Pryor-Leonard - The match that failed to happen..

A great fight that could have gone either way. But I would have to go with Leonard on this fight. It's so hard to pick against him during his prime. A close UD - these two guys were good enough to seriously mess up each others carriers for good after fighting each other. I'm sure if they did fight it would've been a classic.

Size is usually the, or one of the main factors when predicting the outcome of a fight. You take away the size factor and it's very hard predicting fights. For example a heavyweight should have no problem with a flyweight. In boxing any advantage in size or weight matters, especially in the lower weight divisions, so your logic is kind of backwards. I think what made leonard more powerful than Pryor was his sharpness and accuracy. Pryor wasn't really accurate, but he did throw punches from all angles and had power at 140. I agree a 105lb man should generally lose to a 200 lb man as in your fly/heavy analogy. What size advantage would Ray have if both men were 147 lbs? What he was taller? Being short never stopped Frazier or Tyson or a myriad of other fighters and being tall didn't saved Marc Breland or Bonecrusher Smith. Size within the same weight class doesn't matter. Hearns was taller than everyone that beat him. Ray was no stronger. Ray was never known to be a heavy hitter and was not a KO artist. As for Ray being faster with his hands. No, he was not faster, both men were extremely fast. The whole fight would come down to style and controlling the ring.

Ray Leonard would have knocked Alexis Arguello out within three rounds. Pryor needed 14 rds, & then 10 rounds, to turn the trick(s). I guess Pryor could have outboxed Ray Leonard ? Not on this planet. As for Ray avoiding Pryor ? LMAO ! Ray Leonard fought Tommy Hearns & Marvin Hagler.....but was afraid of PRYOR ? I seriously think most of you are getting your shit second-handed. Those who were following boxing during that time period......know you youngins have bought into a MYTH that just sounds really good today. Did you guys see Pryor struggling with the likes of Miguel Montilla, DuJuan Johnson, Akio Kameda, Nick Furlano, Gary Hinton ? Ray Leonard would have knocked them all out in two rounds, all in the same night. I was watching back in the eighties and late seventies. Ray Leonard only had a 62% KO rating, which isn't bad but it's not great. Pryor on the other hand had an 89.7 which ranks him number one of anyone whoever won a championship. Rocky marciano being second with 87.75. His entire career he only had four 1st or 2nd round KO's and after he got his first belt he went at least ten rounds 7 of 15 fights, and his nine KO's took 81 rounds or on average they happened in the ninth round. And that's with people like Dave Green, Larry Bonds, Bruce Finch, Kevin Howard, and Donny Lalonde thrown in the mix. So, the second round predictions are hopeful at best. You mentioned Pryor had hard fights with Miguel Montilla, DuJuan Johnson, Akio Kameda, Nick Furlano, Gary Hinton. He KOed Montilla, Kameda and Johnson and the Johnson fight was voted fight of the year by Ring magizine. Also all three were the #1 contender at the time as was Blackmore before them and then he fought Arguello twice with a tune up in between. No champions in any weight fight the number one guy six of seven fights in a row. As for Furlano and Hinton both were fights after he retired and he was a crack addict at the time AND he fought every fight after Arguello II blind in one eye from a detatched retina. Why use fights after he was washed up, half blind and a crack addict. That's like saying Ray Leonard couldn't beat Pryor because he drew (actually lost) to an old Hearns, lost to Terry Norris and was KOed by an old Camacho. Both fighters were great. Both struggled in fights maybe they shouldn't have and both fought about four or five fights more than they should have.

Leonard is naturally bigger and better in just about every category outside of workrate. Leonard would take a fairly easy 15 round decision. Pryor would have a few nice moments and would press Ray the whole way but Leonard is just too much for him at 147. I'll agree Ray was naturally bigger, but he was no stronger or faster. Although Ray had a good chin, was durable and had great stamina, these attributes were also in Pryor's arsenal. Both men sparred together for a year and dropped each other in an early sparring session. After the initial KD's neither was ever knocked down again. So, a KO wouldn't be as likely as one might think. I read when they sparred, Pryor was fast enough to counter as Ray jabbed or threw a right, breaking up Ray's combinations. If pryor could control Ray's jab that would probably be a key factor in the fight. The other would be how well Pryor cut off the ring and limited Rays lateral movement. Of the five Hall of Famers who boxed at 147 during this 'Golden' era: Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Benitez and Cuevas. I think Ray would be the hardest match-up with Pryor. I'd say Ray wins by decision 3 out of 5 times, followed by Benitez 50/50, Duran 2 of 5, Hearns 1 of 5 and Cuevas would never win. But, I think at lightweight Duran would be at least 50/50 or 3 of 5.

This would of been a great fight. Pryor was relentless. But Ray could outbox half the country. He was very smart.

^I think most of them saw him on Legendary Nights and bought into those hyped up clips of him fighting Arguello and thinks that he could move up and also do the man often called the best fighter of the 80's the same way. I think they're sadly mistaken to think that. If any of them saw actual full fights of his, they whould know that he has flaws that whould be much easier to exploit at 147.

Again, I'll wager that the vast majority of those posting on this thread & touting such outcomes in Pryor's favor have never even seen him fight live on the telly. Some of them weren't even out of their nappies yet when he was fighting. :rolleyes:

I can't believe that "Pryor by a KO/TKO" has garnered the most votes amongst all those options given. Listen, back then I disliked Leonard as much as anybody did, but some people on here really need to get a fucking clue. Ridiculous!

We're talking about Ray Leonard here...who had one of the greatest chins, stamina and durability levels, and all around skill sets as a NATURAL welterweight...against Pryor, a great 140 pounder who had life and death struggles with a past his prime Arguello. Theres no way in hell that Pryor wears out Ray and then KO's him. If Hearns couldn't KO him then Pryor couldn't, and I'm actually going to use that broken logic because the entire argument is just kind of assenine.

I must say, these rabid Pryor fans that are coming out of the woodwork are begining to sound downright delusional. They are honestly incapable of reason on this subject. No matter what facts are thrown at them they respond with generalized bullshit or baseless accusations in counterpoint. Case in point, this nonsense about Leonard moving up in weight to avoid Pryor as an amateur. :rolleyes: Nonsense. Leonard may have competed at 132 at some point early in his amateur career, but his plethoa of titles & honors in the Golden Gloves, the AAU Nationals, International competetion & the Olympics all came at 139 lbs. DAMN, that's a helluva lot of accomplishments supposedly done just to avoid one fighter! :p If, infact, Pryor was so fearsome that a win over Leonard was a "sure thing", then why didn't he compete at 139 & try for Leonard's spot at the Olympic trials? Instead, he remained at his natural weight & met & was beaten by Howard Davis Jr.. A smaller fighter than Ray Leonard who was physically not nearly as strong, had little power & possessed a dodgey chin. Yet he still managed to beat Pryor. Yet, Leonard wouldn't have had a chance against him? :rolleyes: Onto the pros... I never said that Pryor's chin was rubbish. And, yes , a couple of his knockdowns ( Cervantes & Akio Kameda particularly ) were of the flash variety & he wasn't hurt by them. But, once again , Dujaun Johnson DID hurt him. And there were other occasions in which Pryor wasn't dropped, but was rocked or stunned.

Pryor never was a one-punch KO artist at 140.....but he'd take out ray Leonard at 147 ? Hearns, Hagler, Duran, & Terry Norris couldn't KO Leonard....but the 140 lb Pryor could ? I must say....sounds like Aaron Pryor is the single greatest fighter who has ever lived. none of those guys had the same punch output as Pryor, and his abillity to take a punch would make other fighters weary of their power. the man was not intimidated by anyone, and wore out everyone. and like i said, that even if someone were to beat him it wasn't going to be easy and i'm damn sure they wouldn't want a rematch, do to the fact that, even a win would (physically) feel like a loss.....either way we could argue till the cows came home..... i think he was one of the greatest fighters ever...not the single greatest fighter ever.... the deuce has dropped.....ker splat!

I see there are some good points for Leonard but i still say Pryor would catch him. Pryor never was a one-punch KO artist at 140.....but he'd take out ray Leonard at 147 ? Hearns, Hagler, Duran, & Terry Norris couldn't KO Leonard....but the 140 lb Pryor could ? I must say....sounds like Aaron Pryor is the single greatest fighter who has ever lived.

I see there are some good points for Leonard but i still say Pryor would catch him.

Ray Leonard would have knocked Alexis Arguello out within three rounds. Pryor needed 14 rds, & then 10 rounds, to turn the trick(s). I guess Pryor could have outboxed Ray Leonard ? Not on this planet. As for Ray avoiding Pryor ? LMAO ! Ray Leonard fought Tommy Hearns & Marvin Hagler.....but was afraid of PRYOR ? I seriously think most of you are getting your shit second-handed. Those who were following boxing during that time period......know you youngins have bought into a MYTH that just sounds really good today. Did you guys see Pryor struggling with the likes of Miguel Montilla, DuJuan Johnson, Akio Kameda, Nick Furlano, Gary Hinton ? Ray Leonard would have knocked them all out in two rounds, all in the same night. My thoughts exactly... He'll fight Hagler but is too scared to fight Pryor? hmmm... Any form of Hagler is scarier than Pryor...Ray would have beaten Pryor quite soundly.

Arguello's prime was well below 140 and the 1980's. Exactly my point. & what I'm getting at....is this guy (Pryor), who's biggest win was over this past-his-best great (Arguello), is supposed to GO UP in weight & KO one of the best fighters of all time ? Absurd.

Took Pryor 14 rounds, & a lot of hell, to KO Arguello. Arguello was NEVER as good a fighter as Ray Leonard, no matter what you'd like to believe. He was also quite past his prime, in his age & his weight, when he fought Pryor. Put it this way.....If Arguello's true prime was 140.....if that's where he peaked time & size-wise....he'd have KILLED Pryor. Yes, killed him. Arguello's prime was well below 140 and the 1980's.

just to chime in....PRYOR would have busted up Leonard!!!! from pillar to post....Leonard in the amateurs moved up in weight to avoid fighting Pryor, and if you have seen any of Pryors amateur fights or even his sparring, his style and aggression never changed, ever!! he was full force all the time, and no one wanted anything to do with him. casue even if anyone was to beat him, it wasn't going to be easy, it would take some years off their life, and would have been painful...Pryors only loss was after a 3 year layoff filled with personal and drug problems, and he was knocked down with a elbow to the temple....he got up quick and then took a knee and the ref waived it off...he could have made it and won and gone undefeated, but it didn't happen. but he would have still beat Leonard and Hearns easily.... the man was denied due to circumstance and that played a major role in his career, in him not getting big fights with big names...sad but true....everything now is speculation, but anyone who watches his fights and knows boxing, knows that Pryor was one of the best ever to lace up the gloves.......also there wont be another fighter like Pryor in a long long time......there just aren't fighters like that anymore....most of the fighters today are converts from other sports who think cause they are athletic they can fight.......fighter are born....not made!!!! the Hawk was a true fighter!!!! a dying breed!!! damn near untouchable as far as i'm concerned!! Took Pryor 14 rounds, & a lot of hell, to KO Arguello. Arguello was NEVER as good a fighter as Ray Leonard, no matter what you'd like to believe. He was also quite past his prime, in his age & his weight, when he fought Pryor. Put it this way.....If Arguello's true prime was 140.....if that's where he peaked time & size-wise....he'd have KILLED Pryor. Yes, killed him.

just to chime in....PRYOR would have busted up Leonard!!!! from pillar to post....Leonard in the amateurs moved up in weight to avoid fighting Pryor, and if you have seen any of Pryors amateur fights or even his sparring, his style and aggression never changed, ever!! he was full force all the time, and no one wanted anything to do with him. casue even if anyone was to beat him, it wasn't going to be easy, it would take some years off their life, and would have been painful...Pryors only loss was after a 3 year layoff filled with personal and drug problems, and he was knocked down with a elbow to the temple....he got up quick and then took a knee and the ref waived it off...he could have made it and won and gone undefeated, but it didn't happen. but he would have still beat Leonard and Hearns easily.... the man was denied due to circumstance and that played a major role in his career, in him not getting big fights with big names...sad but true....everything now is speculation, but anyone who watches his fights and knows boxing, knows that Pryor was one of the best ever to lace up the gloves.......also there wont be another fighter like Pryor in a long long time......there just aren't fighters like that anymore....most of the fighters today are converts from other sports who think cause they are athletic they can fight.......fighter are born....not made!!!! the Hawk was a true fighter!!!! a dying breed!!! damn near untouchable as far as i'm concerned!!

And usually when Pryor went down he bounced right back up and was smiling so that is bullshit. I am totally impartial to this discussion. I couldn't care less who would have won between these two. Just making an observation.

Relax, man. Hey man, didnt mean anything sorry if u got the feeling It's just for other ppl in general all say a fighter has a glass chin cuz they get knocked down once etc. lol