Erik Morales:Hall of Fame or not?

No Doubt he is a Hall of Famer

He should definately be in! No question!

the one who started the thread is new in boxing and i think EM is HOF definitely

I cannot believe anyone is asking this question Barrera and Morales are first ballot

i have a feeling he refused to fight other black fighters for money reasons more than him ducking them. all the whites wanted to see a white man beat him for one thing. he did fight some black fighters. you make it sound as if he never did, but that's not accurate. and if he did refuse to fight black fighters was he really doing anything that any of the other white heavyweights had done around that time? jack dempsey also refused to fight any black fighters after he became champ. and dempsey beat jess willard for his title. willard of course beat jack johnson. that doesn't make it right for jack johnson either, so please don't take it as an excuse, just pointing out that. It is accurate that he refused to fight black fighters once he had the title and you can look it up. Give me a few and I'll get you a link. Manny Steward even spoke a bit about it in a fightnews article a while back when they were asking trainers about the greatest hws of all time.

well, my first statement said that, he was the first black hw champ but beyond that he really did more harm than good by refusing to fight black fighters after he had the title. And I never said that he was not a good fighter for the time, I simply said that he fought sub par competition. i have a feeling he refused to fight other black fighters for money reasons more than him ducking them. all the whites wanted to see a white man beat him for one thing. he did fight some black fighters. you make it sound as if he never did, but that's not accurate. and if he did refuse to fight black fighters was he really doing anything that any of the other white heavyweights had done around that time? jack dempsey also refused to fight any black fighters after he became champ. and dempsey beat jess willard for his title. willard of course beat jack johnson. that doesn't make it right for jack johnson either, so please don't take it as an excuse, just pointing out that.

greatly overused? i totally disagree. go down the street and ask random people who are robinson, dempsey, tyson, ali, joe louis, jack johnson. i bet 9 out of 10 of them don't know jack johnson. everyone else i named is way more overused than jack johnson. you're absolutely right that he wasnt as good of a fighter as anyone else from that list. i do think he is hall of fame worthy regardless. he was basically the first black athlete wasn't he? i can think of nobody before him. well, my first statement said that, he was the first black hw champ but beyond that he really did more harm than good by refusing to fight black fighters after he had the title. And I never said that he was not a good fighter for the time, I simply said that he fought sub par competition.

well, jack johnson is greatly over-used and if anyone doesn't know who he is they are either illiterate or a mouth-breather whether they like boxing or not. my point was all about boxing and good boxing is not something you find in johnson's fights unfortunately. Johnson wasn't a bum of course, but all you'll find on tape is him vs bums and old fighters. I just suggested better sources. greatly overused? i totally disagree. go down the street and ask random people who are robinson, dempsey, tyson, ali, joe louis, jack johnson. i bet 9 out of 10 of them don't know jack johnson. everyone else i named is way more overused than jack johnson. you're absolutely right that he wasnt as good of a fighter as anyone else from that list. i do think he is hall of fame worthy regardless. he was basically the first black athlete wasn't he? i can think of nobody before him.

whatever, it is still a very good subject for boxing history. and i think he was more than just a mere sideshow. he had to agree to carry many of those white fighters several rounds to be allowed to even fight them. he was an important historical figure and very important to boxing. he helped pave the way for other black athletes. and somehow managed to not get killed even though he was known to sleep with white women. they just made an award winning movie about f'n jim braddock, a bum. if they can do that and try making braddock seem like something he wasn't, then someone can write a paper about jack johnson. however really my point was just to try finding any fighter that actually has a lot of reputable sources written about him. and someone who isnt too overused. like it would be stupid to write a paper about ali right now unless you had a totally fresh angle. which, you probably don't. well, jack johnson is greatly over-used and if anyone doesn't know who he is they are either illiterate or a mouth-breather whether they like boxing or not. my point was all about boxing and good boxing is not something you find in johnson's fights unfortunately. Johnson wasn't a bum of course, but all you'll find on tape is him vs bums and old fighters. I just suggested better sources.

But Johnson really didn't fight the best of opposition. For all that he did by becoming the first black hw champ, he took it all away by refusing to fight black fighters. There are probably droves of black fighters during the Johnson era who could've been 'somebody' and weren't because of Johnson. Johnson beat a lot of old white guys who used to be good and then even more bums. He was like a sideshow of boxing really. whatever, it is still a very good subject for boxing history. and i think he was more than just a mere sideshow. he had to agree to carry many of those white fighters several rounds to be allowed to even fight them. he was an important historical figure and very important to boxing. he helped pave the way for other black athletes. and somehow managed to not get killed even though he was known to sleep with white women. they just made an award winning movie about f'n jim braddock, a bum. if they can do that and try making braddock seem like something he wasn't, then someone can write a paper about jack johnson. however really my point was just to try finding any fighter that actually has a lot of reputable sources written about him. and someone who isnt too overused. like it would be stupid to write a paper about ali right now unless you had a totally fresh angle. which, you probably don't.

Absolutely. He'll get in for sure.

I think that if someone wants to get into boxing history, study Sugar Ray Robinson perhaps or even Ali. Find a torrent site where collectors share the wealth and get some of the classics. If history is really what you want then around the Dempsey era is good as the rules were evolving to be what they are today. The 'long count' fight is a good place to start and go both ways from there.

definitely Morales is going to the Hall of Fame, man where can I find an 18 fight dvd of erik? Some guy on eBay. He is selling a 19 fight Morales DVD and an 18 fight Barrera Collection. He also has 20 Kostya Tszyu fights, 32 Felix Trinidad fights and 22 Fernando Vargas fights. He is constantly getting more stuff. His name is boxer_bulldog.

morales would not be a good choice for this probably because you wont find a lot of information. you would do best with older fighters back when they used to actually cover boxing some. joe louis would be good but maybe too generic. it depends how deep you want to dig for info. jack johnson would be a great choice and pbs just did a great special on him called unforgiveable blackness. 4 hours i think. and james earl jones played him in the great white hope. jack johnson is a good choice and many mainstream people wouldnt know him. and there is relatively a lot of info on him. But Johnson really didn't fight the best of opposition. For all that he did by becoming the first black hw champ, he took it all away by refusing to fight black fighters. There are probably droves of black fighters during the Johnson era who could've been 'somebody' and weren't because of Johnson. Johnson beat a lot of old white guys who used to be good and then even more bums. He was like a sideshow of boxing really.

definitely Morales is going to the Hall of Fame, man where can I find an 18 fight dvd of erik?

What boxer had a great career that I should research? I need to focus on one fighter right now. I only know a tiny bit about a bunch of fighters. morales would not be a good choice for this probably because you wont find a lot of information. you would do best with older fighters back when they used to actually cover boxing some. joe louis would be good but maybe too generic. it depends how deep you want to dig for info. jack johnson would be a great choice and pbs just did a great special on him called unforgiveable blackness. 4 hours i think. and james earl jones played him in the great white hope. jack johnson is a good choice and many mainstream people wouldnt know him. and there is relatively a lot of info on him.

I might start with Erik Morales. I found some guy selling an eighteen fight dvd of him.

Morales will get in the HOF in the first try. He is one of only a few Mexicans who became 3-division champions.

I am going to start getting Ring magazine.

What boxer had a great career that I should research? I need to focus on one fighter right now. I only know a tiny bit about a bunch of fighters.