Leonard is regarded as one of the greatest fighters of all time. I recognize the talent and definately think he makes top 25-50 but I think he is a little overrated because he was a celebrity. Until Benitez he fought all underclassed opponents that he could have knocked out in the early round if he didn't do so much showboating. He waited to take on Hearns and then got lucky at the end. He lost to Duran the first time and won the second time because anyone that doesn't stand right in front of Duran he didn't want to fight. Lost the second bout with hearns even though he got a bs draw. And waited to fight Hagler when Hagler had 66 fights and was talking about retirement. He was also embarrasing with his fights with Norris and Camacho which he should never have been in. I think most of his wins were against fighters who were not at the top level and he could have beat them earlier but would rather showboat instead.
I would say slightly, his career was quite short even by modern standards and a great deal of his "legendary" status only came about due to his comeback against a faded Hagler. I'm not sure you could say he truly ducked Hagler given the circumstances surrounding his eye injury, but it was something similar to that. Still a great fighter especially from the skills standpoint, he can't be overrated in that regard. But like Ali his status has been tremendously bolstered simply by the fact that he was popular as much as accomplishments in the ring.
no sugar ray was great, ten times greater then floyd
Floyd has what to do with Ray?
Anyways he was not overrated easily one of the top 15 P4P fighters of all time wins over Duran x2,Hearns,Benitez,and Hagler(though controversial) make him a legend....Kind of a silly thread if you ask me
I don' see what is wrong with the thread. Great fighters can be overrated. I think that is the case with Ray.
People talk about Ray like he was some kind of God. I've seen people put him in there top 5 p4p all time rankings.
Not for mine. And don't give me the "you haven't seen enough of Ray's fights" bullshit. I got the career set and I have seen all the fights, several multiple times. Sure he has a tremendous resume and he is an ATG, but that can be a little deceptive sometimes. He should definately have a loss against Hearns for one, the second fight was only a draw if you don't have any eyes. Many, many people have him losing to a fading Hagler as well.
Basically, I'm not saying Leonard was not a tremendous fighter, he was. But even tremendous fighters can be overrated.
Ray can be placed in the top 10. At least top 15. And him and Hearns were washed up ny the 2nd fight. And him and Hagler were considered fading...and the fight was at 160. Ray's best weight was 147.
Only knock on Ray is maybe his D cudda been better.
so you think he was great ,and as far as cotto i like cotto,:boxing: but pacman will beat him im sorry dude but he will.
LOL okay, make a thread and explain to us how that happens. No offense, but you don't know about boxing as a sport.
I don' see what is wrong with the thread. Great fighters can be overrated. I think that is the case with Ray.
People talk about Ray like he was some kind of God. I've seen people put him in there top 5 p4p all time rankings.
Not for mine. And don't give me the "you haven't seen enough of Ray's fights" bullshit. I got the career set and I have seen all the fights, several multiple times. Sure he has a tremendous resume and he is an ATG, but that can be a little deceptive sometimes. He should definately have a loss against Hearns for one, the second fight was only a draw if you don't have any eyes. Many, many people have him losing to a fading Hagler as well.
Basically, I'm not saying Leonard was not a tremendous fighter, he was. But even tremendous fighters can be overrated.
no sugar ray was great, ten times greater then floyd
That is not too hard to do now adays when Floyd hand-picks his opponents always asking them to move up in weight or fighting the weakest of fighters in each division to protect that 0. Baldy and Zab is for examples, and then he stays in that weight class on purpose to get hatton to move up to it because he knows its at a huge advantage to him since Hatton looked terrible at 147.
Marquez is floyds next victim, another hand-picked opponent who has never even fought as high as 144 in his life... What a joke match-up, he is using marquezs name on his resume to make it look good but it just looks padded to a professional or any boxing fan who isn't casual.
just watch sugar rays old fights ,he was good but not great. he was a class act ill give him:boxing: that thats rare today.
Then who is your opinion was great?
i think robinson is way overrated
leonard also
i mean he was clearly given 2 gifts and that woulda totally diminished his status
No wonder your red:wow: