Bread man claims on Twitter that Martinez criminally ducked GGG lol

[Tails]

Martinez sort of gets a pass because although Golovkin was the main threat at that time by everybody without biasedness, Martinez was already showing signs of being shot in his last few outings before Cotto. It is obvious he did not want the Golovkin fight and it is also understandable. At that time everyone was gunning for Martinez because he was basically a sitting duck.

Step aside money or not, I do not think Cotto was ever going to face Golovkin. He would likely have vacated if Golovkin did not accept the offer giving him another vacant title pickup which he would probably get even more criticism for.

The only boxer I can say 100% straight up swerved GGG was Quillin. That was a big matchup at the time and Quillin opted for Jacobs who he viewed as damaged goods from the Pirog bout and cancer ordeal.

[JohnCastellanos]

Negotiations never even got that far, the 45/55 is at the discretion of the WBC, but they never made any announcement on it, and its most likely they would have been more generous to Canelo if it had gone to purse. As far as I recall. Oscar cited Canelo's legal issues and they walked away. From what Loeffler said they fully acknowledged they were the B side and were willing to be flexible with it but it just never reached that point.

What we do know is that Oscar said in early 2015 that a Golovkin fight was a 'superfight' but that it was maybe two years away and needed time to build and that Canelo needed time to acclimatise to 160. We also know that in '16 when Canelo vacated that essentially a plan was in place with Loeffler for the fight to happen sept 17.

IDK, just looks to me that what actually transpired is what Oscar /GBP planned all along. Ain't faulting anyone, that's just the way the sport is... Money guys call the shots. They were smart to wait IMO.

Canelo said he vacated because they were trying to impose a percentage split. We can easily find that for you. But nevertheless the negotiation had everything to do with it and when they finally did fight they paid GGG 25percent. And that would support our argument that it was the money

[xxlefthookxx]

This is and the date and Sergio Martinez age is the only part that is relaxant.

"Sergio will be out for at least a year. You saw his last fight, he won it on guts and will and balls alone. He had no knee, he had no hand, and I'm not sending a champion who is 38-years-old - after a year plus layoff - into a ring with this guy. I'm not saying they will never fight. I'm not speaking for Sergio, who is a grown as man and controls his own career. The successor to Sergio Martiknez has already been determined and the next great middleweight is Triple G."

What is your take? Lou is not saying that an offer has been made from ggg camp, he’s also not saying that Martinez is not interested. But he is admitting that it makes zero cents to fight Golovkin. The rest of the article is pure narrative and agenda

I'm not sending him into a ring with this guy...
Yet he sent a 38 yr old into the ring with Cotto.
A duck is when the opponent most feel is worthy to actually fight for the title (being the man) is denied the opportunity and replaced with a fighter of perceived lesser ability and lower chances to win.
Duck. Avoided. Cash Play. It is the same. But in a sport that is not concerned about defining a champion, it is to be expected.

[JohnCastellanos]

I'm not sending him into a ring with this guy...
Yet he sent a 38 yr old into the ring with Cotto.
A duck is when the opponent most feel is worthy to actually fight for the title (being the man) is denied the opportunity and replaced with a fighter of perceived lesser ability and lower chances to win.
Duck. Avoided. Cash Play. It is the same. But in a sport that is not concerned about defining a champion, it is to be expected.

GGG was never denied the opportunity because the opportunity never existed. GGG was mentioned publicly “one” time in between Martinez last 2 fights. Martinez was retired by Cotto before ggg was on the radar

[Citizen Koba]

Canelo said he vacated because they were trying to impose a percentage split. We can easily find that for you. But nevertheless the negotiation had everything to do with it and when they finally did fight they paid GGG 25percent. And that would support our argument that it was the money

No he didn't, at least not that I've ever seen. He just said he wouldn't negotiate under false deadlines and certain fans chose to interpret that as meaning more than what was said.. At no point did Canelo or Oscar state or even suggest that GGG and Loeffler were trying to force the purse bid, at least not that I ever saw. In fact it was the WBC that Canelo was criticising. Either way even after they dropped the belt the negotiations basically stopped at Oscar insisting it wasn't happening until September 17, in line with what he'd said back in 15. If they'd wanted the fight any sooner they presumably could have carried on negotiating irrespective of Canelo's legal issues.

Course, the money can never be ignored and quite possibly it was a consideration, but my take is simply that 2017 at 160 was always the plan. I'm a big fan of Occams razor and if a powerful promoter says he intends to make a fight in 2 years and it happens in 2 years it ain't really necessary to look for more complicated explanations.

[Citizen Koba]

Martinez sort of gets a pass because although Golovkin was the main threat at that time by everybody without biasedness, Martinez was already showing signs of being shot in his last few outings before Cotto. It is obvious he did not want the Golovkin fight and it is also understandable. At that time everyone was gunning for Martinez because he was basically a sitting duck.

Step aside money or not, I do not think Cotto was ever going to face Golovkin. He would likely have vacated if Golovkin did not accept the offer giving him another vacant title pickup which he would probably get even more criticism for.

The only boxer I can say 100% straight up swerved GGG was Quillin. That was a big matchup at the time and Quillin opted for Jacobs who he viewed as damaged goods from the Pirog bout and cancer ordeal.

Quillin was the other side of the promotional / network cold war, man. Whatever noises they both made that fight was never happening any more than any of the other suggested match-ups with SHO affiliated fighters. The only fights between fighters on different sides on the wall during that period were either those too big to pass by like Pacquaio Maywether or too small for anyone to care about (like Golovkin Wade, where Haymon made sure to gouge HBO for every cent).

Jacobs was on the same side of the fence and the fight brought Quillin at least the payday he would have got fighting GGG whilst he was still a titlist, probably more.

However Peter Quillin is the subject of one of the very few situations where I call a legitimate 'duck', when a fighter refused to fight a mandatory even when there ain't an alternative fight with a greater purse attached. Refusing to defend against Korobov was just inexplicable to me, although the suggestion has always been that he was compensated handsomely by Haymon who was unwilling to risk losing leverage to TR.

On the Maravilla thing though, absolutely he gets a pass in my opinion. Ain't no fighter - especially of that age - should be expected to fight for anything other than the biggest paydays they can possibly get.

[Thuglife Nelo]

Quillin was the other side of the promotional / network cold war, man. Whatever noises they both made that fight was never happening any more than any of the other proposed match-ups with SHO affiliated fighters. The only fights between fighters on different sides on the wall during that period were either those too big to pass by like Pacquaio Maywether or too small for anyone to care about (like Golovkin Wade, where Haymon made sure to gouge HBO for every cent).

Jacobs was on the same side of the fence and the fight brought Quillin at least the payday he would have got fighting GGG whilst he was still a titlist, probably more.

However Peter Quillin is the subject of one of the very few situations where I call a legitimate 'duck', when a fighter refused to fight a mandatory even when there ain't an alternative fight with a greater purse attached. Refusing to defend against Korobov was just inexplicable to me, although the suggestion has always been that he was compensated handsomely by Haymon who was unwilling to risk losing leverage to TR.

Was Quillin ever given an offer? Quillin was a Haymon Champion. You know Haymon would tell Quillin a minimum for unification.

[Citizen Koba]

Was Quillin ever given an offer? Quillin was a Haymon Champion. You know Haymon would tell Quillin a minimum for unification.

As far as I know no offer was ever sent by either side (assuming you're talking bout Quillin vs Golovkin rather than Korobov here). It just wasn't happening, effectively no significant fights were happening between SHO and HBO affliated guys with the obvious exceptions like Floyd vs Pac or a few mandatories. That's why I wouldn't consider either side was avoiding it. The business rivalries were far bigger than the decisions of the individual fighters.

[Thuglife Nelo]

As far as I know no offer was ever sent by either side (assuming you're talking bout Quillin vs Golovkin rather than Korobov here). It just wasn't happening, effectively no significant fights were happening between SHO and HBO affliated guys with the obvious exceptions like Floyd vs Pac or a few mandatories. That's why I wouldn't consider it a duck by either side. The business rivalries were far bigger than the decisions of the individual fighters.

Quillin ducked Roc Nation, whom had Cotto, Rigo, and Ward.... you know who advises that.... and look where it took him still being loyal on the upcoming PBC.

Fighters vacate. Fans like speculate cowardice. Think about Canelo vs GGG. Canelo being the most dominant money maker being forced 2 weeks to a deal or purse bid with K2. We know what happened. Or GGG vacating for Sergey. Or Quillin for Korobov. These are all money related influences, not legitimate “ducks.”

[Citizen Koba]

Quillin ducked Roc Nation, whom had Cotto, Rigo, and Ward.... you know who advises that.... and look where it took him still being loyal on the upcoming PBC.

Fighters vacate. Fans like speculate cowardice. Think about Canelo vs GGG. Canelo being the most dominant money maker being forced 2 weeks to a deal or purse bid with K2. We know what happened. Or GGG vacating for Sergey. Or Quillin for Korobov. These are all money related influences, not legitimate “ducks.”

That's pretty much how I see the world of boxing, man. Far as I'm concerned all these dudes are all pretty much willing to fight whoever they can, accusing any professional boxer of cowardice is beyond ridiculous. The professional sport is ultimately about making money and given the set up every fighter should in fact be expected to use every bit of leverage they have to get the best return and to use what leverage they can to get the most advantageous circumstances.

Make no mistake, the fighters are motivated by the titles and the glory too - these are generally ego driven mfers with enormous self belief who want to excel, but by the time they reach the pinnacles of their career the money that can be made by and off them essentially ensures that financial concerns always take the driving seat, or at least should if they got any half decent mangement.