Boxing History

[Larry the boss]

[Dempsey-Louis]

I randomly pushed the time bar to 1:27 minutes in, just to get a taste of the program - they said Sullivan-Kilrain took place in 1879 when it was actually 1889 and then added that 89 knock downs occurred when there were only 75 rounds to the fight. The London Prize Ring Rules would usually make a 75 round fight somewhere around 73 to 74 knockdowns depending on how Kilrain quit. With many rounds ending with one of the fighters deliberately taking a knee, most often Kilrain, (but Sullivan took a knee as well and I believe suffered one legit knock down.) But under the LPR rules there is no logic to 89 knockdowns occurring in 75 rounds.

I was a little surprised I could randomly hit the program and run into a mistake like that, but maybe I am misunderstanding something.

[OctoberRed]

I randomly pushed the time bar to 1:27 minutes in, just to get a taste of the program - they said Sullivan-Kilrain took place in 1879 when it was actually 1889 and then added that 89 knock downs occurred when there were only 75 rounds to the fight. The London Prize Ring Rules would usually make a 75 round fight somewhere around 73 to 74 knockdowns depending on how Kilrain quit. With many rounds ending with one of the fighters deliberately taking a knee, most often Kilrain, (but Sullivan took a knee as well and I believe suffered one legit knock down.) But under the LPR rules there is no logic to 89 knockdowns occurring in 75 rounds.

I was a little surprised I could randomly hit the program and run into a mistake like that, but maybe I am misunderstanding something.

Good catches there.

[QueensburyRules]

--- Also throw downs were allowed that passed as KDs.

Guaranteed LPRR would be infinitely more exciting and just than 80% of today's slop but for the blood and facial disfigurement.

[OctoberRed]

--- Also throw downs were allowed that passed as KDs.

Guaranteed LPRR would be infinitely more exciting and just than 80% of today's slop but for the blood and facial disfigurement.

Most of the stuff today doesnt even compare to wars we saw 10 years ago.

[billeau2]

Whats it going to take to get you in this neck of the woods more often?

Mufflers or gloves were introduced by Figg so that people could spar at the fairs where he held court...a booth for sword play and boxing. At that time the two endevours were inseparable. It won't be until Dempsey and the twenties when boxing changes the fighting distance and the punch types as the gloves get bigger.

Heres an interesting aside: Grappling in boxing is interesting...BUt most people do not know that Kendo, the Japanese art of the Bamboo Shinai also allowed grappling.


Edison was important because Sullivan was the first real big draw, but without the technology being at a certain point, America would have to wait for the advent of the superstar until the twenties with Babe Ruth and Dempsey.

[QueensburyRules]

--- First full length ever feature film was the 1897 Fitz/Corbett bout.

Both were stars before the fight, but Fitz went thru a 2yr sojourn in theatrics where they had safer guaranteed work without the threat of armed to the teeth corners...boxing 101.

Set the stage for new champs and Dempsey ended up in Hollywood.

[OctoberRed]

Set the stage for new champs and Dempsey ended up in Hollywood.

^^^^^^ This right here.

[Dempsey-Louis]

--- First full length ever feature film was the 1897 Fitz/Corbett bout.

Both were stars before the fight, but Fitz went thru a 2yr sojourn in theatrics where they had safer guaranteed work without the threat of armed to the teeth corners...boxing 101.

Set the stage for new champs and Dempsey ended up in Hollywood.

The first three [short] films to come out of Edison Studio's 'black box' were a mock execution of a spy, Little Eva naked (she rose up from inside a clam shell), and a Corbett - Courtney sparring session.

By 1895 Edison already had it figured out: violence - sex - sports.

We really can't say for sure if Corbett-Fitzsimmons was actually the first full length feature film ever made, but it sure as hell was the first full length feature film to create a line at the box office.

Film producers had projectors specially built and venues solely created just to show the Corbett-Fitzsimmons fight; it is not unreasonable to conclude that the first film (of any kind) eight out of ten Americans ever saw was the Corbett-Fitzsimmons fight.

All three of the major mass media breakouts: film, radio, television, used prize fighting as a loss leader to sell their new media.

When radio first appeared baseball owners mistakenly believed that free radio broadcasts would steal away from live attendance. It took Tex Rickard who sold the radio broadcasting rights to Dempsey's fights and still drew mega crowds that opened baseball owners eyes (on how radio could be used to build, not deter, a fan base.)

By the mid 1950s, between the two networks (CBS/NBC) there were 30 hours of 'prime time viewing' (7-10 PM, week days) available --- The networks filled six hours (1/5) of that time with prize fighting. I.e. between 1947-1951 the chief motivation for buying a TV set was to watch the fights.

Way back in 1939 NBC bought the television broadcasting rights to a Lou Nova exhibition bout. There were approximately 1000 receivers (possible viewers) in the tri-state area, but NBC brilliantly set-up of mass viewing venues, with free attendance, and then went about selling their media to crowd. (Of course the War pulled the carpet out from under the entire television industry and it would have to wait until 1946 to get going again; in 1946 TV producers repeated their effort with Louis-Conn II, but this time with great success and thanks to prize fighting television was off and running.)

When it came to all three major media innovations, film, radio, television, the other sports quickly found themselves having to play catch-up to prize fighting; all three mediums at some level owe their successful beginning to prize fighting.

This of course is not to say the these mediums wouldn't have taken off anyway, they certainly would have, but in the beginning it was prize fighting that got them going.

[Anthony342]

In a nutshell, the history of boxing is:

A lot of guys want to beat the hell out of other guys, either because of a grudge or to make money or both. When a fight is going on, it will draw a crowd, so some guy got the idea "hey, if we had venues for these fights and charged people admission, we could make money showing this to people" and since we love beating the crap out of each other and watching other people do the same, a sport was born, slowly developing rules to make it less savage and a little safer, like mixed martial arts started doing after 1993. Stuff like "hmm, a lot of these guys are hurting their hands. I KNOW, let's give them some kind of protection so they're less likely to hurt their hands and more likely to throw more punches" and "Let's have time limits to each round, rather than waiting until someone is knocked down or only ending a fight when someone is knocked out and hire people to decide who wins each round and therefore the fight, by said scoring system" happened later and here we are today