforcer. And even though he won every grappling match the man had no issue admitting that "with a little bit of training Georges Laraque would have beat me"....this is despite the fact that GSP is p4p top 3 MMA fighters in the world...At some point size becomes too much...

yet you want to give wlad credit for destroying everyone when it was a completely different person doing the destroying. makes no sense. how does wlad get the accomplishments of someone else as if he did it? boxing is not a team sport. Ok, like i said he gets penalized because they are brothers..... Please name the fights you wish wlad had taken during his reign

He only fought half the division because his brother beat the hell out of the other half... Im always saying that klit bros get penalized because they are brothers... between them they have destroyed everyone in the division... Does anybody really want to see wlad vs adamek, chisora, arrealo after vitali already beat them down..... People complained when they both took turns beating down Peter but then they get complaints that they have only fought half the division,,, By the end of the year Wlad would have beaten Haye and Povetkin which in this era are their 2 biggest threats... It sucks that we will never see vitali vs wlad, but i understand why they wont fight.... yet you want to give wlad credit for destroying everyone when it was a completely different person doing the destroying. makes no sense. how does wlad get the accomplishments of someone else as if he did it? boxing is not a team sport.

dominating a division means fighting everyone. fighting half the contenders and never fighting the #1 guy is hardly dominating. He only fought half the division because his brother beat the hell out of the other half... Im always saying that klit bros get penalized because they are brothers... between them they have destroyed everyone in the division... Does anybody really want to see wlad vs adamek, chisora, arrealo after vitali already beat them down..... People complained when they both took turns beating down Peter but then they get complaints that they have only fought half the division,,, By the end of the year Wlad would have beaten Haye and Povetkin which in this era are their 2 biggest threats... It sucks that we will never see vitali vs wlad, but i understand why they wont fight....

no put him on the ATG list for sure, maybe back half of the top 10 but he hasn't earned a top 5 spot Wlad barely has any wear and tear on him though even in his KO losses, he was stopped, but not damaged he's near 40, but could easily rule for another 5 yrs if he keeps dominating like he is, he could go up on the list

It will be a long time before somebody dominates the heavy division like Wlad has.... After the klit bros are gone, the heavy division will turn into early 2000's with guys like byrd, ruiz rahman running around with titles... Wlad has been a dominant champ---No way to dispute it... He is an ATG but not top 5 dominating a division means fighting everyone. fighting half the contenders and never fighting the #1 guy is hardly dominating.

It will be a long time before somebody dominates the heavy division like Wlad has.... After the klit bros are gone, the heavy division will turn into early 2000's with guys like byrd, ruiz rahman running around with titles... Wlad has been a dominant champ---No way to dispute it... He is an ATG but not top 5

10-15 years isn't "a long ass time". And I don't take people seriously who's sum total of fight watching consists of the last 10-15 years. Get back to me when you actually acquire some knowledge of the sport's history as it isn't worth my time fencing with a kid who thinks his generation is the pinnacle of boxing. Poet Wait so you think I said my generation is the pinnacle of boxing and that I won't watch fights from before the last ten or fifteen years? Are you trolling me or are you that stupid that you're assuming something like that for no apparent reason? That's amazing. I really don't know which is more likely. Ignore list I guess. It doesn't matter which.

In other words: You're a kid. No need to take you seriously then :) I'm a grown man and Wlad's been around a long ass time. If you don't want to take me seriously based on me being in my early twenties, I won't worry about it, because I don't take you seriously if you're that irrational. Or because you're typing in purple for some reason if we picking on random things that don't have squat to do with anything.

Careful Laced, if you pwn them in their own thread they'll go ape-sh1t then put you on ignore and go ape-sh1t some more when you can't respond :hahahaha9: Poet I actually made this thread! I have put some of the trolls on ignore just to dilute the posts a little more. Don't want to waste my time replying to people who's only argument is: "Wlad would have beaten Dempsey". Funny thing is, that every time a thread on Klitschko is made, none of his fans actually state a case for why he's great they just say he is. And when you challenge them, they go into a shell or say some crazy ***** like the above quote which, even if it was true, has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on his greatness.

Sorry but can't respect anyone who puts him outside the top 10. I can name 5 or 6 fighters that would be automatic favorites against him in any era... But when I see some idiot putting Marciano and Dempsey at beating a prime Wlad I can't help but laugh... Grow up! Time's have changed. Not the point of this thread. If you believe greatness is achieved on fantasy matchups then there's no need to take you seriously. Look at the below post. Absolutely not. Even if you think he's a good enough fighter, there's no case that his career has been good enough for such distinction.

No but I got no problem with him breaking into the top ten now. He's going to get a lot more credit after he retires for what he's been doing. Everyone who's not a fan seems to want to work as hard as possible to come up with reasons why he's not doing something only a great boxer would do. And they failing for years now. Since I was a kid it's always been the minute someone hits him on the chin, the minute somebody stays aggressive with him, the minute this type or that type does this or that blah blah blah, like they haven't been trying this whole time and he just keeps dominating like a boss. Wlad's going down as one of the best heavies to do it, like it or not. This ^ Very good post :fing02:

No but I got no problem with him breaking into the top ten now. He's going to get a lot more credit after he retires for what he's been doing. Everyone who's not a fan seems to want to work as hard as possible to come up with reasons why he's not doing something only a great boxer would do. And they failing for years now. Since I was a kid it's always been the minute someone hits him on the chin, the minute somebody stays aggressive with him, the minute this type or that type does this or that blah blah blah, like they haven't been trying this whole time and he just keeps dominating like a boss. Wlad's going down as one of the best heavies to do it, like it or not.

Sorry but can't respect anyone who says >>>>> Yea man, grow up. Your 45 not 20 anymore watching Larry getting titles in the 80s. Some are just stuck in the past, and never wake up, just like...may he rest in peace Bert Sugar. Career wise I will never put Wlad in the top 5. But when it comes to a simple who beats who, I'm sorry but I can't take seriously anyone pre Ali beating a modern 250lb athletic boxer of Lewis/Wlad type.

Absolutely not. Even if you think he's a good enough fighter, there's no case that his career has been good enough for such distinction.

Sorry but can't respect anyone who puts him outside the top 10. I can name 5 or 6 fighters that would be automatic favorites against him in any era... But when I see some idiot putting Marciano and Dempsey at beating a prime Wlad I can't help but laugh... Grow up! Time's have changed.

He is easliy Top 10. Top 5 is a bit harder to place him in. Wlad just lacks that other ATG that could truly bring the best out of him. Dominance counts for something though right?

Yes everyone are entitled to their opinion. But if I say Amir Khan is the best LWW of all times, I would either be completely ignorant on the subject, delusional or very very biased. With regards to Lennox, I don't agree at all. Bowe didn't want to fight him, Tyson didn't want to fight him and Holyfield was the man they went to instead because they thought he was the lesser opponent. That's why Lennox didn't fight the elite group before late in his career. Evander even acknowledges that. Tyson gave up his WBC belt and a couple of million dollars to avoid Lennox because he "needed two or three fits to be ready". Regardless who's fault it was, it still takes away from Lennoxs legacy. But even without Holyfield and Tyson, Lennox beat pretty much every top 10 HW from 91-03 and that's a feat nobody else had managed for a long time. Guys like Tua was made out to be his biggest challenge, but he made him look like a poor sparring partner. As with everyone else, he's fought a few bums but nowhere near the same amount as Wlad and Vitali. That's partly also because the talent pool is way smaller now than it was in the 90's which is why you can't blame them entirely. But they have definitely four their fair share of fighters when someone else was way more equipped for the challenge. Wladimir is without question the most talented of the two, but Vitali has bigger balls and a way better chin, which is why I think he would win. But Wlad's resume pisses all over Vitalis. Yes it does and Klitimir's resume stinks as it is.