Is Just Size a Dominant Factor - Klitschkos, etc

I've posted the below content in another thread, but no one responded as the thread was already chewed over and done with (sorry Anorak) Thus I decided to make it a new thread and wanted to hear your opinions The below is not meant to offend anyone, not Klitschko fans/haters, nor Hopkins, where I just used him as an example. Here it goes: _________________________________________________ One thing that bothers me... I don't mean the below thoughts to be racist, or to offend anyone. But everyone always refers to Klitschko's as "Giants". "The reason they are so good is because of their size." "If they were smaller they would be crushed" and etc.. Yes, those are all true statements. But how come their disadvantages are never taken into consideration. It is a known fact that black people have much better stamina, naturally more athletic, have better chins, don't get cut as easily, and last but not least breath easier due to bigger nostrils. Do you think all that equates to size advantage? How really big are the Klitschko's compared to their competition? I did a little statistics where I took Top 20 guys from Boxrec and averaged their height and weight. Here are my findings below: Vitali's Hight: +almost 4 inches above the competition Vitali's Weight: +5.5lb above competition Wlad's Hight: + almost 2.5 inches above competition Wlad's Weight: -3.5lb above competition Is that such a huge difference, especially in Wlad's case? He is only 2.5 inches taller on average than the rest. And is 3.5 pound lighter. Most of us are saying he should still drop 5-10 pounds. So are they really that much "bigger" and do they really have all that advantage everyone talks about? I did the same statistics for our P4P King: Bernard Hopkins and his division. Hopkins is also like Wlad is almost 2.5 inches above the rest in the division. (Weight of course is not a factor) How come no one is saying "Hopkins is so good because of his size"? Your thoughts.

Comments (20)

Yes but if he wasnt as big he probably wouldnt be as mechanical, he would be more mobile and probably been a better boxer. Thank you very much...

21y ago

hollister

all it will take to kayo vitali is a heavyweight with a solid chin, decent power, and most important, excellent stamina. the guy looks like he could fall over just on pure exhaustion if he gets in the later rounds. why is that? because of his tremendous size. he can only build so much stamina at 6'8. if he gets in a competitive fight into the championship rounds he will go down HARD, and probably retire. I agree with the lack of top-notch stamina in larger fighters, although basketball players seem to do fairly well. that being said, he always looks like that, that's been the source of much of the scrutiny by the boxing media and boxing fans alike, coupled with his clumbsy appearance. But the attributes you're talking about aren't that easy to find in one package firstly, and secondly even if one came along, there's no guarantee he'd beat VK. If Wlad continues to use his height to his advantage as well, instead of fighting smaller like he used to, he could be a force to be reckoned with as well. I still say that size can be just as much a hinderance as a help though.

21y ago

paul750

it's only an advantage if you use it the right way, klitschko has been able to use his height very well that's the difference, a lot of taller guys don't use their height because they fight down to their opponents level

21y ago

hollister

I'm waiting for someone to say the Earths gravitational pull is stronger on black people so they have a tendency to sink. ??????????????? Hadn't thought of that one lol Would have probably gotten a rise lol

21y ago

chaawuu

that first post is filled with the most bullshit i've read in a while. it's a known fact that blacks are more athletic? where are your sources? known fact my fucking ass. you made that shit up.

21y ago

Torino

Yeah I think I read somewhere that white people used to swim a lot 1 million years ago in arctic Europe. I think that's how they lost their fur. I think they swam right through the last ice age. Oh, and I think size is an advantage if used properly

21y ago

Konstantin

I think VK's Size definately Helps him, I mean lets say he was the size of Ruiz, or Byrd, the way his jab doesn't quite snap like the likes of Lewis, i think he would get soundly beaten, plus the size is always a hard thing for a smaller boxer to overcome. Having said that he does have some skill, for a flat footed, rather slowish fighter Yes but if he wasnt as big he probably wouldnt be as mechanical, he would be more mobile and probably been a better boxer.

21y ago

Yarmez

21y ago

_Mr_Soprano

saying blacks are naturally more athletic and have better chins is the biggest load of crap I've ever heard. Breathe easier due to bigger nostrils? Where did you pull that out of your ass . . . .?? It's like Im reading some turn of the century British anthropologist . . .I expect everyone to be a grown up and not to turn this into racism. This is a boxing forum and I don't see why race in sports cannot be discussed. "Breathe easier due to bigger nostrils? Where did you pull that out of your ass . . . .??" No, not my ass... Humans are about 1Mil years old; The 'Modern Human' is about 6,000 years old. As any species we all adopt to the geographic environment we live in. Black people have dark skin due to the worm climate. Black person can be exposed to the sun a lot longer than the white without getting burned. White people have small nostrils, this is due to the winter and the cold air they breath. As same as we are all are, we are somewhat differences. The information about black athletes I listed in the original post came from an African American course I took back in college. I was taught that, again due to the geographic environment. Thus this also applies in Sports.. Asian have the best reflexes: Ping Pong, Kong-Fu, etc.. Black have the fastest legs: Sprinters, American Football, etc White, like someone mentioned, are best swimmers, etc Latin best boxers in light weight, etc

21y ago

dempseyfire

21y ago

leff

i read something about races some time back,cant remeber where though. anyway i said that blacks are more explosive but whites are stronger (especially slavs). didnt say anything about stamina ore chin.

21y ago

Torino

Maybe black people don't like to swim, or the swim scouts discriminate lol I don't know. I'm waiting for someone to say the Earths gravitational pull is stronger on black people so they have a tendency to sink. ???????????????

21y ago

hollister

Me too. I think that all the races are more or less the same but just like you I heard a lot of people say that some races have special traits that help them in sports but i never saw the proof. But the thing i said in swimming is my own observation from last three olympic games. Maybe black people don't like to swim, or the swim scouts discriminate lol I don't know.

21y ago

hollister

I have heard that black people tend to have more fast-twitch muscle fibers from many people, but have never read it in a book. As far as black athletes being more successful, the less athletes you have of a certain skin color in any given sport, the less chance there is of one of them being successful, which was the case long ago for blacks because whites wouldn't let them join in the reindeer games. Later on, the flood of participation from blacks and latinos coupled with the withdrawal more or less by whites swung the momentum the other way. Nowadays, the number of whites and blacks who are successful (have good jobs) is much closer to being balanced than it has ever been, meaning the number of whites and blacks participating in boxing is also much closer than it has been in a long time. VK and Wlad use their size because that is what they have. Ali never relied on power because he didn't have much, and it didn't matter anyway because he had calcium deposits in his hands which means he couldn't bear to punch hard. Tex Cobb used his chin to make his mark in boxing, it's all he had. If VK and Wlad weren't large men, they might have been faster. I believe that size can be as much a hinderance as a help in boxing because of the lack of overall coordination seen in such large fighters. Anyway, their size is a big part of what makes them who they are, and you can't be successful in boxing without at least some skill, so they deserve at least some credit, IMO

21y ago

Torino

Can someone please tell me where I can find and view the data on all these studies about which race is better at what? So far I've only heard opinions that people are claiming to be fact. People are just people. We are all pretty much the same. IMO - The racial dominance in the different sports is a product of environment. The factual differences between the races are subtle, unless your McKay.

21y ago

guru

matter size does, everything it is not

21y ago

rge

I have a thread about punching power and it's relation with bone mass. Although you went to know not just about power but about advantages in general. Reach is another advantage. If they are tall and not fat it's another advantage. These two reasons are why I picked Wlad to win over Eliseo. Nicolay Valuev it's 333 lbs and 7 feet, do any of you saw how good is he? http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=019904

21y ago

guru

size is an advantage, but not a dominating factor..... that's why grant, mccline and jefferson cant beat a decent heavyweight with skills... they have size and strenght, but little skill...

21y ago

moochi

WELL OF COURSE it is size............if a middleweight contender is 1 poun d heavier than his opponent, he can't fight him. So you have the heavyweight division with no limit. So it is very unfair to those 100kg/220lb 6'2" boxers who fight the huge Klitschko's, Valuev, Whitaker, etc... Look at Etienne vs Valuev...there was a 10inch or so height advantage and a whopping 53kg/115lb difference... I've said it before and I say it again, if VT or WK were 6'2, you never would have heard of them.......this is the reason why i don't respect the HW division...many many match-ups are not fair.

21y ago

marvelous_TG

there are differences between white and black athletes, blacks have in general longer legs and arms, and smaller body, whites have bigger body's with smaller arms and legs in general. indeed blacks dominate 100meters sprints because they have more fast twitch muscle fibers, wich are explosive muscles, so they can run hard for short period of time, they tire quickly those muscles, whites are stronger(in general) look at strong man competition or all strength sports, arm wrestling, olympic weightlifting, strongman competition etc. chin nobody has a edge although if you look at history in boxing whites tend to have the better chins, best heavy chin ever tex cobb, chuvalo(both white) lamotta etc. but ofcourse you have blacks with great chins too hagler, holyfield etc. so every race has it's advantage. it's obvious in american football the runners are usually black, and those quaterback are usually white. but the differences are very small indeed, 2 olympics ago it was a white man the greek who won the 100 m so there are exceptions, and still the most important factor is envirment, back in the days you had a lot of white guys in boxing because they where poor too, now most white people are rich and blacks are still pooor so they go in sports, but even blacks get richer, that's why they don't box anymore look at heavyweight division.

21y ago