Comments Thread For: Chavez Sr. On Why His Son's Career Declined, Canelo Big Rise

[DJTRUTH]

What is missing is that 8 years ago Martinez exposed the real issue, the lack of speed, movement, combination punching etc. that, along with outside ring issues and lack of discipline, prevented him from competing with high level opponents. Sure, he landed a single good shot that rocked Martinez in 12th, after he was exhausted from beating Jr. down for 11+ rounds. I mean, it was before the Martinez fight since he stopped anyone and that was a long, long time ago. He never really had the skills to compete with top guys is the point.

[DaBeastO]

I’m not a fan of JCC Jr at all, never rooted for him, but he wasn’t a bad fighter. He just never really applied himself.

He beat several good fighters like Andy Lee, Marco Antonio Rubio, Sebastian Zbik, Brian Vera, and John Duddy. Were these guys future HOF’ers? No. Did I think highly of any of them? Only Andy Lee and Brian Vera.

And yes, I know Vera’s record is bad, but when Chavez Jr beat him in 2013 Vera was the king of upsets having upset wins over Mora, Lee, and Dzinzurik. And I just plain and simple respect hard working journeymen like Brian Vera. Guys like him are real fighters. Guys you see in the gym working hard.

let's be real here chavez jr was a terrible fighter who for sure used performance enhancing drugs that allowed him to lose the weight he needed so he could fight against smaller guys. dude was a legit light heavyweight/cruiserweight fighting middleweights! his whole career is an asterisk!

[MulaKO]

What is missing is that 8 years ago Martinez exposed the real issue, the lack of speed, movement, combination punching etc. that, along with outside ring issues and lack of discipline, prevented him from competing with high level opponents. Sure, he landed a single good shot that rocked Martinez in 12th, after he was exhausted from beating Jr. down for 11+ rounds. I mean, it was before the Martinez fight since he stopped anyone and that was a long, long time ago. He never really had the skills to compete with top guys is the point.

Damn good point
Funny how fans of his thought he actually had a chance
Caught him with a good shot in the 12th and that’s it

[-Kev-]

let's be real here chavez jr was a terrible fighter who for sure used performance enhancing drugs that allowed him to lose the weight he needed so he could fight against smaller guys. dude was a legit light heavyweight/cruiserweight fighting middleweights! his whole career is an asterisk!

I have a different view of what a terrible fighter is. A terrible fighter would be someone like Usman Ahmed or Brian Sutherland.

What JCC Jr did is what a lot of fighters do. With fight night weigh ins being eliminated, most fighters take advantage of this by squeezing down to lower weights.

Chavez Jr absolutely did not have the body type for LHW-CW. He ended up LHW but when he was younger he was way too soft looking to be a “LHW-CW”. Dude had zero definition in his fights at MW.

Also, 6’ in height would actually be on the shorter side for LHW’s, and especially short for CW.

His soft looking body at MW showed that he was not applying himself.

[Kannabis Kid]

I have a different view of what a terrible fighter is. A terrible fighter would be someone like Usman Ahmed or Brian Sutherland.

What JCC Jr did is what a lot of fighters do. With fight night weigh ins being eliminated, most fighters take advantage of this by squeezing down to lower weights.

Chavez Jr absolutely did not have the body type for LHW-CW. He ended up LHW but when he was younger he was way too soft looking to be a “LHW-CW”. Dude had zero definition in his fights at MW.

Also, 6’ in height would actually be on the shorter side for LHW’s, and especially short for CW.

His soft looking body at MW showed that he was not applying himself.

Yeah Chavez Jr should never have fought anywhere above 168 but he was never disciplined enough to even try after losing to Martinez. I like Chavez Jr he was not a boring fighter and he did have decent skills just not that fast I agree with what his dad said after he got money he deviated from training properly and it always showed.

His win over Andy Lee was really good if you compare it to how other Middleweights fared against him like Peter Quillin and Matvey Korobov that win looks pretty good considering Korobov gave Charlo all he could handle while Lee was able to put him out, and Quillin well he was more hype than anything but he did have some solid fights and was a good puncher who had a tough fight with Andy.

Chavez destroyed Andy that was the best he ever looked in my opinion and if he would've stayed with the same dedication I'm sure he could've had some good match ups at 168 but at this point he doesn't have that will anymore he looked ok against Jacobs while it lasted but unfortunately he didn't want to continue and that's 2nd time he's done that already so it's bound to happen again don't think he can beat any of the top level 168's anyway he should retire before he gets hurt.

[thedarkness]

Easy, he wasn’t disciplined and never really applied himself. JCC Jr was not a “bad” boxer by any stretch. Just lazy and complacent. He grew up as the son of a legend so he probably felt in the back of his mind that he didn’t have to work THAT hard to gain fame.

And he was right, he inherited fame from being JCC’s son, and so he didn’t work as hard as someone who came into the game having to make their own name, like Canelo Alvarez.

Idk if Canelo Alvarez came from a boxing family or if it was only him and his brothers who fought but I doubt Canelo’s father was some popular, legendary boxer. The way Canelo boxes clearly shows he is a student of boxing and the way he stays in shape shows he is disciplined and has not allowed fame to get to his head. He clearly always applies himself in every fight.

Tldr; the difference, in my eyes, JCC Jr is lazy, didn’t earn his fame on his own, not disciplined. Canelo applies himself, earned his own fame, stays disciplined even though he’s wildly popular.

Canelo's dad is a legend.
His name is floyd mayweather jr

[DaBeastO]

I have a different view of what a terrible fighter is. A terrible fighter would be someone like Usman Ahmed or Brian Sutherland.

What JCC Jr did is what a lot of fighters do. With fight night weigh ins being eliminated, most fighters take advantage of this by squeezing down to lower weights.

Chavez Jr absolutely did not have the body type for LHW-CW. He ended up LHW but when he was younger he was way too soft looking to be a “LHW-CW”. Dude had zero definition in his fights at MW.

Also, 6’ in height would actually be on the shorter side for LHW’s, and especially short for CW.

His soft looking body at MW showed that he was not applying himself.

there's weight classes not height classes. him having no definition is irrelevant plenty of guys don't have the genetics to be shredded like that. you also never addressed my point of chavez jr being a PED user. take that away and he's a terrible fighter. he only made it that far because he was built up protected and guided carefully by the best promoter in the game in Top Rank and because of his father's name. chavez jr being a lazy slob is just the cherry on top LOL.

[budfr]

What is missing is that 8 years ago Martinez exposed the real issue, the lack of speed, movement, combination punching etc. that, along with outside ring issues and lack of discipline, prevented him from competing with high level opponents. Sure, he landed a single good shot that rocked Martinez in 12th, after he was exhausted from beating Jr. down for 11+ rounds. I mean, it was before the Martinez fight since he stopped anyone and that was a long, long time ago. He never really had the skills to compete with top guys is the point.

Because Chavez Jr didnīt train for that fight, duh. Funny how a guy receiving hunfreds of punches and assimilating them for 11 rounds just throws one and almost kills Martinez, the one who did train his ass off.....

[budfr]

JCChavez Jr. was doing fine before quitting vs Jacobs. If Julito was so bad why didnīt Jacobs destroy him in 1 round??

[-Kev-]

there's weight classes not height classes. him having no definition is irrelevant plenty of guys don't have the genetics to be shredded like that. you also never addressed my point of chavez jr being a PED user. take that away and he's a terrible fighter. he only made it that far because he was built up protected and guided carefully by the best promoter in the game in Top Rank and because of his father's name. chavez jr being a lazy slob is just the cherry on top LOL.

I doesn't matter if there are weight classes. A quick glance at a weight class shows you what the average height for that weight class is. The lower weight classes for example, will have shorter boxers. The higher weight classes, have taller boxers. It's common sense. Tyson Fury, with his 6'9" stature, most likely can't fight anywhere under HW. It is very unlikely for Roman Gonzalez to put on enough mass to up to welterweight without looking extremely soft, fat, and out completely out of shape.

When choosing a weight class you will campaign in, your height 100% has a say in that. A coach will look at everything, from your height, to how your body looks and will tell you what weight class you should fight in.