thoughts on overtraining....

[Prince Madison]

some good responses on here so far, thanks...

[Mr.MojoRisin']

At my old gym the trainer their acted like he was the best coach in the city. Always bragging about the different overseas gyms that wanted him to coach there and the different promoters like Golden Boy, Top Rank, etc. that were offering him 3 fight contracts for his fighters. Basically a bunch of bs.

Anyway, he didn't know boxing from his ass imo. The place was free for innercity kids so it was always a mixture of people in their 30s/40s training for fitness and pros/amateurs training for competition. The bad part was it was only open for a few hrs each day so the coach said he couldn't let us have an open gym. That pretty much meant everyone does the same thing at the same time. Ex. Everyone hits the bag, shadowboxes, warms up, calisthenics, competitors spar, etc.

The bad thing was his idea of a warm up was HIIT training. We never once stretched. To warm up we did 2 minutes of jogging followed by sprints for 30 seconds. We did this for about 20 minutes. Then we immediately jumped into shadowboxing for 6 rds. And by shadowboxing I'm talking about no stop full extension, full power punches. Calisthenics in between every rd. If one of the guys who wasn't there to compete, just for exercise, messed up ( keeping hands down, etc.) then everyone had to do some sort of punishment. I remember a few times we were forced to do 2 rds worth of squats fast rep. None of that slow ****. Then came the 6 rds of sparring which actually were easy for me. I sparred amateur champs and pro level amateurs, went tic for tac with everyone. After that it was heavy bag for 3-6 more rds followed by a warm down of endless calisthenics. The hardest we ever went was like 12 minutes of wall sits.

Anyway, I lost like 10 lbs. Felt like ****. The coach wanted me to compete at 132 and I knew if I did I would probably get knocked out. I felt so frail. I came in one day and he asked me for $70 to compete and I was like frick off. So I left and he sent another coach over to my house to try and get me to come back saying he would pay for everything if I compete for him. At this point I'm like **** no because I'm 132 and felt so dehydrated. I didn't think there was anything covering my ribs except skin tbh. Another thing is this coach was obsessed with fighters dehydrating and cutting massive amounts of weight. I remember this one guy who was about 170 lbs in fighting shape and the coach wanted him to cut down to 141. Another guy was 152 (teenager) in terrific shape and the coach wanted him to cut down to 141. I think the guy made it but ended up losing in the golden gloves a 5-0 decision. I blame that on bad coaching. This kid was pretty good for novice division. Great jab, fast hands, good head movement, good footwork, bad thing was he never put his punches together. Always relied on that jab. He had 20 lbs on me and I sparred him a couple of times. I have no doubt that if the coaches taught him a little bit better he could have won the tournament for his division. Absolutely.

They would take a good fighter and make him ****. I saw it too many times and knew I had to get tf out of there.

Looking back I'm glad I had the experience but I am also glad I made the smart move. I plan on bulking up to 160-170 then start training again doing calisthenics and boxing to get my weight down to a solid 152. Of course that's if I find a boxing gym that doesn't make everyone train together.

[MPX309]

Yes as someone who trains for hypertrophy in the gym, I'll confirm it's real. You may physically feel fine but if your central nervous system is still ****ed, then you may suffer from overtraining.

Signs of over training is when you can't complete a workout(s) that you may have been doing for weeks. Falling short on some final sets/reps. Also look for grip strength to diminish.

I simply work around this by implementing a deload week.
There are different ways to go about this, but my preferred method is to keep the weights the same, but for reps I usually target for 12, I'll do 8 instead

or if it's a 5x5 on a compound lift, I'll do 3x3

[HedonisticFrog]

Autophagy clears cell debris and damaged components, which build up inside of your cells and impedes their function! Autopahy basically clears unwanted metabolic garbage etc Its one of the main benefits of exercise, you should of learnt this on your university course.....

Listen mate, stop talking to me! I have already taken you apart once before on this part of the forum.

You claimed that Autophagy cleared toxins. Cell membrane components aren't toxins. Autophagy also has nothing to do with physical performance.

Also, you didn't answer my other question. Do you think Evander Holyfield was on steroids during his boxing career?

Stop being condescending, it doesn't help your argument at all. It just makes you seem like a dick.

[Kosta]

The person who said it's more under recovering than over training is right.

I used to be a big runner and kind of obsessed with keeping lean. I would run before I ate anything to hit my fat reserves straight up however I was also a student at the time and not a morning guy so I'd embark on these 1.5 hour runs (almost daily) at 1pm after no food.

Now as you can imagine I was sweating my entire body away with no help or buffer in the form of blood sugar as I was running on virtual fast. And I was also very thirsty as a result and so I drank water by the gallon.

Due to my anti fat mentality I was also avoiding all high sugar items which basically includes virtually any drink that isn't water and so I was not recovering any electrolytes

So I developed something called hypanetrema. Well done to the medics on here who already had that figured out

So yeah basically too much exercise can occur if u don't adequately replace what u use. Now this is why it's more us we recovery than overtraining because if you DO replace it then you can sufficiently recover. Michael phelps, most tennis professionals and some boxers train every day. They may eat 10,000 calories and consume inhuman amounts of sodium and magnesium to make up what they lose and take hour long ice baths - but if it hasn't killed u there is NO amount of exertion u can't recover from

Let's face it we are all amateur athletes here at best. We probably mostly had desk jobs and we don't have time to spend 5 hours a day preparing food and can't afford or source the amount of electrolytes these professional consume. We probably also are past our sell by dates (I'm a few years older then he average Olympian). But just because WE can't keep up with the demands of daily training - doesn't mean it can't be done. For professional athletes it's their JOB. They have no where else to be and nothing else to do but consume once their daily work out is done. Trust me, the limits of the human body are higher than u think

[HedonisticFrog]

The person who said it's more under recovering than over training is right.

I used to be a big runner and kind of obsessed with keeping lean. I would run before I ate anything to hit my fat reserves straight up however I was also a student at the time and not a morning guy so I'd embark on these 1.5 hour runs (almost daily) at 1pm after no food.

Now as you can imagine I was sweating my entire body away with no help or buffer in the form of blood sugar as I was running on virtual fast. And I was also very thirsty as a result and so I drank water by the gallon.

Due to my anti fat mentality I was also avoiding all high sugar items which basically includes virtually any drink that isn't water and so I was not recovering any electrolytes

So I developed something called hypanetrema. Well done to the medics on here who already had that figured out

So yeah basically too much exercise can occur if u don't adequately replace what u use. Now this is why it's more us we recovery than overtraining because if you DO replace it then you can sufficiently recover. Michael phelps, most tennis professionals and some boxers train every day. They may eat 10,000 calories and consume inhuman amounts of sodium and magnesium to make up what they lose and take hour long ice baths - but if it hasn't killed u there is NO amount of exertion u can't recover from

Let's face it we are all amateur athletes here at best. We probably mostly had desk jobs and we don't have time to spend 5 hours a day preparing food and can't afford or source the amount of electrolytes these professional consume. We probably also are past our sell by dates (I'm a few years older then he average Olympian). But just because WE can't keep up with the demands of daily training - doesn't mean it can't be done. For professional athletes it's their JOB. They have no where else to be and nothing else to do but consume once their daily work out is done. Trust me, the limits of the human body are higher than u think

First of all, it's hyponatremia. Hyponatremia is a lack of sodium, and has nothing to do with overtraining.

As for over training or under recovering it's the same thing but looking at it from a different angle. Overtraining is essentially training more than your body can recover from. You can try to increase your recovery, but you can only take that so far. Past that you need to cut back on your training volume if you're still overtraining. There most definitely is an amount of exertion you can't recover from, that's ridiculous. Try doing heavy sets of deadlifts to failure for two hours a day every day and see if you can recover from that.

[Kosta]

First of all, it's hyponatremia. Hyponatremia is a lack of sodium, and has nothing to do with overtraining.

As for over training or under recovering it's the same thing but looking at it from a different angle. Overtraining is essentially training more than your body can recover from. You can try to increase your recovery, but you can only take that so far. Past that you need to cut back on your training volume if you're still overtraining. There most definitely is an amount of exertion you can't recover from, that's ridiculous. Try doing heavy sets of deadlifts to failure for two hours a day every day and see if you can recover from that.

Apologies, I know I could have googled the spelling but I chose not too and I figured no one would actually give a damn

Yes it's a lack of sodium which in my case was caused my excess perspiration due to intensive training without adequate replacement. Endurance runners who don't properly rehydrate over prolonged periods often develop it.

I mean it seems like I could have saved the nhs loads of money and just posted on here then as apparently this is where the real experts live. I'm not the doctor, I didn't diagnose myself mate, I just did what the doc said son. Why don't you go have a word with them?

[PRINCEKOOL]

You claimed that Autophagy cleared toxins. Cell membrane components aren't toxins. Autophagy also has nothing to do with physical performance.

Also, you didn't answer my other question. Do you think Evander Holyfield was on steroids during his boxing career?

Stop being condescending, it doesn't help your argument at all. It just makes you seem like a dick.

You need to add something positive and enlightening to the thread, or get out of the thread! Go away and just log off-line....

You can twist what i have stated all you want, but the fact remains? That i have entered into this thread, and mentioned concepts of training and recovery that some people on this forum have never heard of before! (That is what i have brought to thread! It does not matter whether you agree with me 100% or not, people's perceptions upon exercise and recovery have slightly changed as a result of me entering into this thread!)....

All you have done throughout this entire thread is nip pick, and try to twist what i have stated. If Autophagy clears cell debris, which can disrupt the function of cells! and cells are components of every single tissue and organ in your body! Then autophagy is a variable in physical performance.

Long term the optimal regulation of autophagy can have a effect on physical performance. Scientist already know that ageD and sick people have a inability to regulate autophagy, and clear cell debris! (And as a result this effects theIR health and physical performance).

Autophagy and aging.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21884931

[PRINCEKOOL]

Apologies, I know I could have googled the spelling but I chose not too and I figured no one would actually give a damn

Yes it's a lack of sodium which in my case was caused my excess perspiration due to intensive training without adequate replacement. Endurance runners who don't properly rehydrate over prolonged periods often develop it.

I mean it seems like I could have saved the nhs loads of money and just posted on here then as apparently this is where the real experts live. I'm not the doctor, I didn't diagnose myself mate, I just did what the doc said son. Why don't you go have a word with them?

You are correct in your assumptions that lack of sodium can effect recovery, and physical performance. If this was not the case, then Olympic athletes would not be drinking electrolyte solutions. Without minerals & electrolytes your cells cannot produce enzymes and your nervous system cannot function properly, minerals are quite literally the spark of life! And exercise deplete minerals & electrolytes!

When ever you speak to somebody who thinks they know about training, all they will speak about is protein's, fats and carbohydrates. The biggest factor in my opinion in athletes health, is how well your body utilizes minerals! some people retain minerals and electrolytes better than others. This is why whole grain food is better for you, because it has not been depleted of minerals etc

[HedonisticFrog]

Apologies, I know I could have googled the spelling but I chose not too and I figured no one would actually give a damn

Yes it's a lack of sodium which in my case was caused my excess perspiration due to intensive training without adequate replacement. Endurance runners who don't properly rehydrate over prolonged periods often develop it.

I mean it seems like I could have saved the nhs loads of money and just posted on here then as apparently this is where the real experts live. I'm not the doctor, I didn't diagnose myself mate, I just did what the doc said son. Why don't you go have a word with them?

I'm not doubting they diagnosed you with hyponatremia. I also wasn't trying to be mean by pointing out the correct spelling, sorry if I came off that way. I was mainly trying to convey that what you experienced wasn't overtraining. As an EMT I've transported elderly patients with hyponatremia, and it definitely wasn't from working out too hard.