Points off for pushing ? a new thing ?

If I remember correctly, Mayweather lost points for pushing off Castillo in their first fight. Nice try but Floyd was using his elbow for starters. When Khan lost the points, he had used his gloves primarily to push him off. Secondly, it was more of an even up call by the ref for taking a point away from Castillo a few rounds earlier. For Khan, there was no evening up ... it was the opposite. He deducted 2 points for .... pushing! Too funny! Actually, in that fight, Floyd not only did he use his elbow, he pushed Castillo down similarly to the way Khan pushed Peterson down throughout the fight. For that neither one lost any points.

Whatever you idiot, Khan could have been disqualified for holding and pushing Peterson's head down every single round and Khan could have been disqualified for pushing Peterson back on every single break. All of these moves Khan was using were intended to gain him an unfair advantage. and im the idiot. You should be a ref mate. If you hate Khan just say it. This is about the sport and fairness.

Whatever you idiot, Khan could have been disqualified for holding and pushing Peterson's head down every single round and Khan could have been disqualified for pushing Peterson back on every single break. All of these moves Khan was using were intended to gain him an unfair advantage.

Now this isn't a Khan cry. Peterson was a warrior and deserved the win. However, I don;t agree with the points taken, whether its the rules or not is irelevent. Its what happens in fights normally that should be the standard. Now, I have nearly 2000 fights on vhs, dvd and hard drive going back to the 60's and iv'e watched them all and most at least 3-4 times and i can't for the life of me remember a fighter being docked points for pushing. Ali used to hold guys on the inside and then push them off and punch all the time. It was almost his signature move post the vietnam ban. So why now out of the blue is pushing a deductable offence ? Anyone got a fight where this has happened before ? I've heard Referees warn against pushing off several times in more recent years. Seems like a fighter shouldn't be able to ignore a warning no matter if anyone has been penalized before or not. I agree its sort of knit picking to warn against pushing off, but a fighter has to listen to the referee.

Sure he was being warned, I cant honestly remember someone even being warned for pushing off. Why was the ref on it from the start. I find it hard to believe that in a 100 years of boxing this is the worst case of pushing there's ever been. Yes its technically illegal but its been let go forever. Technically floyd's shoulder roll lean away defense is illegal because he turns his back on his opponent a little bit but its allowed because its just part of the game. If he fought Pac and lost by a point and lost 2 points for turning his back there would be outrage. You can't just crack down on one rule out of the blue. One thing about the Pushing deduction. A little shove/push is fine, the ref won't call that as long as it doesn't blatantly look like you're trying to push him across the whole ring. Should have been more careful instead repeating the same offense.

As always it will depend on the individual ref as to how much rule bending they allow, and also how it's affecting the fight. Generally if the pushing off or holding is excessive and not allowing the fight to flow you can expect deductions. Fighters have been DQ'd for excessive holding and pushing off in the past and rightfully so in most of those instances. Can't comment on this particular fight yet, i'll probably watch tonight, but if it's excessive and above all not well disguised Khan has no one to blame but himself. Dirty fighting and rule bending is a skill just like any other. Some pro fighters don't even know how to hold a guy when they are in trouble, ditto holding, pushing and dirty fighting, some guys just can't disguise it. When ? holding yes, pushing off. No one can give me an example.

Mayweather was pushing off with the elbow, not throwing MMA elbow strikes. Khan pushed off with the elbow as well which warrented a warning. The fact that it's well disguised and that he generally throws after it helps his case. He's been penalised before for excessive pushing off with the elbow in the Castillo fight (number 1) and rightfully so, as he was warned twice prior, and Castillo's inside game and strength was such that he had to do it often and wasn't able to diguise it well enough, or do it out of the refs view like usual.

I think that 2 points getting taken from Khan was fair. I would have taken the points for holding and for the blatant punch on the break. So He took them for pushing which is also a foul. So I don't mind. Khan was holding and holding Lamont's head down for no reason, headlocking and pushing, and pushing his head down while trying to turn him. On the other hand the knockdown was a no knockdown but Lamont had a knockdown called on him unfairly so. I think the ref did a good job, although I would have deducted the points for different fouls.

As always it will depend on the individual ref as to how much rule bending they allow, and also how it's affecting the fight. Generally if the pushing off or holding is excessive and not allowing the fight to flow you can expect deductions. Fighters have been DQ'd for excessive holding and pushing off in the past and rightfully so in most of those instances. Can't comment on this particular fight yet, i'll probably watch tonight, but if it's excessive and above all not well disguised Khan has no one to blame but himself. Dirty fighting and rule bending is a skill just like any other. Some pro fighters don't even know how to hold a guy when they are in trouble, ditto holding, pushing and dirty fighting, some guys just can't disguise it.

Whether it's the rule or not is irrelevant? Irrelevant? Really? What Ali did is ancient history, and yes, he should have been docked points for many things he used to do, but does that suddenly make all rules obsolete? Just because one fighter didn't get points taken off for doing it? So head butting is ok now because Hopkins gets away with it? Low blowing is perfectly fine and the rules against are irrelevant because Mares gets away with it? That's what you're arguing. Don't be such a ****ing tool mate. That is the single worst case I've heard for Khan and this fight yet. It is a rule for a reason. If it doesn't get enforced enough then that doesn't change the fact that you cannot shove someone off. It's just dangerous for one, and there were times when I thought he was going to push Peterson literally off his feet. You just can't do that. It's not an irrelevant rule, it's a bloody good one. In boxing you have to fight out, or use certain skills to get out of a clinch. Just shoving off creates too many intangibles that could go wrong. Very, very few fighters in history have shoved guys off them as blatantly as Khan did last night, and other nights. Also, if you have sooooo many fights and are such a wealth of boxing knowledge you should know that this has always been enforced in fights. I have rarely seen someone use it as blatantly as Khan did though and keep using even after been warned constantly and then have points deducted. That's the big difference. Usually fighters get warned, then stop. I have seen many, many fights in which a fighter has been warned to stop shoving off, but I have not seen many that did it so full on like Khan. 'The rules are irrelevant'. :nonono: It's good to finally see someone enforcing these lesser enforced rules because they can ruin fights when it doesn't happen. The holding behind the head is one of the worst and Khan should have been docked more points for that than the pushing even. I just love that one though. 'The rules are irrelevant because Ali also pushed'. Clearly you've never refereed or umpired sport before. A good ref or umpire will apply the rules according to what has been the standard in the sport, you dont apply the rule book literally. In soccer it's illegal to grab a shirt or nudge, hold or push a player. Yet at every corner in every league around the world defenders do this. There is never a penalty given. Now if a ref in a world cup game suddenly decides out of the blue to start giving penalties for this, is that good refereeing ? Its the rules right ? No, its not because you can't just come in and start cracking down on something that is tradionally let go. This was a world title fight, both guys were pushing the limits but there was nothing blatantly bad. Just let them fight.

It's in the rule book. I haven't seen the fight yet (my pay tv provider showed Jones vs Machida on PPV channel instead) but i suspect Khan wasn't very good at disguising the pushing he was doing, like alot of fighters who push are.

If I remember correctly, Mayweather lost points for pushing off Castillo in their first fight. That was for elbowing.

For years, I've heard people complain that "rule bending" and permissive cheating have been killing boxing. Now a ref actually has the balls to do something about it and he's branded incompetent. I do feel that the lack of a hard warning (IE; "Once more and I'll take away a point") was a very poor choice. But, all-in-all, it's a step in the right direction and I want to see more of it. Turn boxing back into a fight instead of a game.

Peterson did the exact same thing when Khan was on the ropes. Whats with you guys ignoring that? Because doing it once or twice is very different from doing it over and over and over and over and over.....despite warnings repeatedly. Maybe you missed it but Peterson got warned also. However, he wasn't holding and hitting, he wasn't shoving Khan's head down repeatedly and he wasn't elbowing him in the face. Peterson didn't stop Khan from fighting his fight by using tactics that are against the rules. Khan stopped Peterson fighting his fight by using tactics that are against the rules. Think about that for a minute. Let it slowly sink. Seems like it could take a while, but I'm sure you'll get there eventually.

Whether it's the rule or not is irrelevant? Irrelevant? Really? What Ali did is ancient history, and yes, he should have been docked points for many things he used to do, but does that suddenly make all rules obsolete? Just because one fighter didn't get points taken off for doing it? So head butting is ok now because Hopkins gets away with it? Low blowing is perfectly fine and the rules against are irrelevant because Mares gets away with it? That's what you're arguing. Don't be such a ****ing tool mate. That is the single worst case I've heard for Khan and this fight yet. It is a rule for a reason. If it doesn't get enforced enough then that doesn't change the fact that you cannot shove someone off. It's just dangerous for one, and there were times when I thought he was going to push Peterson literally off his feet. You just can't do that. It's not an irrelevant rule, it's a bloody good one. In boxing you have to fight out, or use certain skills to get out of a clinch. Just shoving off creates too many intangibles that could go wrong. Very, very few fighters in history have shoved guys off them as blatantly as Khan did last night, and other nights. Also, if you have sooooo many fights and are such a wealth of boxing knowledge you should know that this has always been enforced in fights. I have rarely seen someone use it as blatantly as Khan did though and keep using even after been warned constantly and then have points deducted. That's the big difference. Usually fighters get warned, then stop. I have seen many, many fights in which a fighter has been warned to stop shoving off, but I have not seen many that did it so full on like Khan. 'The rules are irrelevant'. :nonono: It's good to finally see someone enforcing these lesser enforced rules because they can ruin fights when it doesn't happen. The holding behind the head is one of the worst and Khan should have been docked more points for that than the pushing even. I just love that one though. 'The rules are irrelevant because Ali also pushed'. truth spoke rite here, man! seriously i dunno what ppls arguments are, khan should be allowed to get away from shots by pushing? thats not boxing. u box your way out. u should not be allowed to push a guy away everytime they get close to u. that makes no damn sense, and that was exactly what khan was doing. theres no argument for why at least one of the points wasnt a fair deduction. i think ppl hear **** on hbo and then they run with it without knowing any better. what khan was doing was *****made, that **** was so blatant as well.

If the ref says not to do something, you listen. Khan was warned, its his bad.

Now this isn't a Khan cry. Peterson was a warrior and deserved the win. However, I don;t agree with the points taken, whether its the rules or not is irelevent. Its what happens in fights normally that should be the standard. Now, I have nearly 2000 fights on vhs, dvd and hard drive going back to the 60's and iv'e watched them all and most at least 3-4 times and i can't for the life of me remember a fighter being docked points for pushing. Ali used to hold guys on the inside and then push them off and punch all the time. It was almost his signature move post the vietnam ban. So why now out of the blue is pushing a deductable offence ? Anyone got a fight where this has happened before ? Whether it's the rule or not is irrelevant? Irrelevant? Really? What Ali did is ancient history, and yes, he should have been docked points for many things he used to do, but does that suddenly make all rules obsolete? Just because one fighter didn't get points taken off for doing it? So head butting is ok now because Hopkins gets away with it? Low blowing is perfectly fine and the rules against are irrelevant because Mares gets away with it? That's what you're arguing. Don't be such a ****ing tool mate. That is the single worst case I've heard for Khan and this fight yet. It is a rule for a reason. If it doesn't get enforced enough then that doesn't change the fact that you cannot shove someone off. It's just dangerous for one, and there were times when I thought he was going to push Peterson literally off his feet. You just can't do that. It's not an irrelevant rule, it's a bloody good one. In boxing you have to fight out, or use certain skills to get out of a clinch. Just shoving off creates too many intangibles that could go wrong. Very, very few fighters in history have shoved guys off them as blatantly as Khan did last night, and other nights. Also, if you have sooooo many fights and are such a wealth of boxing knowledge you should know that this has always been enforced in fights. I have rarely seen someone use it as blatantly as Khan did though and keep using even after been warned constantly and then have points deducted. That's the big difference. Usually fighters get warned, then stop. I have seen many, many fights in which a fighter has been warned to stop shoving off, but I have not seen many that did it so full on like Khan. 'The rules are irrelevant'. :nonono: It's good to finally see someone enforcing these lesser enforced rules because they can ruin fights when it doesn't happen. The holding behind the head is one of the worst and Khan should have been docked more points for that than the pushing even. I just love that one though. 'The rules are irrelevant because Ali also pushed'.

If people are going to question whether or not the deductions were justified just do us all one favor. Name another fighter and the fight in which they pushed their opponent anywhere near as much as Khan employed the tactic last night. I out up a YouTube link in thread Ali pushes Fraser 33 times in 3 rounds twice as many as khan in the whole fight.

He should have deducted points for Khan pulling down Petersons head.This is a constant trick of Khans employed it in the Maidana Not to mention all the headlocks while Khan looked at the ref with an innocent face lol.

It's "let go" until the ref starts to zoom in on too much of it. Khan must have been warned about it at least a dozen times, before he lost a point. When he was warned ONCE, he shold have become immediately more careful not to do that. Warnings are not just warnings, they are precursors of points deductions.Peterson did the exact same thing when Khan was on the ropes. Whats with you guys ignoring that?