The Best Ever...

=The Wire;2336992]Good wins but Toney was weight drained and Hopkins wasnt the fighter he became. Toney I understand, but like others say when you talk about other fighters in similar situations for example(s): Old, inactive, injured Tszyu lost to Hatton. Tyson wasn't motivated anymore when he lost to Douglas; Douglas refused the rematch. Lewis wasn't in shape for Rahman. Toney also doesn't really have the style to beat Roy. Roy could move around all day on Toney, who is more stationary who relies on countering. For Hopkins, he lost, fair and square. The fact that he never chased Jones Jr. shows you he (Bernard) knew he could not beat him. He was the number #1 rated fighter at the time, no excuses. Even Roy was not the same against Tarver and Johnson. The man lost his legs coming down in weight, plus age showed before he even moved up with him becoming less and less active in his fights. Hopkins beats a deflated Tarver, same as what happened to Jones Jr.; glad that happened to Tarver because it showed him the negative of trying to lose muscle weight in your mid 30's.

Floyd ran too much to be the best ever. he Boxed.....

I dont understand how he ran? how? he was moving in circles,i didnt see him run atall,he let Oscar get him on the ropes and let go,then moved back to circling with his jab,i think people are forgetting this was Floyds 1ST fight at light middle BTW,give Floyd the Reyes gloves,give him the small ring,give him the weight,he STILL wins,hes one of the greats,SRR is the best ever,but Floyd is a legend,even SRL said,if Floyd beats Oscar,THATS his stamp to greatness Very Well Said!

Roy beat Hopkins and Toney, that should put him ahead or near them, no? Marciano didn't beat any "Great" fighter in his prime, yet he is counted as an all time great. Good wins but Toney was weight drained and Hopkins wasnt the fighter he became.

Exactly think of Willie Pep...... How many people on this forum (the most hardcore boxing fans) even still mention Willie? He is in the minority of past lengeds mentioned on a hardcore boxing forum. Which means he is even less mentioned in the complete boxing community where there are casual fans and true die hards. Think of Roy Jones Jr. he was the p4p king he said he proclaimed and HBO backed him up on it, but now there is doubts to his legacy because of his inability to make fights that people demanded happen. He went from the possibility of being one of the greatest fighters fighters ever, to he was good but his greatness is a ? P.S. hitting and moving is different than running, and yes floyd does both. I understand what you are getting at, but how many people mention any of the old timers like Sam Langford or even my boy Benny Leonard? Roy beat Hopkins and Toney, that should put him ahead or near them, no? Marciano didn't beat any "Great" fighter in his prime, yet he is counted as an all time great.

I dont think fighters that are to be considered the best ever leave as many doubts to their supremecy, and tons of fights that people demanded on the table, on top of that the best ever dont make their last fight a simply a money affair while still being undefeated I think Floyd will go the Whitaker way in that people will talk about him every now and then and talk about how great his defence was.... but that is all. He will essentially be nearly forgotten in a couple of decades and how he ranks among the greatest ever. I think the Sport tells you when you've done enough, you dont tell the sport imo. I agree. I dont like how PBF says 10 years from now people will see me as the best ever. Its as if he is trying to get that in our subconscious because he is worried he will be forgotten. Essientially letting us know how he hopes he will have a lasting legacy. In this sport you get remembered for thefights you were in and who you have beaten. DLH 6 weight champ. PBF 5 weight. So DLH has done better. How can PBF say he is the best ever when DLH has achieved more and beaten more people.

What about Willie Pep? I haven't seen a bunch of Pep's fights, but enough to see his style, and he made a living of hitting and moving...yet, he is a "Legend" At least Floyd knocked people out at a higher rate and moved up many times in weight, making it difficult to stand in front of his bigger opponents. I am not sure Pep ever moved up in weight, although talent in his division might have been greater. who else is there to fight that people would pay to see and give him legacy points? You can't keep asking him to move up in weight, while others make themselves "Legends" by staying in one place. Floyd is better than Morales, Pac, Barrera, who will probably be considered all time greats: all would lose to Floyd when Floyd was at 130's. Exactly think of Willie Pep...... How many people on this forum (the most hardcore boxing fans) even still mention Willie? He is in the minority of past lengeds mentioned on a hardcore boxing forum. Which means he is even less mentioned in the complete boxing community where there are casual fans and true die hards. Think of Roy Jones Jr. he was the p4p king he said he proclaimed and HBO backed him up on it, but now there is doubts to his legacy because of his inability to make fights that people demanded happen. He went from the possibility of being one of the greatest fighters fighters ever, to he was good but his greatness is a ? P.S. hitting and moving is different than running, and yes floyd does both.

I dont think fighters that are to be considered the best ever leave as many doubts to their supremecy, and tons of fights that people demanded on the table, on top of that the best ever dont make their last fight a simply a money affair while still being undefeated Did Mayweather run at times, Definitely he did, Did De La Hoya need a lesson in cutting off the ring? Without a Doubt. Both fighters seemed deficient and in my opinion did nothing for either fighter's legacy. I think Floyd will go the Whitaker way in that people will talk about him every now and then and talk about how great his defence was.... but that is all. He will essentially be nearly forgotten in a couple of decades and how he ranks among the greatest ever. I think the Sport tells you when you've done enough, you dont tell the sport imo. What about Willie Pep? I haven't seen a bunch of Pep's fights, but enough to see his style, and he made a living of hitting and moving...yet, he is a "Legend" At least Floyd knocked people out at a higher rate and moved up many times in weight, making it difficult to stand in front of his bigger opponents. I am not sure Pep ever moved up in weight, although talent in his division might have been greater. who else is there to fight that people would pay to see and give him legacy points? You can't keep asking him to move up in weight, while others make themselves "Legends" by staying in one place. Floyd is better than Morales, Pac, Barrera, who will probably be considered all time greats: all would lose to Floyd when Floyd was at 130's.

I dont think fighters that are to be considered the best ever leave as many doubts to their supremecy, and tons of fights that people demanded on the table, on top of that the best ever dont make their last fight a simply a money affair while still being undefeated Did Mayweather run at times, Definitely he did, Did De La Hoya need a lesson in cutting off the ring? Without a Doubt. Both fighters seemed deficient and in my opinion did nothing for either fighter's legacy. I think Floyd will go the Whitaker way in that people will talk about him every now and then and talk about how great his defence was.... but that is all. He will essentially be nearly forgotten in a couple of decades and how he ranks among the greatest ever. I think the Sport tells you when you've done enough, you dont tell the sport imo. nah most people after couple of decade look nicer even though at there era people hated them and questioned there legacy at sometimes

I dont think fighters that are to be considered the best ever leave as many doubts to their supremecy, and tons of fights that people demanded on the table, on top of that the best ever dont make their last fight a simply a money affair while still being undefeated Did Mayweather run at times, Definitely he did, Did De La Hoya need a lesson in cutting off the ring? Without a Doubt. Both fighters seemed deficient and in my opinion did nothing for either fighter's legacy. I think Floyd will go the Whitaker way in that people will talk about him every now and then and talk about how great his defence was.... but that is all. He will essentially be nearly forgotten in a couple of decades and how he ranks among the greatest ever. I think the Sport tells you when you've done enough, you dont tell the sport imo.

Mayweather isnt a great.He's close to a great,but not yet. 2 more big fights and he gets my nod.

To be the best ever you have to be a heavyweight imo...

He's currently great

Floyd is probably one of the best fighters of this generation for sure, and could be considered an all time great, but not the best ever. If he were to fight a few more top notch opponents then maybe, but IMO, I hate to say this but to be considered an all time great I think you have to have enertainment value as well. I am not a Floyd hater I appreciate his skills and how outboxes the crap out of everybody, but I wouldn't consider him the best ever. same here with you I think Floyd is the best p4p of this generation and ATG but not the best ATG

I dont understand how he ran? how? he was moving in circles,i didnt see him run atall,he let Oscar get him on the ropes and let go,then moved back to circling with his jab,i think people are forgetting this was Floyds 1ST fight at light middle BTW,give Floyd the Reyes gloves,give him the small ring,give him the weight,he STILL wins,hes one of the greats,SRR is the best ever,but Floyd is a legend,even SRL said,if Floyd beats Oscar,THATS his stamp to greatness I agree 100%, I fuckin' hate when people say Floyd runs, Floyd dodges, bumps & circles, you want to see running, watch the second half of DLH/Trinidad. Now I'll be the first to admit early on in his career Floyd could hit you & be across the ring before you noticed but that was a long time ago. Everytime out everyone always says "Judah/Baldomir/De La Hoya is gonna hand him his first loss" but when it doesn't happen people start discrediting the fighter they had pined their hopes on(Judah was too unfocused, Baldomir was too slow, & I'm sure DLH's too old). IMHO DLH fought as hard as he could, & Mayweather looked just as good against one of the greatest boxers of my generation as he did against those so called "bums" he fought before, so give the man some respect.

http://assets.espn.go.com/photo/2007/0505/box_g_floyd_oscar_412.jpg That's all for now... No, he's one of them probably. But no, no no he's not better than Roy in my book. Not yet at least. Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!

Its funny how the guy moves to a new weight and comes into the fight 4-6 pounds UNDER the limit, Uses gloves that risk injuring his hands, and Fights in a smaller ring than usual, but you people still hate. Give the man his fucking due. Oscar was bigger, stronger and had EVERY tangible advantage set up in his favor and still couldn't beat Floyd. Sorry to tell some of you, but circling your opponent is a staple of boxing. If you don't like it then go watch some UFC shit. You got the opportunity to see two of the greatest fighters in our era fight a very skilled and close BOXING match and you're still complaining? Floyd is the best "BOXER" to come along in a while. If you don't like his style of fighting then you don't like boxing. I agree that Floyd should get his due. I thought the judges had it just right. Close win, not the beating of Oscar that was promised, but a win. I think he won it in scared fashion and then talked himself up afterwards, but he did win. Also - Oscar was spot-on in his post fight where he said "if I didn't press, there was no fight." Floyd didn't run, he grabbed, ducked, and put himself in a position to not be hit that didn't involve a lot of skill. Speed, yes. Skill, no. Now, on to the reason for the quote - "every tangible advantage" for Oscar would result in HIM being the legal betting favorite. He wasn't, even at a higher weight. Lets give Floyd his due, yes, but lets not overtalk the victory.

Mayweather's a great fighter but to say he's the greatest of all time in pretty ridiculous. Hagler, Duran, Robinson, Leonard, Ali, Armstrong, Pep, Langford, Louis, Monzon all accomplished much more. He is not a five weight world champion, he's a five weight belt holder. He's a three weight world champion, which is an absolutely fantastic achievement but at this point you cannot call him the greatest of all time, and if you're doing it based on last night's perfomance then that, frankly, is one of the most absurd comments I have ever heard. I thought he would do it a lot easier than he did last night, and if you don't believe me my prediction is available at top class boxing.co.uk, big fight predictions, jamie's predictions. I thought he would dominate the second half of the fight, and he didnt. The greatest of all time would do. Let's not forget, Mosley defeated a prime DLH - Mayweather has not. He's a superb fighter, he can be sublime to watch in the ring. I really hope he goes on as fights against Cotto, Hatton, Mosley and Margarito can show us what he's made of to an even greater extent. He may have the skills to be remembered in the top ten of all time but he needs to keep fighting. So far I don't think he's accomplised enough.

I thought we were talking "All time"??? Heavyweights today, :ugh: nobody. Maybe Wlad, but that is about it; they are terrible to watch. If we were talking all time then I just took you out of context. My apologies. :tapedshut

You just named the past heavyweights...name some good heavyweights now...:banana: I thought we were talking "All time"??? Heavyweights today, :ugh: nobody. Maybe Wlad, but that is about it; they are terrible to watch.