Fastest white boxer?

[Rusty Tromboni]

Black people come in all different tones, from what I have research Africa is more genetically deserve than any other reign in the world 'Sugar Ray Leonard looked straight up African'.

1) Black people have all different degrees of White heritage, but the average is about a quarter.

2) Genetic diversity has nothing to do w/ appearance, or even numbers. if anything, the more attenuated, the greater the chance of divergence.

3) Ray Leonard definitely didn't look African. And it tends to be the more White blood Black fighters have the better they are. Which makes perfect sense when you consider White fighters tend to be better than Black fighters.

Blacks are better at certain positions in sports, though. Especially less physical, less violent, more straight-forward ones.

If you've ever coached, you know you want a combination of both.

[PRINCEKOOL]

1) Black people have all different degrees of White heritage, but the average is about a quarter.

2) Genetic diversity has nothing to do w/ appearance, or even numbers.

3) Ray Leonard definitely didn't look African. And it tends to be the more White blood Black fighters have the better they are. Which makes perfect sense when you consider White fighters tend to be better than Black fighters.

Blacks are better at certain positions in sports, though. Especially less physical, less violent, more straight-forward ones.

If you've ever coached, you know you want a combination of both.

Stop quoting me, your posts are complete nonsense.

[Rusty Tromboni]

being fast is important. But it's over-emphasized now that Boxing is more of a game, and less of a sport, and definitely not fighting.

Prey animals are fast, predators aren't.

I have never owned a wolf or dog that could move like a deer. And a horse is on a different level still.

Bears are fast to escape other bears, or chase animals off their kill. Wolves tend to exhaust their prey, and Cheetahs are only good in short bursts. So, even if you want to suggest there are highly corsurial predators, you have to admit their limitations.

Lomachenko, Pep, Greb, sure they're all insanely fast, but that's not essential to their greatness.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Stop quoting me, your posts are complete nonsense.

Silly me. I keep forgetting you don't care about facts. Not in the least.

Did Candidate Yang send you a check yet?

[billeau2]

Facts

Heres a fact...

Boxing seems to have attracted strong men from whomever was at the bottom of the economic totem pole at the time. Somehow all the genetics in the world could not challenge that trend until very recent times.

More facts? Heres an interesting one. brazil, a country with a smorgesboard of combat and culture,..a country with Japanese Samurai expats, free Black men and all variety of Creoles...NEVER had much boxing talent. I know I know Jofre was great, a few here and there... But can any of one explain to me a country with all varieties of complexion, and the most well educated combative lexicon of any country I can think of....Yet boxing is not represented well at all...WHY?

You want Judo do you? brazil has Japanese pre Kodokan teachers, lines of traditions uninterrupted by the Second World War...after the war when the best Judo that could be found in japan was a bunch of thugs throwing each other around the Kodokan mat while teachers shook their head, after losing years of development cause of the war.... The gracies came out of Judo lines Japanese in nature that flourished in Brazil!

You want wrestling? Catch Can, Lankinshire, Shoot fighting, All viable and active traditions in Brazil.... fighting each other getting better, evolving...

And fighting? Vale Tudo, Ju Jutsu, karate, Lutte Livre, all trying to gain an edge, evolution at its finest! Capiera, which was a fighting art used on the street, the equal of the Savate in marseilles alleys, could be found with the capieristas in the cities of Brazil... Maestro Bimba with razors between his toes, and the legends made as capiera battled the clubs of the police, and usually won... Now reduced to a dance lol.

BUT but but...NO BOXING! Could it be that boxing greatness was a product of the environment? and no ethnic enclaves in particular? No genetic finesse? Just good old fashioned, hard @33 living? When the jews were the gangsters, you had jewish fighters, yes? The Irish before yes? Think it through think it through.... Ian Barklay was the toughest member of his gang in New York, the South Bronx...allegedlly except for his older sister, true story.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Heres a fact...

Boxing seems to have attracted strong men from whomever was at the bottom of the economic totem pole at the time. Somehow all the genetics in the world could not challenge that trend until very recent times.

More facts? Heres an interesting one. brazil, a country with a smorgesboard of combat and culture,..a country with Japanese Samurai expats, free Black men and all variety of Creoles...NEVER had much boxing talent. I know I know Jofre was great, a few here and there... But can any of one explain to me a country with all varieties of complexion, and the most well educated combative lexicon of any country I can think of....Yet boxing is not represented well at all...WHY?

You want Judo do you? brazil has Japanese pre Kodokan teachers, lines of traditions uninterrupted by the Second World War...after the war when the best Judo that could be found in japan was a bunch of thugs throwing each other around the Kodokan mat while teachers shook their head, after losing years of development cause of the war.... The gracies came out of Judo lines Japanese in nature that flourished in Brazil!

You want wrestling? Catch Can, Lankinshire, Shoot fighting, All viable and active traditions in Brazil.... fighting each other getting better, evolving...

And fighting? Vale Tudo, Ju Jutsu, karate, Lutte Livre, all trying to gain an edge, evolution at its finest! Capiera, which was a fighting art used on the street, the equal of the Savate in marseilles alleys, could be found with the capieristas in the cities of Brazil... Maestro Bimba with razors between his toes, and the legends made as capiera battled the clubs of the police, and usually won... Now reduced to a dance lol.

BUT but but...NO BOXING! Could it be that boxing greatness was a product of the environment? and no ethnic enclaves in particular? No genetic finesse? Just good old fashioned, hard @33 living? When the jews were the gangsters, you had jewish fighters, yes? The Irish before yes? Think it through think it through.... Ian Barklay was the toughest member of his gang in New York, the South Bronx...allegedlly except for his older sister, true story.

It's definitely a head-scratcher.

You have a guy like Jofre, who might possible be the best ever. We don't have enough film to support that claim, but it does seem very possible. Maybe even likely.... and then it plummets.

It's kind of like Harry Greb. Different sources said his mother was from Ireland, which would make a lot of success considering his success in the ring. Now, I have read that he was full-blooded German. The one German guy to decide to box, and he's far and away the best ever. He was Catholic German, so he was still apart of the same proletariat that Irish, Jews and Italians were drawn from 100 years ago. But you don't really hear about German fighters. They were just a slot below Anglo-Americans, and pretty much didn't have to reduce themselves to something meant for the lower classes. But yeah, the ONE guy who decided he'd make a go of it has been, far and away, the best Boxer there ever was. Talk about beating the odds.

As for more craziness about Brazil: They were some of the first to have Muay Thai fighters. That always blew my mind. Not like you see in Holland, but they incorporated it into the Luta Livre combat systems.
Belfort was also the first to show that you could be very successful in MMA using mostly Boxing, and very little else. Their fighters usually had the best application of pure Boxing skills, too, until recently.

But yeah, huge country, w/ a LOVE of Martial Arts, but Jofre is their only fighter of note. And no one seems to really know why.

[QueensburyRules]

Heres a fact...

Boxing seems to have attracted strong men from whomever was at the bottom of the economic totem pole at the time. Somehow all the genetics in the world could not challenge that trend until very recent times.

More facts? Heres an interesting one. brazil, a country with a smorgesboard of combat and culture,..a country with Japanese Samurai expats, free Black men and all variety of Creoles...NEVER had much boxing talent. I know I know Jofre was great, a few here and there... But can any of one explain to me a country with all varieties of complexion, and the most well educated combative lexicon of any country I can think of....Yet boxing is not represented well at all...WHY?

You want Judo do you? brazil has Japanese pre Kodokan teachers, lines of traditions uninterrupted by the Second World War...after the war when the best Judo that could be found in japan was a bunch of thugs throwing each other around the Kodokan mat while teachers shook their head, after losing years of development cause of the war.... The gracies came out of Judo lines Japanese in nature that flourished in Brazil!

You want wrestling? Catch Can, Lankinshire, Shoot fighting, All viable and active traditions in Brazil.... fighting each other getting better, evolving...

And fighting? Vale Tudo, Ju Jutsu, karate, Lutte Livre, all trying to gain an edge, evolution at its finest! Capiera, which was a fighting art used on the street, the equal of the Savate in marseilles alleys, could be found with the capieristas in the cities of Brazil... Maestro Bimba with razors between his toes, and the legends made as capiera battled the clubs of the police, and usually won... Now reduced to a dance lol.

BUT but but...NO BOXING! Could it be that boxing greatness was a product of the environment? and no ethnic enclaves in particular? No genetic finesse? Just good old fashioned, hard @33 living? When the jews were the gangsters, you had jewish fighters, yes? The Irish before yes? Think it through think it through.... Ian Barklay was the toughest member of his gang in New York, the South Bronx...allegedlly except for his older sister, true story.

- -History of the world written in the geographic climes of the times, more specifically to the unparalleled history of Eurasia.

There's a reason why the arctic circle never produced any boxers of note. And even in Eurasia, the Chinese only just now in a few teensy wts.

Environment matters.

[Dynamite76]

Heres a fact...

Boxing seems to have attracted strong men from whomever was at the bottom of the economic totem pole at the time. Somehow all the genetics in the world could not challenge that trend until very recent times.

More facts? Heres an interesting one. brazil, a country with a smorgesboard of combat and culture,..a country with Japanese Samurai expats, free Black men and all variety of Creoles...NEVER had much boxing talent. I know I know Jofre was great, a few here and there... But can any of one explain to me a country with all varieties of complexion, and the most well educated combative lexicon of any country I can think of....Yet boxing is not represented well at all...WHY?

You want Judo do you? brazil has Japanese pre Kodokan teachers, lines of traditions uninterrupted by the Second World War...after the war when the best Judo that could be found in japan was a bunch of thugs throwing each other around the Kodokan mat while teachers shook their head, after losing years of development cause of the war.... The gracies came out of Judo lines Japanese in nature that flourished in Brazil!

You want wrestling? Catch Can, Lankinshire, Shoot fighting, All viable and active traditions in Brazil.... fighting each other getting better, evolving...

And fighting? Vale Tudo, Ju Jutsu, karate, Lutte Livre, all trying to gain an edge, evolution at its finest! Capiera, which was a fighting art used on the street, the equal of the Savate in marseilles alleys, could be found with the capieristas in the cities of Brazil... Maestro Bimba with razors between his toes, and the legends made as capiera battled the clubs of the police, and usually won... Now reduced to a dance lol.

BUT but but...NO BOXING! Could it be that boxing greatness was a product of the environment? and no ethnic enclaves in particular? No genetic finesse? Just good old fashioned, hard @33 living? When the jews were the gangsters, you had jewish fighters, yes? The Irish before yes? Think it through think it through.... Ian Barklay was the toughest member of his gang in New York, the South Bronx...allegedlly except for his older sister, true story.

If you are talking about the Black Spades, there was a guy by the name of Mitch Green in there that was tougher than him. Even Iran paid homage to him in his book.

[billeau2]

- -History of the world written in the geographic climes of the times, more specifically to the unparalleled history of Eurasia.

There's a reason why the arctic circle never produced any boxers of note. And even in Eurasia, the Chinese only just now in a few teensy wts.

Environment matters.

Its really an inescapable conclusion. Even if we look carefully, for example, at Japan...A country that traditionally sacrificed its sacred warrior caste to modernize, and has the same relentless zeal to bring in the new... And we see some decent Japanese boxers because of it.

meanwhile India with a warrior caste, Sikh martial arts, as precise and battle field tested as Japans' Samurai, and very little to see boxing wise.

And to add to the mystery, China, a land where there are boxing styles, even for duelling, very similar to how Western Boxing developed...and in a culture where Grappling was traditionally looked down upon, as beneath one... Yet again, very little activity to speak of.

[billeau2]

If you are talking about the Black Spades, there was a guy by the name of Mitch Green in there that was tougher than him. Even Iran paid homage to him in his book.

I was being a bit tongue in cheek. I do know Iran was considered a very tough hombre and that his sister allegedlly could fight very well and was known for such.

In New York City it seems there is always someone tougher, crazier... In my hood the farthest I ever saw the crazy chain extend was to a guy known as Crazy Alex... A thin guy with a Southern drawl, who allegedly had a container of Explosive Nitro above his bed on a bookshelf and who was...well "crazy!!" Crazy of course was a compliment in the hood. If someone thought you were tough they might try to test you, but crazy? If Crazy enough at least? People actually thought twice. I am sure that there were quiet guys, back from Vietnam (I knew a few of them)...guys that did not say much to anyone, who were more crazy than Alex. A scary thought!

Im thinking that with Iran it was a similar situation, even regarding Green. Those were some rough projects and that gang (The Black Spades) were known even in Harlem along with the Cassanovas, the Cosacks (a Borican motorcyle gang in East Harlem) and many others.