Who should be P4P best Pac or Floyd?

if pac beats EM dis nov. and floyd not fighting dis year IMO pac should be the mo.1 lb 4 lb

He may have faced the best comp, but he hasnt beaten the bnest comp. Win against Barrera, draw with jmm and 1-1 with Morales. It doesn't matter that he lost to EM, he came back and battered him. SRR lost, SRL lost, Ali lost. Losses happen at the highest level. He should rematch JMM as I think his overall game has improved significantly since their draw. It's about proving your skill at the highest level, and Pac's shown he's capable of beating that level of fighter. Floyd hasn't for a very long time (arguably not at all) and certainly not at the weights he's currently campaining at. And he's 1-1 with Castillo :p

That's just plain wrong. He's fought absolutely the best opponents available to him, 2 of which are probably all time top 10 in their divisions. They may have been slightly past their peak but they were still closer to their primes than Mosley or DLH will be when/if Floyd fights them. He may have faced the best comp, but he hasnt beaten the bnest comp. Win against Barrera, draw with jmm and 1-1 with Morales.

You missed my initial posts in which I broke down Floyd's accomplishments. But that wasn't good enough for some people and they decided to try and belittle what Floyd did recently. So I just wanted to point out that Pac hasn't fought the best competition either in the last few years. Plus one of my points for having Floyd ahead is that Floyd never lost, Pac has lost and had a draw. And yes, imo Floyd was much more impressive at that weight. No doubt Corrales and Castillo are a slight step below Morales and Barerra career wise, but imo, Castillo and Corrales were fighting better at the time Floyd beat them as compared to when Pac beat Barerra and Morales. Don't get me wrong I love Pac and have him rated #3 in my p4p rankings. I just think people bash Floyd too much without turning that same lens to other fighters. That's just plain wrong. He's fought absolutely the best opponents available to him, 2 of which are probably all time top 10 in their divisions. They may have been slightly past their peak but they were still closer to their primes than Mosley or DLH will be when/if Floyd fights them. If Floyd wants his legacy he should make the fights with elite prime fighters, not guys 4 years past their prime. He's not a big name so he needs to re-assess his worth and stop offering chump change, then maybe people will take up the offers. There's more than enough money to go around for the big fights like Hatton, Cotto, etc so there's no need for his twisted take on what the split should be.

Are you as fool or not kid. If you wanna base p4p on mere skill. Then let's use a little common sense. Something you clearly don't have. How can you test the level of your skill if you can't test it on p4p greats. Who has PBF faced that is worthy of mention as of late. NONE. He ducked Marga, and if you're still in denial that he didn't you better rattle your brains. And now PBF is fighting another bum in Baldo. Yuck! What has gotten into you. Following your logic, then p4p is nothing more than a crap fucktard barometer of who's got the moves. Using a lil common sense. Skill is most proven if you go up against p4p greats and beat them so bad, they become chickens after the fight. Take a look at how bad Barrera became one. After a "green" PAC beat him up, he never wanted to face PAC again and with good reason. PBF is a ducker. p4p is based on the level of skill, but skill isn't tested when you go up against bums. Something PBF has been doing the last couple of years. Skill is proven against top level competition and not against bums. Now if you still can't understand the meaning of that lil common sense. Then you're a hopeless case. Good post.

Last I checked p4p was a measure of who is the best boxer assuming a standard weight. Floyd's level of competition recently surely doesn't match Pac's, but his skills are undoubtedly greater. So I have Floyd #1. Whether I like his career strategy is a different story. Pac should be #3 behind Floyd and Winky. Are you as fool or not kid. If you wanna base p4p on mere skill. Then let's use a little common sense. Something you clearly don't have. How can you test the level of your skill if you can't test it on p4p greats. Who has PBF faced that is worthy of mention as of late. NONE. He ducked Marga, and if you're still in denial that he didn't you better rattle your brains. And now PBF is fighting another bum in Baldo. Yuck! What has gotten into you. Following your logic, then p4p is nothing more than a crap fucktard barometer of who's got the moves. Using a lil common sense. Skill is most proven if you go up against p4p greats and beat them so bad, they become chickens after the fight. Take a look at how bad Barrera became one. After a "green" PAC beat him up, he never wanted to face PAC again and with good reason. PBF is a ducker. p4p is based on the level of skill, but skill isn't tested when you go up against bums. Something PBF has been doing the last couple of years. Skill is proven against top level competition and not against bums. Now if you still can't understand the meaning of that lil common sense. Then you're a hopeless case.

the point is, you're trying to bring down one fighter's accomplishments to prove another fighter is better. why not explain your p4p list by merits? why pull others down? this p4p is all opinion and imaginary as the fights won't happen. why belittle pac's achievements? can you name anyone else in that weight class who could have done what he did? :rolleyes: You missed my initial posts in which I broke down Floyd's accomplishments. But that wasn't good enough for some people and they decided to try and belittle what Floyd did recently. So I just wanted to point out that Pac hasn't fought the best competition either in the last few years. Plus one of my points for having Floyd ahead is that Floyd never lost, Pac has lost and had a draw. And yes, imo Floyd was much more impressive at that weight. No doubt Corrales and Castillo are a slight step below Morales and Barerra career wise, but imo, Castillo and Corrales were fighting better at the time Floyd beat them as compared to when Pac beat Barerra and Morales. Don't get me wrong I love Pac and have him rated #3 in my p4p rankings. I just think people bash Floyd too much without turning that same lens to other fighters.

Personally, I have Wright on my P4P list ahead of Pac, Pac is third.

Also think about what a fight would look like between a prime Floyd at 130 and a prime Pac. Floyd wins easily imo. He wouldn't let Manny land the big left hand and if you saw the JMM fight you know Manny has problems when you take away his big weapon. Floyd is simply a much more diversified boxer so I give him or Winky the p4p crown. the point is, you're trying to bring down one fighter's accomplishments to prove another fighter is better. why not explain your p4p list by merits? why pull others down? this p4p is all opinion and imaginary as the fights won't happen. why belittle pac's achievements? can you name anyone else in that weight class who could have done what he did? :rolleyes:

Also think about what a fight would look like between a prime Floyd at 130 and a prime Pac. Floyd wins easily imo. He wouldn't let Manny land the big left hand and if you saw the JMM fight you know Manny has problems when you take away his big weapon. Floyd is simply a much more diversified boxer so I give him or Winky the p4p crown.

How did you score it? or How did Sanchez got penalized? Be honest . Have you seen the fight? Anyone who saw that fight, wether your a Pacfan or Pachater knows that PAc should've won that fight or Sanchez' dirty ass shoul've been DQ'ed. I had the fight scored 4-2 Pac but Pac winning more easily because of the deductions. But I wasn't the judge scoring the fight so what does it matter what I thought happened. The fact is that it was ruled a draw and Guzman KO'd Sanchez in the next fight. Sanchez could have fought dirty against Guzman but he didn't or it didn't affect Guzman (this fight I did not see). On the other hand, I don't think the fight was scored a draw because the judges don't like Pac or something. Floyd's closest fight was against Castillo and it was ruled a win. Sure I might have thought Castillo won but it was ruled a victory for Floyd. Floyd's record is still unblemished while Pac has a few blemishes. Factor out that draw and he still lost to Morales in the 1st fight and couldn't beat JMM even though he floored him 3 times in the first round (and yes this was another badly scored fight but Pac should have KO'd him in the 1st or 2nd and the fight wouldn't have gone to the cards).

Pac because he fights more and better opponents.....

If Floyd can beat King Kong more convincingly than Pac did, then he deserves #1. I doubt it though, PBF won't even get past Donkey Kong IMO. Thoughts? http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a197/gorilya/packong.jpg call me chlidish but thats the greatest sig ever :D

And crowd reaction should by no means be how fights are scored. Fans cheer for whoever won the last round regardless of who is winning the fight. And its not like the fight was in Dominican Republic, it was in San Francisco. How did you score it? or How did Sanchez got penalized? Be honest . Have you seen the fight? Anyone who saw that fight, wether your a Pacfan or Pachater knows that PAc should've won that fight or Sanchez' dirty ass shoul've been DQ'ed.

And crowd reaction should by no means be how fights are scored. Fans cheer for whoever won the last round regardless of who is winning the fight. And its not like the fight was in Dominican Republic, it was in San Francisco.

WATCH THE FIGHT!! And listen to the BOOOOOOOOOOO's from the crowd after the decision was announced. .! That's all I can say. So it was a bad decision but it still is a draw. If he had KO'd the guy or won more decisively he would have won. Its not as if Sanchez was unbeatable at this point... Guzman KO'd him in his next fight. Don't get me wrong Guzman is a really good fighter and Pac is a great fighter, but I just have Floyd at #1 because there are no bad decisions or off nights on his record.

Regardless of your opinions about how the fight was going the FACT is that it was scored a draw and 2 points were deducted from Sanchez. Personally I think Marty Denkin is a pretty solid judge and he had Pac losing by 2 points (he scored it a draw). I think I am pretty familiar with the fight. WATCH THE FIGHT!! And listen to the BOOOOOOOOOOO's from the crowd after the decision was announced. .! That's all I can say.

Obviously, you haven't seen the Sanchez fight. PAC was robbed in that fight. PAc was up ahead by two or three points by the the end of 5th plus the 2 points deduction from Sanchez for being dirty.(He's lucky coz he should've been disqualified). Please get your facts straight first before you post like you know what your talking about. :cool: Regardless of your opinions about how the fight was going the FACT is that it was scored a draw and 2 points were deducted from Sanchez. Personally I think Marty Denkin is a pretty solid judge and he had Pac losing by 2 points (he scored it a draw). I think I am pretty familiar with the fight.

Let me tell you why I bring it up... Floyd has NEVER lost. Say what you want about him but he is still undefeated. Also you didn't mention Pac's loss to Morales which was recent or his draw to Sanchez after 2 point deductions (the fight was stopped in the 6th round so Sanchez was ahead 4-2) or that he hasn't fought the best competition. Bottom line Barerra was a great win but I don't see any other marquee wins. Morales II...Morales had just lost to Raheem so I don't think you can say he was at the top of his game especially because he had to fight so hard to make weight. Who else has Pac beaten? 3K Battery coming off of a draw? Floyd's opposition of late hasn't been top notch but for me to knock him from #1 I have to see his skills decline or see him lose. I haven't seen either. BTW if you have Winky as #1 I have no issue with that. Obviously, you haven't seen the Sanchez fight. PAC was robbed in that fight. PAc was up ahead by two or three points by the the end of 5th plus the 2 points deduction from Sanchez for being dirty.(He's lucky coz he should've been disqualified). Please get your facts straight first before you post like you know what your talking about. :cool:

First off, no he did not. Secondly, Trinidad had retired, and come back with one pretty good preformance against Mayorga. Winky decisioned him at middleweight, while his original weight was 147. Mosley, coming off two decision losses against Forrest and a bullshit win against Oscar, was fighting at 154, while in his prime he was fighitng at 135. Taylor Wright was a good preformace that ended, probably rightly so, in a draw. These wins are not nearly as impressive as victories over Castillo twice, and undefeated Corrales, Jesus Chavez (who had one SD loss in his fifth fight) and Genaro Hernandez (only loss to DLH) Obviously we are gonna have to agree to disagree, and Winky didn't just decision Trinidad he completely shut him down. He may have been retired but it's not like he was old or battle worn like a Vargas. He lost one fight to Hopkins who we all know what he has done. Regrdless he completely dominated Tito. Welterweight was not Tito's best weight I would have to go with 154. He struggled to make 147, and still carried his power to middle. I think it was to much weight for him, but he was still legit. Your right Shanes best weight was 135, but he was still a world class fighter. I agree that Shanes win over Oscar was bullshit. The point I am making is that Winky has consistantly taken on elite competition and never picked a chose his fights because they were safe or afraid to take a risk. You think moving up to fight the bigger stronger Taylor wasn't a risk. He took the fight and didn't worry that it could be a tough fight or that he would possibly lose. Once again you are talking about fights that Floyd fought years ago. What has he done lately to deserve being cosidered p4p. Of course Floyd fan are gonna always say what he has done is more significant than any other fighter and thats what bothers me about some PBF fans. You'll act like this guy is GOD and has no weaknesses. You'll are unable to crticisize anything he does and unable to be completely objective. I'm not saying the guy isn't good and has potential to be the one of the best fighters of all time, but he hasn't done anything lately to be anointed GOD. he can have all the skill in the world but if he doesn't use it against the best what good is that. Like I said we will just have to agree to disagree.