Trainers: Training that creates bad habits or is bad practice

[mconstantine]

What are some training techniques, drills, advice, sparring etc. that you've seen or heard of that you think are either just plain bad practice or create bad habits?

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

For me it's not what you teach wrong, but what you don't teach. Footwork is the single most important thing in boxing, and nothing is even close.

I don't care if you are a plodder, or have the athleticism of Roy Jones Jr. If you don't teach proper balance, movement and offense and defense with the feet, your done.

Start from the bottom and teach up.

[mconstantine]

For me it's not what you teach wrong, but what you don't teach. Footwork is the single most important thing in boxing, and nothing is even close.

I don't care if you are a plodder, or have the athleticism of Roy Jones Jr. If you don't teach proper balance, movement and offense and defense with the feet, your done.

Start from the bottom and teach up.

What do you think about Offense/Defense drills as a first step towards sparring?

I'm not a fan because it teaches bad habits. Offense should flow from defense and vice versa. If you train for them to not feed off of each other, you're establishing bad instincts.

[SplitSecond]

For me it's not what you teach wrong, but what you don't teach. Footwork is the single most important thing in boxing, and nothing is even close.

I don't care if you are a plodder, or have the athleticism of Roy Jones Jr. If you don't teach proper balance, movement and offense and defense with the feet, your done.

Start from the bottom and teach up.

that's some good advice

im off to work on my footwork(which i've been neglecting) now

[Ray Corso]

Theres NO one way to start training everyone. You might have a kid that can handle learning the jab techniques and at the same time you show how to defend it (prefered by me). Most kids can't take all that in so you work a certain way with them! Everyones aptitude is different so these types of discussions are BS unless you video yourself starting off and trainers could comment on the video.

I personally test eye hand coordination first and then movement. If a kid has horrible eye hand chances are it won't make any difference if he could ice skate! No hands, no eyes no chance!!! Ray

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

What do you think about Offense/Defense drills as a first step towards sparring?

I'm not a fan because it teaches bad habits. Offense should flow from defense and vice versa. If you train for them to not feed off of each other, you're establishing bad instincts.

They aren't bad if you teach them properly and in order. What I mean by order is this...

I train a fighter this way, the same way I was taught in Mexico and the way (IMO) it should be done.

#1 - Stance. I start by teaching them to stand. Now some people might think this takes 2 seconds, but you would be surprised as to what a proper stance is and how to hold it. Balance, proper frame, foot placement, hand placement, tucked chin, eyes up and alignment with the back foot and back are the keys.

#2 - Basic movement. Stepping forward, backwards and to the sides, all while keeping the stance we just worked on. Not jumping in, not shuffling your feet or any fancy footwork, just stepping. I go over this a MILLION times, so many times they get sick of it.

#3 - Defense. Catching, slipping, bobbing, weaving, basic distance, stepping as defense etc...

Basically what I'm trying to say is I don't focus on offense until way later. It is my responsibility to make sure the kid can protect him/herself. One of my biggest problems with trainers, is they don't take this sport seriously enough and how dangerous it is.

You are the trainer, you are responsible to make sure that kid is capable of competing or even sparring. I don't let kids spar until I feel they are ready because we spar hard. That could take as little as 4-6 months, or as long as a year if not longer.

Before sparring, I do situational drills. Specific defense of certain punches. repetition is the key. Do it so many times, it's just natural to them, they aren't thinking anymore, their body is just reacting.

Also, when I spar them, I always spar them with someone much better than they are. So the more experienced fighter can "work" with them. If I put two kids that are inexperienced, they go in there and kill each other. They don't learn from that.

[mconstantine]

They aren't bad if you teach them properly and in order. What I mean by order is this...

I train a fighter this way, the same way I was taught in Mexico and the way (IMO) it should be done.

#1 - Stance. I start by teaching them to stand. Now some people might think this takes 2 seconds, but you would be surprised as to what a proper stance is and how to hold it. Balance, proper frame, foot placement, hand placement, tucked chin, eyes up and alignment with the back foot and back are the keys.

#2 - Basic movement. Stepping forward, backwards and to the sides, all while keeping the stance we just worked on. Not jumping in, not shuffling your feet or any fancy footwork, just stepping. I go over this a MILLION times, so many times they get sick of it.

#3 - Defense. Catching, slipping, bobbing, weaving, basic distance, stepping as defense etc...

Basically what I'm trying to say is I don't focus on offense until way later. It is my responsibility to make sure the kid can protect him/herself. One of my biggest problems with trainers, is they don't take this sport seriously enough and how dangerous it is.

You are the trainer, you are responsible to make sure that kid is capable of competing or even sparring. I don't let kids spar until I feel they are ready because we spar hard. That could take as little as 4-6 months, or as long as a year if not longer.

Before sparring, I do situational drills. Specific defense of certain punches. repetition is the key. Do it so many times, it's just natural to them, they aren't thinking anymore, their body is just reacting.

Also, when I spar them, I always spar them with someone much better than they are. So the more experienced fighter can "work" with them. If I put two kids that are inexperienced, they go in there and kill each other. They don't learn from that.

You sound like an excellent trainer. My assumptions regarding offense/defense drills was that by the time someone's ready to spar, they should already know how to defend themselves and throw punches properly...so I question doing drills where you are ONLY practicing defense OR offense with a partner at one time.

If you have guys do offense/defense drills as prep for sparring, I would think shadow sparring would be a far more valuable drill because they can practice creating offense from defense and transitioning from offense to defense at the cadence of an actual fight without making contact.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

You sound like an excellent trainer. My assumptions regarding offense/defense drills was that by the time someone's ready to spar, they should already know how to defend themselves and throw punches properly...so I question doing drills where you are ONLY practicing defense OR offense with a partner at one time.

If you have guys do offense/defense drills as prep for sparring, I would think shadow sparring would be a far more valuable drill because they can practice creating offense from defense and transitioning from offense to defense at the cadence of an actual fight without making contact.

Oh ok I'm sorry for the confusion. Yes, I do what I call technical sparring or situational drills where we do offense, and then defend that offense and then counter with your own offense.

For example, I will usually start by teaching my kids to defend and counter the jab. Catching it, and countering with a jab. We move on to different types of jabs and let offense come from defense at all times. I can do defense and counter of body shots, upper cuts, 1-2's..etc.

One of my big things is I preach to always "finish". What I mean by that is, for example if you are hitting the mitts or shadow boxing for example, finish your combo with defense....ALWAYS. Either slipping off your shot, catching the counter you are imagining or just putting your hands up.

You can also shadow spar with light contact. Just touching your opponent.

[mconstantine]

Oh ok I'm sorry for the confusion. Yes, I do what I call technical sparring or situational drills where we do offense, and then defend that offense and then counter with your own offense.

For example, I will usually start by teaching my kids to defend and counter the jab. Catching it, and countering with a jab. We move on to different types of jabs and let offense come from defense at all times. I can do defense and counter of body shots, upper cuts, 1-2's..etc.

One of my big things is I preach to always "finish". What I mean by that is, for example if you are hitting the mitts or shadow boxing for example, finish your combo with defense....ALWAYS. Either slipping off your shot, catching the counter you are imagining or just putting your hands up.

You can also shadow spar with light contact. Just touching your opponent.

Finishing....that is good shiet. Never staying for the return receipt as Atlas says lol. Get your work off and either more your feet or head.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Finishing....that is good shiet. Never staying for the return receipt as Atlas says lol. Get your work off and either more your feet or head.

Yea absolutely, this is one thing I preach daily. Even if you are shadow boxing I get on you for not slipping or moving off.