There are a lot of Vitaly Klitchko haters/doubters out there and I think that many are off base. I do realize that it may be me that is offbase-it could just be that I am so ready/hopeful/praying...for someone to take hold of the division and dominate it that I could have blinders on, but for now I don't think that is the case.
People out there act like Vklit was beaten by Chris Byrd, well it does count as a loss but If I were Chris Byrd that is no victory that I would be bragging about, he got his ass kicked in that fight as was the most surprised man in the arena when Vitaly decided to hang it up with a huge lead on the cards...Give VK the benefit of the doubt here after all for the entire fight he dominated a guy that is supposedly one of the most if not the most difficult fighters to fight. If he quits again then lets talk about it.
VKLIT v. LEWIS...This is his biggest argument and why fans should think a bit more of him. I am not going too say that he was going to win that fight, it was in all reality either mans fight going into the 7th. Vklit was a bit out of steam and was somewhat hurt and Lewis barely landed on his stewl at the end of the 6th, both men appeared to be done! He hurt Lewis repeately in this fight and throughout the bout took huge shots and showed as he has recently that he knows how too survive when he needs too, unlike his brother. What I find interesting and solidifying in Vklit's case is that Lewis did not want a rematch? What the hell? What the hell? Lewis said that he had done everything he needed to do and his legacy was complete....wrong! Lewis let a guy bang him around for six rounds, Lewis was lucky in a way with the cut, the punch was not a clean cut right hand, it landed high and his glove slid up Vitaly's face, it looked like a half punch half duck tape cut too me. When Lewis was supposedly in his prime he let a big unccoordinated quitter take the fight too him and at the time of the stoppage this quitter was up on all cards. Thats Lennox's last fight...why no rematch?
No rematch because this guy is better than you think, Lewis figured that the public would give him a pass because he was not in shape (Manny Steward said he was in great shape, and two weeks before when the Johnson fight was in jeopardy Jim Lampley was interviewing Lennox talking about what great shape he was in and how it would be a shame if the Johnson fight did not come off)
and he underestimated the guy, Lewis figured that everyone new that if he was primed and ready to go then it would have been an easy night. Is that what he figured? Manny Steward and Lennox knew that a rematch was nothing like a rematch with McCall or Rock, they were facing a guy that matched up very well with them. In all reality Rock doesn't match up well with LEwis, like Rock said I couldn't even get close too him in the second fight. Vitaly can and would've.
The fact that Lennox refused a rematch with a guy who was beating him should tell you that this guy is legit or at the very least better than you think. He smoked Kirk Johnson like no one else has, he was nailed with some huge lefts in the sanders fight(ones that he never saw coming, oh by the way he had never fought a southpaw before), easily survived and dished out a monster beating, he has been incredibly resourceful with his punches showing that he does watch weak fighters like WladKLIT and yes...he learns from their mistakes. He will thrash Danny Willians as well with relative ease. After the Williams fight there will still be people out there that think he sucks. The only thing that I know for sure is that it won't be me and more importantly it won't be Lennox Lewis.
the division is awful, but VK right now is better than anyone else....
VK could have been a factor in the 90's too, where glass chinned guys like michael moorer and bruce seldon won world titles.... not to mention journeymen like oliver mccall and frank bruno....
And don't be forgetting Frans Botha.
the division is awful, but VK right now is better than anyone else....
VK could have been a factor in the 90's too, where glass chinned guys like michael moorer and bruce seldon won world titles.... not to mention journeymen like oliver mccall and frank bruno....
God its so sad.... I have to agree none of them, but what has the heavyweight division come to...Jesus its awful.
Yeah seeing as how 2 big names of the 90s, Bowe and Holyfield could not KO Bean or Donald.
Neuraxis,
keep lovin VK if you want, we all need role models. Don't be ashamed of how you feel. At least your role model isn't some adulterous athelete or drugged up musician. Props. Learn from the guy. He has a wife and kids, a Doctorate, knows 5 languages, seems to be sponsered by Boss, has a good relationship with his brother and family, doesn't disrespect others, and desires to be closer to his fans. Good S#$% if you ask me.
As far as the HW division goes... Don't ever use a fight that has anything to do with Don King to judge a boxer or the division. If you really want to see how boxing is going or how good a fighter is, make sure that Don King isn't involved, then watch the two go at it in an honest match-up. ONLY THEN will you have answers. I can be the WBO heavyweight champion if I say "Praise to Don King" enough times, like Lamon Brewster says.
Until we erradicate Don from boxing (and the corruption that he isn't involved in as well), we will never be able to truly speak about the condition of HW boxing as we know it.
Pno
i give VK repsect for being the only guy to KO donald, johnson and bean.... plus his win over sanders... who else has been more impressive than VK in the last 2 years?? ruiz? byrd? toney? rahman? nope.....
God its so sad.... I have to agree none of them, but what has the heavyweight division come to...Jesus its awful.
Dansweeny if he wasnt 6'8 nobody would have heard of him? Guess what if Tyson hit like Byrd you never would have heard of him either, if Ali was as fast as butterbean you probably wouldnt have ever heard of him either. The fact is he is a big 6'8" competitior thats why he is what he is, if Lewis had the smae style but was 6'2" with a 76" reach he would get owned, so shut up and please go away.
i dont even care about the topic, it seems whenever a klitschko is brought up you chime in with your nuthugger bullshit proclaiming vitali as the next joe fucking louis or something, i actually like the guy, but your bias toward him is disgusting to the point of rediculousness, you probably have a shrine set up for him or something
So now me saying that a list that only includes current top 15 fighters is biased is equal to me proclaiming him to be the next Joe Louis. Get a life and a clue buddy.
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Thats ok, I get owned alot, I mean I am not a very smart guy and your right alot of people on this site are making me look flat out like a fuckhead....shit do you know how that makes me feel...fuck!
Anyways I do want to say that I am not a VK nutthugger like some, For the ten millionth time he is the only thing in the division that can possibly(I said possibly) dominate the division. There is no one else. If VK gets fucked up then the division needs to go looking elswhere for talent because currently he is the only hope.(maybe....Toney....Maybe, but talk about a guy who still has shit too prove). Rock,Ruiz, Byrd,Wlad, Brewster,Tyson,Williams,McCline,Oquendo etc. they all can beat each other on any given night, yet none of them can be the undisputed champion for more than a fight or two if that. I want an ass kicker and right now we only have one hope left.
How do I stop getting owned, do I just post tighter shit or what?
i dont even care about the topic, it seems whenever a klitschko is brought up you chime in with your nuthugger bullshit proclaiming vitali as the next joe fucking louis or something, i actually like the guy, but your bias toward him is disgusting to the point of rediculousness, you probably have a shrine set up for him or something
I don't think Neuraxis has ever claimed that VK is "Joe Fucking Louis" (is there a typo in the middle name?).
excellent points
I agree, and its a shame that people like dansweeney have nothing intelligent to add, so he revert to personal attacks realizing that he is beat.
That is a completely biased list. You can't do a list with people's current rankings. You would have to be crazy to think that Holyfield and Meehan will still be ranked in November. Vitali v. Donald was a WBA heavyweight title eliminator bout. It matters where they were ranked when they fought Vitali, and I can bet that everyone that he has fought since he beat Hide has been in the 15. We all know that Wladimir has the best wins at heavyweight, and that just goes to show you how much that's worth.
excellent points
i dont post alot but i read alot, and neuraxis, you are all over vitali's dick, he is good but nothing special man, get over it, williams is gonna kayo his ass next month, if he wasnt 6'8 no one would ever have heard of him, he has average skills with good power due to his size, he fought a shit load of bums over there in germany sprinkled in with some contenders thats all
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Of the top 15 ranked heavyweights (updated Nov 14),
Vitali has ONE win over anyone ranked by the WBC (Sanders)
Vitali has ZERO wins over anyone ranked by the WBA
Vitali has ZERO wins over anyone ranked by the IBF
Vitali has ONE win over anyone ranked by the WBO (Hoffman)
Ranked Opponents - 2
Different Ranked Opponents - 2
IBF Champ Byrd has ONE win over anyone ranked by the WBC (VKlitschko)
Byrd has TWO wins over anyone ranked by the WBA (McCline, Holyfield)
Byrd has ONE win over anyone ranked by the IBF (McCline..plus vacated Klit)
Byrd has ZERO wins over anyone ranked by the WBO
Ranked opponents - 4
Different Ranked opponents - 3
Ruiz has ONE win over anyone ranked by the WBC (Rahman)
Ruiz has THREE wins over anyone ranked by the WBA (Rahman, Golota, Holyfield)
Ruiz has ONE win over anyone ranked by the IBF (Rahman)
Ruiz has ONE win over anyone ranked by the WBO (Rahman)
Ranked opponents - 5
Different Ranked opponents - 3
Brewster has TWO wins over anyone ranked by the WBC (W Klitshcko, Meehan)
Brewster has TWO Wins over anyone ranked by the WBA (W Klitschko, Meehan)
Brewster has ONE win over anyone ranked by the IBF (Meehan)
Brewster has ONE win over anyone ranked by the WBO (W Klitschko)
Ranked opponents - 6
Different ranked opponents - 2
I know some guys are ranked by more than one organization, but doesn't that make them more credible contenders? Now why is Vitali called "The man"?
That is a completely biased list. You can't do a list with people's current rankings. You would have to be crazy to think that Holyfield and Meehan will still be ranked in November. Vitali v. Donald was a WBA heavyweight title eliminator bout. It matters where they were ranked when they fought Vitali, and I can bet that everyone that he has fought since he beat Hide has been in the 15. We all know that Wladimir has the best wins at heavyweight, and that just goes to show you how much that's worth.
So Johnson weighing 260 lbs means nothing? (and don't say it didn't matter b/c it went 2 rounds. If you've ever boxed you'd know that fighting so grossly out of shape effects you from the opening bell). Sanders got KO'd by Nate Tubbs for a 10 count and was knocked down and TKO'd by Rahman in his prime before Klitschko ever got hold of an old, inactive, and grotesqly out of shape Sanders. And Lewis was not in his prime for Tyson, people were just saying that to make the Tyson loss seem not as bad as it was. Lewis has clearly been slipping as a fighter ever since Rahman 1. (and illegal action?? You're not a believer of the Lewis headbutt theory are you? Geeeeez . . .)
I do respect Vitali as a fighter and I prefer to see him fight then many of the pretenders like Rahman, Ruiz, McCline etc. He may even be the best of the lot right now. But he's done anything to get anybody to sing his praises yet . . .
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So Johnson weighing 260 lbs means nothing? (and don't say it didn't matter b/c it went 2 rounds. If you've ever boxed you'd know that fighting so grossly out of shape effects you from the opening bell). Sanders got KO'd by Nate Tubbs for a 10 count and was knocked down and TKO'd by Rahman in his prime before Klitschko ever got hold of an old, inactive, and grotesqly out of shape Sanders. And Lewis was not in his prime for Tyson, people were just saying that to make the Tyson loss seem not as bad as it was. Lewis has clearly been slipping as a fighter ever since Rahman 1. (and illegal action?? You're not a believer of the Lewis headbutt theory are you? Geeeeez . . .)
I do respect Vitali as a fighter and I prefer to see him fight then many of the pretenders like Rahman, Ruiz, McCline etc. He may even be the best of the lot right now. But he's done anything to get anybody to sing his praises yet . . .
I think people said Lewis was in his prime because they thought he was in his prime. I personally think there is no fighter 34-37 that has ever been better than Lewis. I don't know about a headbut I just know that the right hand landed high and LEwis scraped VK with the tape on his gloves. I will say this about Lewis, he ws never very consistent, the guy never put a string of five or six good fights together, he always struggled...looked amazing and then would struggle again. Again time will tell with VK, time will tell.
So Johnson weighing 260 lbs means nothing? (and don't say it didn't matter b/c it went 2 rounds. If you've ever boxed you'd know that fighting so grossly out of shape effects you from the opening bell). Sanders got KO'd by Nate Tubbs for a 10 count and was knocked down and TKO'd by Rahman in his prime before Klitschko ever got hold of an old, inactive, and grotesqly out of shape Sanders. And Lewis was not in his prime for Tyson, people were just saying that to make the Tyson loss seem not as bad as it was. Lewis has clearly been slipping as a fighter ever since Rahman 1. (and illegal action?? You're not a believer of the Lewis headbutt theory are you? Geeeeez . . .)
I do respect Vitali as a fighter and I prefer to see him fight then many of the pretenders like Rahman, Ruiz, McCline etc. He may even be the best of the lot right now. But he's done anything to get anybody to sing his praises yet . . .
Aaaah its this discussion again okay.
Vit is the best in the division, a bad division yes but stil the best out there.
His newer been knocked out, beaten upp ore outbox neither as an amature ore pro.
His two losses are due to damages not outboxing, the one against LL because of elegal action.
Had he not been unlucky against Byrd and had he the ref done his job ore LL hadent cheated, he would have been undefeated.
His losses are bullshit.
His the best there is right now, give the guy the respect he deserves, for being polite, fore showing upp in shape and for newer getting truly beaten.
And you can on and on about LL not being in shape, what do think is the worst change from the man vit was sopossed to fight to fighting LL. Ore from Klitschko to Johson?
Vit had a bigger difference and LL exactly the same amount of time to prepare for Vit as Vit to prepare for LL.
Vitali gets the type of respect that a Champ deserves, only when he's beaten guys that are worth mentioning. Vitali needs some belts. Unfortunately, until King makes it happen, we fans are left talking about Vitali Klitchko in the context of his recent wins over fat and/or old guys, and his loss to Lewis. That sucks for us and Klit.
You, and several oters who post regularly on this site, argue that Vitali deserves our respect, based on Lewis's refusal of a rematch. Give us a break. Vitali's "respect" must be won in the ring, not by the fact that another man won't fight him again. Lewis was nearing retirement and, just like RJJ, showed-up uninspired and fat. His choice to retire is his and we can't start building Klit's legacy on that LOSS.
Respect comes from your performance. Vitali got some respect for his performance against Lewis, but he simply didn't win that fight, as you said, and we'll never know what was gonna' happen in the next round(s).If Lewis was fat and uninspired he would have never made it too the sixth round, yes of course we start building Klits legacy off of the Lewis fight...that is his beginning! His legacy may go up in flames in the next fight or two but if it doesnt and he stays undefeated for five years his legacy began on the night in which he battled LEnnox...period!
Again I am not saying the Vitaly is the shit, all I am saying is that he is better than any other heavy out there right now, which doesn't say much but it still counts for something...Time will tell how good this guy is but right now he is the best...Who else is there? I love James Toney (he has beaten more than just Jirov/Nunn...McCallum twice, PRime Reggie Johnson-something Tarver could barely do when Johnson was way past prime, pummeled Iran Barkley etc)but someone earlier said it best, James Toney beat Evander...Evander is shot, Lennox was not shot! If you fight Toney the right way and don't come after him you can have a much easier time with him, VK is resourceful-he won't come at Toney, Toney will get cracked with a long jab and be forced to attack....Toney never attacks so he will have to change as a fighter. No more beating a dead horse, we do have to sit back and watch and see what happens, but if he knocks out Williams then what do you have? Ruiz/Byrd who who squeek out fight after fight...or Vitally who fucks people up...you stick with Byrd and Ruiz I'll take my chances with VK...
Vitali gets the type of respect that a Champ deserves, only when he's beaten guys that are worth mentioning. Vitali needs some belts. Unfortunately, until King makes it happen, we fans are left talking about Vitali Klitchko in the context of his recent wins over fat and/or old guys, and his loss to Lewis. That sucks for us and Klit.
You, and several oters who post regularly on this site, argue that Vitali deserves our respect, based on Lewis's refusal of a rematch. Give us a break. Vitali's "respect" must be won in the ring, not by the fact that another man won't fight him again. Lewis was nearing retirement and, just like RJJ, showed-up uninspired and fat. His choice to retire is his and we can't start building Klit's legacy on that LOSS.
Respect comes from your performance. Vitali got some respect for his performance against Lewis, but he simply didn't win that fight, as you said, and we'll never know what was gonna' happen in the next round(s).