Mayweather is A Prick

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Again, I don't really see your point on the money. Floyd's in no different a position to dozens of fighters before him. The businessmen that you speak of are addicted to making deals. Is Floyd addicted to the deals or boxing?

Thanks, but I know where Carr stands in the order of things. We were still only talking a few months before the Trinidad fight so the fans were over it pretty quick. It's not like Oscar was feeding us Bruseles or seriously shot second tier fighters for 3 1/2 years.

Everyone agrees he was out of order with Frazier but it's not like it was the norm. You're also implying that half of the country loved him. I doubt that half of the country even know who Floyd is. Do you really think that in 30 years time anybody will look back on anything that Floyd said with fondness?

Those stats of yours are very pretty on the surface but you know as well as I do that they don't reveal the whole story. It's too obvious to spell out so I'll just say that I'll take standard of opposition over lineage every time.

i will carefully explain my "point of the money": no matter how much you earn, you typically want to keep it, and the fans are not going to give you any money, in fact most of them are jut going to stop being your fans when you lose. so why on earth would you please the fans if that cost you 2million dollars a year (even if you are making already 15 a year or something like that)?

Mayweather had one controversial fight and immediately rematched Castillo. De La Hoya cannot say the same, Leonard cannot say the same. A lot of ppl thought Quartey won the fight, yet Oscar did not seem to ever entertain the notion of a rematch.

No, I doubt Mayweather will be fondly remembered in 30 years. he does not have charisma, Ali did.

you said how you were disgusted by floyd being ****y and talking about being the greatest. Well, ali talked about it when he had no case, except two shady wins against Liston. Oh but that's bcos he was young... bs ali was just as arrogant later on when he had a pretty damn good case. He had charisma to go with it and that's it.

The whole story? tell me the whole story. of those fighters I mentioned how many you think ruled all 3 divisions they were lineal in? none, with the exception of Armstrong. do you think they all beat great fighters to get their titles? sure great fighters like Kalule and Vargas

you favor standards of opposition over lineage? how do you determine standards of opposition? beating the man who beat the man is a pretty good "standard of opposition"

and mind you dont have to convince me that Mayweather is not on the level of Robinson, Duran or Armstrong, I know it already.

You have to convince me that two victories over Sonny Liston are a better claim to greatness than Mayweather's resume so far, becasue that's what you implied

[realheavyhands]

how can floyd retire when the parties just getting started .. he needs a ton more fights to be great

[Cletus Funk]

We'll have to accept that we disagree on the money thing but in essence the fans are the ones paying Floyd, whether it be in terms of tickets, PPV sales, general cable tv subscriptions or the advertising revenue which is based on the number of anticipated viewers.

Many people thought that Oscar won the Trinidad fight. **** happens.

The fundamental difference between Ali and Floyd is that Ali was basically saying "I'm the greatest, now watch me prove it", which he pretty much did. Floyd is saying "This is what I've done. If you you don't agree with me that I'm the greatest then you don't know what the **** you're talking about".

Too much weight is given to lineage. Lineage only dates back to the last time the title was vacated or stripped in most cases. I'd give more weight to a non-linear title clash against a Benitez or Hearns like Duran's attempts for the LMW belt than Floyd's win over Baldomir, without question. Floyd's been fairly fortunate in that his career's coincided with end of Hernandez's career and arguably a run of 5 of the worst linear WW champions in recent memory.

You don't really seem to be disagreeing with me on too much, it just seems like you're arguing for the sake of it. You're pretty much acknowledging that the guy's an arrogant prick even if you do feel that there are some mitigating circumstances. He has zero charisma, a delusional opinion of himself and what he's achieved and no respect for the history of the sport. It wouldn't bother me in the slightest if he retired right now. The sport really doesn't need him or his attitude.

i will carefully explain my "point of the money": no matter how much you earn, you typically want to keep it, and the fans are not going to give you any money, in fact most of them are jut going to stop being your fans when you lose. so why on earth would you please the fans if that cost you 2million dollars a year (even if you are making already 15 a year or something like that)?

Mayweather had one controversial fight and immediately rematched Castillo. De La Hoya cannot say the same, Leonard cannot say the same. A lot of ppl thought Quartey won the fight, yet Oscar did not seem to ever entertain the notion of a rematch.

No, I doubt Mayweather will be fondly remembered in 30 years. he does not have charisma, Ali did.

you said how you were disgusted by floyd being ****y and talking about being the greatest. Well, ali talked about it when he had no case, except two shady wins against Liston. Oh but that's bcos he was young... bs ali was just as arrogant later on when he had a pretty damn good case. He had charisma to go with it and that's it.

The whole story? tell me the whole story. of those fighters I mentioned how many you think ruled all 3 divisions they were lineal in? none, with the exception of Armstrong. do you think they all beat great fighters to get their titles? sure great fighters like Kalule and Vargas

you favor standards of opposition over lineage? how do you determine standards of opposition? beating the man who beat the man is a pretty good "standard of opposition"

and mind you dont have to convince me that Mayweather is not on the level of Robinson, Duran or Armstrong, I know it already.

You have to convince me that two victories over Sonny Liston are a better claim to greatness than Mayweather's resume so far, becasue that's what you implied

[potatoes]

Now understand this, I'm a fan of PBF but after watching his interview on ESPN with Brian Kenny yesterday I lost some respect for him. He said he's better than Sugar Ray Robinson and Ali, and when Kenny asked him how is he better when those guys fought way more than him. His answer was, it takes three months to build a paper view fight they couldn't pay me 10 million to fight every month. Personally either he's a dumb ass or he's just so hungry for money staying busy doesn't matter. Fighters back in the 60's and 70's fought like hell without all of this advanced medical technology and workout equipment. If Mayweather is basing his worth as a fighter off of how much he makes a fight he is truly a lost soul.

**** like that pisses me off but I just had to get that off my chest.

Haven't you seen any of his other interviews? Mayweather has been consistently acting like the world's biggest jerkoff his whole career. I think most of the fans go to his fights hoping he will get his head punched in. There is a way to punish this arrogant little ****head for his bad behaviour, just don't pay to see him fight. As long a Maywether can act like a jerkoff and get paid 5 or 10 million, he will continue to do so.

[Stromprophet]

i will carefully explain my "point of the money": no matter how much you earn, you typically want to keep it, and the fans are not going to give you any money, in fact most of them are jut going to stop being your fans when you lose. so why on earth would you please the fans if that cost you 2million dollars a year (even if you are making already 15 a year or something like that)?

Mayweather had one controversial fight and immediately rematched Castillo. De La Hoya cannot say the same, Leonard cannot say the same. A lot of ppl thought Quartey won the fight, yet Oscar did not seem to ever entertain the notion of a rematch.

A lot of fighters have lost and actually been able to make more money.

Ever wonder why PBF pay-per-view buys are merely "above average" (He is definitely losing money there, they could be a lot higher if he would bother to try to attract more fans, if he wants money that is)

De La Hoya, Sugar Ray Leonard, Vlad Klitchko, Berrara, Pac, Morales...

All of them made so much more money because they had wars, and had losses, and that made each of their stories even more intriguing, and generate tons of Pay-Per view buys.

You think Floyd-Baldy did many buys? Probably doesn't even get to 200,000. Pac vs. Morrales may get close to 500,000. You'd think Floyd would be concerned with that considering the split he could get on it.....

Which Leonard fight are you pointing to as controversial???

No way did Quartey win that fight. Oscar pulled it out in the 12th. Who was flurrying and doing the most damage and connecting the most in the last round? And who got knocked down 2 times as opposed to only 1? Nothing about the scoring of that fight was controversial.

[-EX-]

Haven't you seen any of his other interviews? Mayweather has been consistently acting like the world's biggest jerkoff his whole career. I think most of the fans go to his fights hoping he will get his head punched in. There is a way to punish this arrogant little ****head for his bad behaviour, just don't pay to see him fight. As long a Maywether can act like a jerkoff and get paid 5 or 10 million, he will continue to do so.

Don't cry because he's the best.

[wmute]

We'll have to accept that we disagree on the money thing but in essence the fans are the ones paying Floyd, whether it be in terms of tickets, PPV sales, general cable tv subscriptions or the advertising revenue which is based on the number of anticipated viewers.

the numbers are not made by the most hardcore fans i would guess, that's why oscar-mayw would make more money than more interesting fights, such as hatton-mayw

Many people thought that Oscar won the Trinidad fight. **** happens.

yes and in fact the public demanded a rematch which never happened. same story. In all this chat about how evil mayweather is, I have to point out again that Leonard and De La. Hoya dont have a history of clearing doubts by rematches. Mayweather did

The fundamental difference between Ali and Floyd is that Ali was basically saying "I'm the greatest, now watch me prove it", which he pretty much did. Floyd is saying "This is what I've done. If you you don't agree with me that I'm the greatest then you don't know what the **** you're talking about".

true, i also really doubt that he is going to retire, this is a Leoanrd bull**** pr trick.

Too much weight is given to lineage. Lineage only dates back to the last time the title was vacated or stripped in most cases. I'd give more weight to a non-linear title clash against a Benitez or Hearns like Duran's attempts for the LMW belt than Floyd's win over Baldomir, without question. Floyd's been fairly fortunate in that his career's coincided with end of Hernandez's career and arguably a run of 5 of the worst linear WW champions in recent memory.

Hearns beating Benitez, Duran and a few others made him be considered the lineal champ after leonard vacated the belt.

this is the most recent lineage

Baldomir, Judah, Spinks, Mayorga, Forrest, Mosley, De La Hoya.

Only Baldomir I would consider heavily sub-par. Mayorga does suck but he can throw on the table size and mad power (like a better version of margarito).

Definitely not the WW divisions Leonard or Hoya faced, not mayw's fault though.

(it's kinda like the 80s WWs after Leonard, Hearns, Duran all moved up in weight)

for the 135 title he beat castillo, which is a much much more serious victory than say Kalule or Vargas.

as for 130, what do you mean lucky? he won every round against Hernandez and made him quit

You don't really seem to be disagreeing with me on too much, it just seems like you're arguing for the sake of it. You're pretty much acknowledging that the guy's an arrogant prick even if you do feel that there are some mitigating circumstances. He has zero charisma, a delusional opinion of himself and what he's achieved and no respect for the history of the sport. It wouldn't bother me in the slightest if he retired right now. The sport really doesn't need him or his attitude.

we dont disagree much indeed, I just like to put this in historical perspective:

the sport has been full of pricks before, Leonard is much worse than Mayweather with respect to this point, and now (and then) I have to read how great he was, it just pisses me off.

I dont think mayw is bad for the sport, the way his fights is good enough to make up for all the bull**** he says IMO. Just like I hate Leonard, but it is always a pleasure to see him in the ring.

Moreover, if you followed the early career of mayw you would notice that he started as humble young man, then he saw he was not making any money (he was p4p #1 before having a PPV...), adn he turned into a bigmouthed, disrespectful prick. If anything it's the sport that was bad for his attitude.

[wmute]

A lot of fighters have lost and actually been able to make more money.

Ever wonder why PBF pay-per-view buys are merely "above average" (He is definitely losing money there, they could be a lot higher if he would bother to try to attract more fans, if he wants money that is)

De La Hoya, Sugar Ray Leonard, Vlad Klitchko, Berrara, Pac, Morales...

All of them made so much more money because they had wars, and had losses, and that made each of their stories even more intriguing, and generate tons of Pay-Per view buys.

none of those fighters is in a comparable situation with Floyd, they all had reasons outside the ring for being famous and loved:

Oscar - was HBO baby since the beginning, he even had a pop-music career, ffs.

Sugar Ray Leonard - would be a good example, but he fought from 30 to 20 years ago. As i wrote earlier, at the time you could afford a loss.

Wlad - he is a white HW, 'nuff said

Pacman - do i really need to explain that if pacman lost to a minimum weight by ko and then he tested positive for steroids, an entire country would blame it on socks/gloves and cheer him up onto the next fight (can you imagine something like that happening for mayw.?

Barrera and Morales - they are mexicans, they would probably be cast in exile if they didnt fight wars.

now imagine Mayw. losing a fight, and compare with the above. He is in Whitaker situation, he is not loved by the public, losing is something he cannot afford, he will not go to war to please one crowd, and risk future crowds


QUOTE=Stromprophet;1910683]
You think Floyd-Baldy did many buys? Probably doesn't even get to 200,000. Pac vs. Morrales may get close to 500,000. You'd think Floyd would be concerned with that considering the split he could get on it.....
[/QUOTE]

no, I dont. I am sure he is concerned, but who should he have fought? the only fights which would have made him more money were Oscar and Hatton, none of them was available.

Which Leonard fight are you pointing to as controversial???

controversial in the ring: Hagler

controversial because of out of the ring reasons: Duran 2 (and Hagler as well actually)

No way did Quartey win that fight. Oscar pulled it out in the 12th. Who was flurrying and doing the most damage and connecting the most in the last round? And who got knocked down 2 times as opposed to only 1? Nothing about the scoring of that fight was controversial.

see, I scored the fight for Oscar, but what you wrote in bold makes me think I should stop reading your posts.

[Joe Soap]

Comparisons between Mayweather and Ali and Robinson are farcical. The latter were brave men, the former simply is NOT. Rematching a guy that was killing himself for years to make weight, is not a sign of bravery.

[amagnin]

Comparisons between Mayweather and Ali and Robinson are farcical. The latter were brave men, the former simply is NOT. Rematching a guy that was killing himself for years to make weight, is not a sign of bravery.

I agree with you Mayweather has not come close to reaching the plateau that Ali and Robinson are on, but I don't think you can criticize him for granting an immediate rematch to a guy that gave him problems (especially considering boxing today).