Does Marquez owe Pacquiao for his fame?

In short... yes. Before the first Pacquiao fight, JMM was a little known avoided featherweight boxer. He owes him for giving him a shot at getting in the spotlight. Unless you have very special talent or something that is distinguishing you from the rest, then you're going to be unknown. Just like Pacquiao owes Barrera for giving him a shot at The Ring title on short notice. And how De La Hoya gave Pacquiao a shot at being a crossover success.

Where would Marquez be without the two Pac fights? Most of the boxing world knows Marquez as "the guy who gave Pac trouble", so if Marquez had never fought Pac, where would he be in his career right now? How does a man who works his ass off in the gym owe another man credit for his fame................

Wow.......its all right Zarco, these type of Pacfans will all be gone when he retires. i'm not going anywhere. :wave:

^ Well said. They were close loses and could be argued. That said, i was well aware of marquez before the fight, but watching him come off the canvas three times in the first round and start winning rounds was something to see. I held marquez to a higher esteem after that.

Fame wise, he wouldn't have been as popular without the pac fights. It was a career defining moment and he came to fight both times. Marquez fought his ass off in those fights, he doesn't owe anything to anyone. Yes, but his career defining fights are losses. His whole point for boxing right now is to avenge his loss. Kind of a melodramatic script.

Fame wise, he wouldn't have been as popular without the pac fights. It was a career defining moment and he came to fight both times. Marquez fought his ass off in those fights, he doesn't owe anything to anyone.

and where would you be without me? where would YOU be without me?

Wow.......its all right Zarco, these type of Pacfans will all be gone when he retires. this is true, but don't forget about REY "boom boom" Bautista http://philboxing.com/news/pix/freemanpic.bautista.jpg

Know the facts before you start calling boxers names. Why the **** would he fight Manny for peanuts? Arum never made JMM a good offer to fight Manny. Stop believing the bullshit you hear on BS. Fighting for peanuts with Pac is still much more money than fighting anyone else at at WW, JWW, or LW. Marquez is a beast warrior but Nacho really screwed the business side of his career for many years. Hell after the first pac fight, pacquiao's team offered marquez a rematch and marquez corner turned it down (didn't like the offer), and in the end he fought in indonesia against chris john for about 1/4 of what he woulda made against Pac. To top it off he lost...

Even with JMM's great comeback, I still had Pacquiao winning by 4-5 points when it was all said and done. JMM has been chasing Pacquiao ever since that 2nd fight and I hope he gets another crack at him at 147. This way we can finally see who the superior fighter is between the two. Wow.......its all right Zarco, these type of Pacfans will all be gone when he retires.

The first fight was still possible to be scored for JMM? I don't think so. Unless you're the 70 year old judge with glasses as thick as rhode island who gave EVERY single round to JMM aside from the 1st then maybe. Even with JMM's great comeback, I still had Pacquiao winning by 4-5 points when it was all said and done. And no, JMM did not win the 2nd fight "plain as day." With that statement you're almost insinuating that JMM was flat out robbed in that fight which isn't the case. The fight was close, if anything the scales were tipped in pacquiao's favor because of the 1 knockdown. If JMM wants to actually have a case of beating pacquiao then he needs to find a way to stop kissing the ****ing canvas everytime they fight. I actually want to see a 3rd fight to settle the score once and for all. JMM has been chasing Pacquiao ever since that 2nd fight and I hope he gets another crack at him at 147. This way we can finally see who the superior fighter is between the two. I got Pacquiao by KO/TKO in 6/7 rds if the third fight does indeed take place. Although I wouldn't be surprised if JMM was stopped in the 1st or 2nd considering his chin seems to have gotten worse as he's climbed weight classes (evident in the Juan Diaz fight). so basically in the first fight you scored the rounds even? aside from the 1st rnd pac didn't win many. while the second fight was close...i thought marquez was the clear winner 115-112. if you can find more than 5 rounds pac won PM me...i'd be interested to know which ones. i think pac wins if they fight again.

i agree about the error in the first fight...but that fight still could have been scored for marquez..even with the knock downs. marquez won the second fight plain as day. The first fight was still possible to be scored for JMM? I don't think so. Unless you're the 70 year old judge with glasses as thick as rhode island who gave EVERY single round to JMM aside from the 1st then maybe. Even with JMM's great comeback, I still had Pacquiao winning by 4-5 points when it was all said and done. And no, JMM did not win the 2nd fight "plain as day." With that statement you're almost insinuating that JMM was flat out robbed in that fight which isn't the case. The fight was close, if anything the scales were tipped in pacquiao's favor because of the 1 knockdown. If JMM wants to actually have a case of beating pacquiao then he needs to find a way to stop kissing the ****ing canvas everytime they fight. I actually want to see a 3rd fight to settle the score once and for all. JMM has been chasing Pacquiao ever since that 2nd fight and I hope he gets another crack at him at 147. This way we can finally see who the superior fighter is between the two. I got Pacquiao by KO/TKO in 6/7 rds if the third fight does indeed take place. Although I wouldn't be surprised if JMM was stopped in the 1st or 2nd considering his chin seems to have gotten worse as he's climbed weight classes (evident in the Juan Diaz fight).

Sorry, but no. The judge in the first fight clearly admitted his error (which I still find incredibly stupid) in the first fight. There were no judging errors that I know of in the 2nd. You can cry all you want, but at the end of the day, JMM was lucky to have only 1 loss against Pacquiao in his resume when in fact there should be 2. i agree about the error in the first fight...but that fight still could have been scored for marquez..even with the knock downs. marquez won the second fight plain as day.

actually if it wasn't for stupid judges..pac would be 0-2 against jmm...1-1 at best. Sorry, but no. The judge in the first fight clearly admitted his error (which I still find incredibly stupid) in the first fight. There were no judging errors that I know of in the 2nd. You can cry all you want, but at the end of the day, JMM was lucky to have only 1 loss against Pacquiao in his resume when in fact there should be 2.

Where would Marquez be without the two Pac fights? Most of the boxing world knows Marquez as "the guy who gave Pac trouble", so if Marquez had never fought Pac, where would he be in his career right now? He might still be fighting most of his fights in mexico. When people look back at JMM's career, his two fights with Pacquiao would definitely be his high points even if he didn't win either of them. To be fair to JMM, his trainer who was also his manager/promoter at the time, was probably the main reason why JMM wasn't quite the star MAB or Morales was back in the day. Nacho just didn't put JMM in situations where the world could take notice of his talent (fighting the elite). Case in point, going to indonesia with a 20K payday against Chris John (and losing) rather than rematching Pacquiao for 200K+.

He'd be up 2-0 against JMM. For some unforeseen reason an official judge didn't know he can score a round 10-6 when a fighter is knocked down 3 times in one round. actually if it wasn't for stupid judges..pac would be 0-2 against jmm...1-1 at best.

Well where would pac be if it wasnt for them dumb fuken judges? He'd be up 2-0 against JMM. For some unforeseen reason an official judge didn't know he can score a round 10-6 when a fighter is knocked down 3 times in one round.

Where would Marquez be without the two Pac fights? Most of the boxing world knows Marquez as "the guy who gave Pac trouble", so if Marquez had never fought Pac, where would he be in his career right now? a three division champ and future hall of famer...wait he still is.

In the end, Pac fans are just mad because JMM outpointed Pac in both fights and because he goes around saying it. :lol1:

Well where would pac be if it wasnt for them dumb fuken judges? are you tallking bout the 1st fight? he could've unified the featherweight division at that time