How many agree Tyson peaked with Spinks and then went on the decline?

I've always thought and said that when a fighter is no longer mentally and physically at his best, that counts as his decline no matter how old. Two fighters I think we never actually got to see them at their best, or what should have been their best, was Ali and Tyson. Ali was forced into exile and missed years of what should have been prime/peak years and Tyson threw it away in his early 20's by not being able to deal with the many issues outside of the ring and entrusting the wrong people with handling his career. 25-29 years of age should have been their best years if they had stayed the course and were able to stay active with proper training. With Ali, he was in the Muslim cult, while Tyson was in the Don King cult; but what Ali had over Tyson was that he stuck with his whitey :) in Dundee while Tyson got rid of his in Rooney. This is part of one of the documentaries done on Tyson. The Man talking at 1:07 on, is Jack Newfield... http://www.jacknewfield.com/ It's good to watch the whole thing but pay attention to 1:07 on.

Chris Rock on his show had Don King as a guest. I remember Chris asking Don about Tyson by saying something like: What happened to Mike Tyson? One moment Tyson is Champion of the World and the next thing I know, he is with you and he is on the ground trying to pick up his mouth piece. Extra info: Jack on Tyson is to blame...and interesting thoughts by Tyson 4:00 on...

Comments (12)

Ishy_Aytan

Luckily for you we are talking about Reason(s) and not excuses. Writers, Historians, Trainers, and Boxers have used the "Rooney" reason as to what helped Mike fall. "Helped" since it was still on Mike of course. Point being: Without Rooney, he didn't train properly and it wasn't the same person. Think of it like this: Buy a Formula-1 Ferrari...are you going to get Joe Blow from your neighborhood mechanic shop to work on that car and then have some kid from the street drive your car or are you going to have the best people involved on that car? Totally agree. Great post.

17y ago

Benny_Leonard

I hate excuses when fighters lose Luckily for you we are talking about Reason(s) and not excuses. Writers, Historians, Trainers, and Boxers have used the "Rooney" reason as to what helped Mike fall. "Helped" since it was still on Mike of course. Point being: Without Rooney, he didn't train properly and it wasn't the same person. Think of it like this: Buy a Formula-1 Ferrari...are you going to get Joe Blow from your neighborhood mechanic shop to work on that car and then have some kid from the street drive your car or are you going to have the best people involved on that car?

17y ago

Benny_Leonard

Thats what makes Ali greater than Tyson, he was mentally stronger and had more heart Agree. I've always considered Ali above Tyson for those reasons. In a weird way, and this is basing it on what Tyson and others have said; I think Tyson's strength was in D'Amato, Jacobs, and even Rooney. If they said he could do it, he believed he could do it. While Ali had family and ALLAH. Religion can be a key help in increasing belief in oneself. I'm not sure Tyson ever bought into religion like that although he did buy into King and it took him down.

17y ago

Benny_Leonard

Yes. And beating a decent "not exceptional" boxer who was a natural light heavy weight and old proves that Tyson was one of the most overrated boxers in history. He never once beat anyone great and lost all of his big fights. He looked good beating complete nobodies. That was his mark to fame. Funny because Rocky Marciano fought a bunch of past prime LHs and is considered top 10 by many. At least Tyson beat a HOF LH in Michael Spinks that beat a legit 200+ pound HW Champion in Larry Holmes to capture the title. Spinks was also undefeated when he fought Tyson and not shot. It's hard to win when you are not Mentally and Physically prepared. Without Rooney, he was neither; that's the point. However, we may never know how well he would have done if he had stayed the course and with Rooney. Again, it's much easier to lose when you are not preparing properly. Someone of Tyson's size needs to be sharp every time out...and he wasn't. Even after he was on the decline and on his way to jail, he did batter Ruddock who would later claim that Tyson and him beat each other up so bad that he {Razor} felt that neither could be in their prime afterwards.

17y ago

UnDeniable

Thats what makes Ali greater than Tyson, he was mentally stronger and had more heart

17y ago

MANGLER

That was the best he ever was in terms of his career, but not necessarily his best individual performance. Even tho it turned out he wasn't at his best anymore, comin back from 3 yrs in the pen to KO 2 titlists back to back was impressive, even tho Seldon and Bruno ain't that good.

17y ago

ACHlLLES

I hate excuses when fighters lose

17y ago

Mud

Difficult to tell how good a fighter is in 91 seconds. But yes, that was his last great performance, after that against Bruno he was wild and reckless. I thought the first knockdown against Spinks were two of the best punches ive seen, the body shot and uppercut. Just perfect.

17y ago

Davros

17y ago

Abstraction

Had Mike Tyson's career progressed like any other normal HW. He could possibly have been No.1 of all time. But i dont think there is any other boxer that has had the same sort of chaotic problems outside the ring. Nearly every so often his manager died, and the day Don King influenced Tyson to sack Keven Rooney, his Career was over. In that video "Benny Leonard", even guys like Larry Merchant says it how it is: The guy surrounded him were Semi-Professionals, Another guy says how he stopped preparing properly for his fights. It was a Train-Wreck waiting to happen

17y ago

Squirrel

It was definitely his peak performance, though it certainly wasn't his definitive peak. It's all what-ifs, buts and maybes, but i'm adamant that he could have gotten a LOT better. I think one of the biggest tragedies is that we never really saw what a prime Mike Tyson was like, he fell of the rails before he reached that point (imo).

17y ago

Silencers

The Spinks fight was definitely Tyson at his best.

17y ago