Is Joe Frazier really an ATG?

[Szef]

So? Does that erase his losses?

that's so far-fetched. And btw, Steward was working with Wlad for the Brewster fight. But I guess there's an excuse for that as well? Drugged was it?

Haye and Byrd are not HOFamers by any stretch, and Wlad most certainly has never beaten an ATG.

But you know who has? Joe Frazier.

It doesn't erase his losses but we both know that Wlad pre Steward and Wlad post Steward are completely two diffrent fighters.

Brewster fight was Wlad's first fight after he started working with Manny.

Haye is certainly a HOF based on his cruiserweight career. Byrd has Vitali, Tua, Golota, Holyfield on his resume, not to mention he started at middleweight to end up as a HW champion of the world. He's a HOFer withput any doubt.

The funny thing is, if this thread's title was "Is David Haye a HOFer?" you would be defending him and trying to persuade us how your boy deserves to be inducted to HOF as you always do.

But now, when you brought up Wlad, even your love to David Haye is not enough to overcome your hatred towards Wladimir Klitschko.

Talking about double standards.

[Szef]

Most definitely not.

Yeah, that's like your opinion.

[LacedUp]

It doesn't erase his losses but we both know that Wlad pre Steward and Wlad post Steward are completely two diffrent fighters.

Brewster fight was Wlad's first fight after he started working with Manny.

Haye is certainly a HOF based on his cruiserweight career. Byrd has Vitali, Tua, Golota, Holyfield on his resume, not to mention he started at middleweight to end up as a HW champion of the world. He's a HOFer withput any doubt.

The funny thing is, if this thread's title was "Is David Haye a HOFer?" you would be defending him and trying to persuade us how your boy deserves to be inducted to HOF as you always do.

But now, when you brought up Wlad, even your love to David Haye is not enough to overcome your hatred towards Wladimir Klitschko.

Talking about double standards.

So what? Joe Frazier anno '69 is a completely different beast to the one that fought Foreman as well. It goes both ways - either way you wish to put it, a 2. round loss to George Foreman is certainly better to take than a 2. rounds loss to Corrie Sanders - regardless of circumstances. It's really just an excuse.

Haye is not a HOFamer at all. He's had 2 CW title fights against guys many thought was average at best, whilst Mormeck was also past his prime. Byrd was never the heavyweight champion of the world - so you can stop that right there. Also, he arguably lost to Golota.

So now he has Vitali on his resume? Interesting. Normally it's "Vitali was ahead on points", but OK I'll give him that. the rest of the fighters you mentioned were average anyways, and to even mention holyfield I mean come on.

Absolutely not - and that's a pity card to play. There has been a thread like that started by Freedom, where I voted no. You can go back and check if you'd like .

Anyways, we shall see if Haye or Byrd gets inducted into the HOF - my bet is hell no.

Also, you said Wlad had beaten other ATGs - who may I ask?

[SplitSecond]

holycrap

antonio tarver is an ATG

[bojangles1987]

personally wouldn't consider him one

beat ali and that's about all he's done

No, that's not all he did, and there's half a dozen posts now explaining it. After Ali went away, Frazier proceeded to become the heavyweight champion in one of the better heavyweight decades by beating all the names that mattered at the time. That's why the Fight of the Century was called the Fight of the Century, and that's why when Ali came back, despite never losing his title in the ring, there was a legitimate dispute about who was the real champion. Frazier had a great career, if short, and eliminated any question anyone might have about his greatness when he won one of, if not the biggest fight in the history of the sport.

[bojangles1987]

How are people going to talk **** about fighters they know nothing about? Honestly.

[SplitSecond]

No, that's not all he did, and there's half a dozen posts now explaining it. After Ali went away, Frazier proceeded to become the heavyweight champion in one of the better heavyweight decades by beating all the names that mattered at the time. That's why the Fight of the Century was called the Fight of the Century, and that's why when Ali came back, despite never losing his title in the ring, there was a legitimate dispute about who was the real champion. Frazier had a great career, if short, and eliminated any question anyone might have about his greatness when he won one of, if not the biggest fight in the history of the sport.

all bums, couldn't care less

[Szef]

So what? Joe Frazier anno '69 is a completely different beast to the one that fought Foreman as well. It goes both ways - either way you wish to put it, a 2. round loss to George Foreman is certainly better to take than a 2. rounds loss to Corrie Sanders - regardless of circumstances. It's really just an excuse.

Haye is not a HOFamer at all. He's had 2 CW title fights against guys many thought was average at best, whilst Mormeck was also past his prime. Byrd was never the heavyweight champion of the world - so you can stop that right there. Also, he arguably lost to Golota.

So now he has Vitali on his resume? Interesting. Normally it's "Vitali was ahead on points", but OK I'll give him that. the rest of the fighters you mentioned were average anyways, and to even mention holyfield I mean come on.

Absolutely not - and that's a pity card to play. There has been a thread like that started by Freedom, where I voted no. You can go back and check if you'd like .

Anyways, we shall see if Haye or Byrd gets inducted into the HOF - my bet is hell no.

Also, you said Wlad had beaten other ATGs - who may I ask?

Byrd was a HW champion, WTF are you talking about?

Even though I hate the guy Haye is arguably TOP 3 maybe even TOP 2 CW ever. He will be inducted to Hall of Fame and so will Byrd.

I've never said Wlad had beaten other ATGs.

[IronDanHamza]

Yeah, that's like your opinion.

No it's not.

There's no chance either get in.

If a miracle occurs and they both get in (Impossible) the HOF may aswell be void.

But that's irrelevant because the reality is neither are going to get in because neither are even close to HOF level.

[SplitSecond]

maybe i could consider him an atg, but ts is right

i would probabley have wlad slightly above frazier just due to the number of fights