I just don't see HOPKINS as an A.T.G.

I don't and never did think Calzaghe was that good and not as good as his groupies claim he is, and yet Hopkins couldn't beat him when Joe moved up in weight to fight him at his first fight at 175. I could probably think of a 100 fighters throughout history who have put in more work and have better resumes than Hopkins does. Why didn't Hopkins ever fight these two guys? McClellan Benn Jones gets accused of ducking them. So why doesn't Hopkins get held to the same standards? Bernard has never once beaten an A-level fighter his natural size and that's my beef with him. Really took a dump on the fans at the end of his career too outside of fighting Calzaghe and Taylor. Your argument is that Hopkins is bad because he couldn't beat Calzaghe at 175... Well, Hopkins was 43, and Calzaghe was moving into his second weight class. Sugar Ray Leonard got knocked out by Hector Camacho at middleweight when he was 41, and Camacho had started at 130. Now, using the same logic, doesn't that mean that Sugar Ray Leonard just... isn't that good?

Some retards here claim Hopkins and Jones are overrated, and claim Calzaghe is an ATG. Go figure I guess. I don't and never did think Calzaghe was that good and not as good as his groupies claim he is, and yet Hopkins couldn't beat him when Joe moved up in weight to fight him at his first fight at 175. I could probably think of a 100 fighters throughout history who have put in more work and have better resumes than Hopkins does. Why didn't Hopkins ever fight these two guys? McClellan Benn Jones gets accused of ducking them. So why doesn't Hopkins get held to the same standards? Bernard has never once beaten an A-level fighter his natural size and that's my beef with him. Really took a dump on the fans at the end of his career too outside of fighting Calzaghe and Taylor.

Exactly......... Plus, Ali lost to Trevor Berbick, and he's not even that good... how can he be a good heavyweight? God, NSB is pissing me off today.

Im not a big fan of bernard but i dont think he sucks.

Wait... am I doing something wrong then? Sugar Ray Robinson hasn't won a fight in quite a while, so I don't really rate him as an ATG. Exactly.........

Some retards here claim Hopkins and Jones are overrated, and claim Calzaghe is an ATG. Go figure I guess.

Not the ATG game. Wait... am I doing something wrong then? Sugar Ray Robinson hasn't won a fight in quite a while, so I don't really rate him as an ATG.

Yea but the name of the game is what have you done for me lately Not the ATG game.

What I gather from this thread is, Hopkins is overrated. I'm sure we can all agree on that so lets close this thread.

I've got him at the bottom half of the top 100.

Champions, I turned it into titlists. B-Hop still has 5 (Trinidad, Hoya, Tarver, Pavlik, and RJ, 7 if you count Taylor I and Calzaghe) champions on his resume which is unheard of in the modern age. That makes sense... I use them interchangeably because a champion really doesn't exist in this day and age, like it used to.

Where's the cunt who said Hopkins' MW era was as good as Hagler's and Monzon's. If it was, he wouldn't have been a 6 to 1 underdog against a newly moved up Trinidad. But yeah, Hopkins is an ATG, for what he's been able to accomplish well into his 40's at the very least.

Well, I presume this thread was set up for debate because, to me....or anyone else I've ever spoken to the question of Hopkin's "greatness" or "hall of fame worthiness" isn't up for debate. Granted, his middleweight career was a little lackluster for the most part due to the slim competition at 160 while he reigned; but it could be argued he faced better competition than did Marvin Hagler. Either way, the fact is he beat more men defending his title than did Hagler, Monzon, or even Sugar Ray Robinson....who lost the belt on 5 occassions. As far as his in-ring tactics are concerned, few boxing officianados would argue the greatness of Sandy Saddler, Willie Pepp, or Harry Greb......yet they make Hopkins look like a boyscout. Boring....well, yeah; but effective. Jack Johnson, one of the greatest heavyweights of all time would put you to sleep if you watched him today....an probably lose his share of decisons due to the shorter lengths of bouts in the 21st century, yet his greatness is not up for debate. So, like him or not, Hopkins has earned the crown to keep and the right to drink in Val Halla with the others who have proven themselves over the years. Least, that's the way I see it. Candidate for post of the year!!

Well, I presume this thread was set up for debate because, to me....or anyone else I've ever spoken to the question of Hopkin's "greatness" or "hall of fame worthiness" isn't up for debate. Granted, his middleweight career was a little lackluster for the most part due to the slim competition at 160 while he reigned; but it could be argued he faced better competition than did Marvin Hagler. Either way, the fact is he beat more men defending his title than did Hagler, Monzon, or even Sugar Ray Robinson....who lost the belt on 5 occassions. As far as his in-ring tactics are concerned, few boxing officianados would argue the greatness of Sandy Saddler, Willie Pepp, or Harry Greb......yet they make Hopkins look like a boyscout. Boring....well, yeah; but effective. Jack Johnson, one of the greatest heavyweights of all time would put you to sleep if you watched him today....an probably lose his share of decisons due to the shorter lengths of bouts in the 21st century, yet his greatness is not up for debate. So, like him or not, Hopkins has earned the crown to keep and the right to drink in Val Halla with the others who have proven themselves over the years. Least, that's the way I see it.

It seems clear to me that the ts isn't very educated when it comes to boxing!!

Where's the cunt who said Hopkins' MW era was as good as Hagler's and Monzon's. I'd like to see how Hopkin's has a greater legacy then Hagler and Monzon as well. Silly thing to say and he hasn't even tried backing it up. :nonono:

Bernard Hopkins... King of the head butt...King of the boring fights... king of the punch and clinch... This makes someone an A.T.G? Truthfully, hopkins hasnt done shit since he KOed Trinidad. This chump even screamed the silent black man rule (never let a whiteboy beat me) and LOST!!! WTF?!?!?!? Hopkins sucks to me... I'm sorry but he does. He throws 250 punches per fight and he's a serious clown. You should see him driving De La Hoyas old bentley around Delaware smh. Dude isn't that good. He loss to Jermain "Nap Nap" Taylor, should of lost to Winky, Calzaghe, and other lames... dude is ok to me. Not great. Some praise him for beating up Pavlik but come on now. Pavlik moved up in weight to fight him. Not to mention we all just learned that Pavlik is a MUMMY.- Boxing scenes own BADGUY Hopkins was an ATG before he even fought taylor.

lol I love how fans think that just because they don't like someone style, nobody else should like that style Hopkins legacy in CEMENTED! You don't have to like his style but he is respect by his peers as well as most Boxing Journalist

B.Hop deserves props. And i dont care who you are B.hop should be given more credit in boxing.. He is one of the smartest fighters to enter the ring.

i dont understand how people who claim to love and respect technical boxing can truly rate Bernard Hopkins!!! the guy is seriously not a great practitioner of the sweet science. doesnt use the jab (the left that he just pokes out there with no intention of landing was not a jab), very rarely puts 2 punches together, punch-hold is not great boxing. posturing and posing is not great boxing. De La Hoya was a far better technical boxer and thats the truth!