Why do some fighters get credit for taking 'risks'?

[Boxing_1013]

I know Canelo and Floyd fans may take offense from this thread..but it is not my intent to rile them up...they are just the most recent examples of being the A-side/examples of my point here...I think they are both great boxers and never saw Floyd get worked over in the ring for a whole fight...and Canelo has always impressed me every time I have seen him fight.

But when you are a fighter...and you basically control one of the greatest risks you can have in a fight...which is that the judging will basically always favor you...how can that guy really get credit for taking big risks?

Like when Nelo fought Lara or Trout...yeah he stepped up I guess...but he also knows those guys can't hurt/KO him, and that he would be reasonably competitive with them and would always get the cards in that case...in a way it is like no risk.

Could say the same for him with the Jacobs fight...Cotto...GGG 1 I give him credit for taking the fight, but to be fair he didn't really come to fight that night, and tried to mimic the Jacobs gameplan which won Danny a few rounds...Nelo/his team probably knew that if he did similar there he could at worst get a draw etc on a couple cards.

For Floyd - I mean in his Money May days he knew that if he went 12 rounds with anyone he was getting the win in Vegas...he knew which guys would possibly give him trouble (I think) and also knew (from sparring/stories etc) who he could at worst go 12 with and in that case again he is getting a W.

Taking 'risks' is taking on a guy in his hometown/neutral...like Spence did with Brook, or like some of the Eastern Euros have done lately...taking on a guy on neutral/away terms is a real risk...taking them on, on your terms, is good business, don't get me wrong...but it isn't really taking a risk, when you know you will at worst be pretty competitive and then the cards will be in your favor.

I just have never really understood the logic that those guys were really taking risks...again, they have made good money decisions, and what is more important than that...but real risks are what Ali did facing George Foreman in Zaire...stuff like that is why many consider him the greatest, even though he had some blemishes.

I will say that Canelo going up to 175 to face Kov is a bit of a risk imo...but again, similar to the first GGG fight...if he knows that he can go 12 rounds with Kov, then how big of a risk is it really? He will probably get a good decision in that case, so where is the risk.

Not to get on him for that fight...because I do think it is a good fight and I applaud him for going up and taking it...but those fights become easier to take when you know you control the scoring.

[nino brown21]

every fight is a risk. some one just passed away the other day. most boxers are never the same after a fight that's why matchmaking is important for longevity and a fighters health. so I think instead of criticizing every little move a fighter makes we should applaud them for risking they're lives in every fight

[Tony Trick-Pony]

Yeah, the A-side crap is well, crap.

Usyk is a great example of recent risk-taking. Usyk unified at cruiser but he beat Glowacki, Huck, Bredis, Gassiev and Bellew all in their own backyards. That is one hell of a damn run. Considering that one was a former king of the division and three were unbeaten and Bellew was a solid pro with lots of world class experience, I think that's true risk-taking.

Canelo and Floyd both took on risky fights but like you say, they had an ace in the hole every time. Is it smart? Sure. But a bit dull? Yes.

I think there are plenty of guys who risk and honestly don't give a damn. They sometimes don't get the benefit of the doubt with the judges but oh well. They move on. A loss doesn't shatter everybody's self-confidence. Not everyone cries when they lose their "0". As they shouldn't. Most guys don't get to be that interesting until they have a loss. Then they actually learn that everything won't be served on a silver platter for them. Thank God for losses.

Anyway, when it comes down to it, I agree. When you have certain advantages, the risk factor goes way down. Usyk deserves praise in this area. Canelo and Floyd not so much.

[tophat1]

Yeah, the A-side crap is well, crap.

Usyk is a great example of recent risk-taking. Usyk unified at cruiser but he beat Glowacki, Huck, Bredis, Gassiev and Bellew all in their own backyards. That is one hell of a damn run. Considering that one was a former king of the division and three were unbeaten and Bellew was a solid pro with lots of world class experience, I think that's true risk-taking.

Canelo and Floyd both took on risky fights but like you say, they had an ace in the hole every time. Is it smart? Sure. But a bit dull? Yes.

I think there are plenty of guys who risk and honestly don't give a damn. They sometimes don't get the benefit of the doubt with the judges but oh well. They move on. A loss doesn't shatter everybody's self-confidence. Not everyone cries when they lose their "0". As they shouldn't. Most guys don't get to be that interesting until they have a loss. Then they actually learn that everything won't be served on a silver platter for them. Thank God for losses.

Anyway, when it comes down to it, I agree. When you have certain advantages, the risk factor goes way down. Usyk deserves praise in this area. Canelo and Floyd not so much.

I would have to agree with this

[Thuglife Nelo]

Yeah, the A-side crap is well, crap.

Usyk is a great example of recent risk-taking. Usyk unified at cruiser but he beat Glowacki, Huck, Bredis, Gassiev and Bellew all in their own backyards. That is one hell of a damn run. Considering that one was a former king of the division and three were unbeaten and Bellew was a solid pro with lots of world class experience, I think that's true risk-taking.

Canelo and Floyd both took on risky fights but like you say, they had an ace in the hole every time. Is it smart? Sure. But a bit dull? Yes.

I think there are plenty of guys who risk and honestly don't give a damn. They sometimes don't get the benefit of the doubt with the judges but oh well. They move on. A loss doesn't shatter everybody's self-confidence. Not everyone cries when they lose their "0". As they shouldn't. Most guys don't get to be that interesting until they have a loss. Then they actually learn that everything won't be served on a silver platter for them. Thank God for losses.

Anyway, when it comes down to it, I agree. When you have certain advantages, the risk factor goes way down. Usyk deserves praise in this area. Canelo and Floyd not so much.

The best part is people eating the TS’s bait. This guys is always parading the GGG vs Canelo series debate about who won and is always hating on Canelo.

The irony is his thread title and 154-168 is easy. It is the same mentality of years for GGG fanboys saying “but why does he hate to move up?!” People don’t even realize how much bigger GGG is compared to Hagler. Canelo moves anywhere above 160 and it’s all “cherry picking,” and any criticism towards GGG for years and there was always shared cliche excuses from fans being rinsed without them really thinking and pretending to know the sport!

And you think Bellew was good or that Usyk took a risk with him? Cmon dude...

[Tony Trick-Pony]

The best part is people eating the TS’s bait. This guys is always parading the GGG vs Canelo series debate about who won and is always hating on Canelo.

The irony is his thread title and 154-168 is easy. It is the same mentality of years for GGG fanboys saying “but why does he hate to move up?!” People don’t even realize how much bigger GGG is compared to Hagler. Canelo moves anywhere above 160 and it’s all “cherry picking,” and any criticism towards GGG for years and there was always shared cliche excuses from fans being rinsed without them really thinking and pretending to know the sport!

And you think Bellew was good or that Usyk took a risk with him? Cmon dude...

Usyk fought in everybody's backyard. When did Floyd fight in another country? How many of his fights were in his comfort zone in Vegas? And Canelo? When did he fight in the other man's backyard? And Bellew wasn't a huge risk but the other champions Usyk fought were and Bellew was a lot trickier than people give him credit for as well. Hell, like Floyd and Canelo only fought killers. Berto? Chavez, Jr.? Liam Smith? Please...

[Thuglife Nelo]

Usyk fought in everybody's backyard. When did Floyd fight in another country? How many of his fights were in his comfort zone in Vegas? And Canelo? When did he fight in the other man's backyard? And Bellew wasn't a huge risk but the other champions Usyk fought were and Bellew was a lot trickier than people give him credit for as well. Hell, like Floyd and Canelo only fought killers. Berto? Chavez, Jr.? Liam Smith? Please...

You're all over the place with this! First of all, ALL PROFESSIONAL fighters worldwide aren't going to even question Floyd or Canelo's selling power for A-Side location. To acknowledge the purses means you must acknowledge the venues that provide those bags. You know this.

Also, Floyd and Canelo are types in the American continent that have financial backing because of their fans. Glowacki, Huck, underdogs so it makes sense to host those fights in their countries. Gassiev was 50/50, and the WBSS knew how to properly bank on the location. Or would you have preferred the Ukraine or a neutral location for the Gassiev unification?

And Bellew vs Usyk was a joke. Usyk carried Bellew in that fight. If Adonis and Makabu, all Southpaws, could rattle Bellew - whose kryptonite is a straight left - you think he'd stand a chance against an Olympian like Usyk? stop...

This has nothing to do with discrediting Usyk, Canelo or Floyd because they've all done their parts moving up in weights it seems this conversation is pointless unless you want to talk about my real point in 154-168... but yeah, you didn't touch on that at all from the TS's point...

Not unusual from the once upon a time GGG purists. Yes we know, those years were a waste of time and Loeffler stole minds from that period. what a shame. was never suckered by any of that stuff

[Robbie Barrett]

Moving up and fighting much bigger guys voluntarily deserves credit. We have weight divisions because it's such a huge disadvantage. Instead of choosing to camp at a weight division like Golovkin, Canelo chooses to take bigger challenges, nothing but respect.

[ruedboy]

Alvarez began his career as a teen and grew into a MW.
How does he get credit for that?
From 160, he moved up to a CW 164 vs Chavez Jr. and to 168 vs Rocky Fielding.
Lots of fans were impressed by this but the smart money knew he was heavily favored to win both fights.
Personally, I think the more challenging fights were at MW.
If Alvarez really wanted to impress at a higher weight, why not fight a riskier, more competitive fighter?

[moochi]

I know Canelo and Floyd fans may take offense from this thread..but it is not my intent to rile them up...they are just the most recent examples of being the A-side/examples of my point here...I think they are both great boxers and never saw Floyd get worked over in the ring for a whole fight...and Canelo has always impressed me every time I have seen him fight.

But when you are a fighter...and you basically control one of the greatest risks you can have in a fight...which is that the judging will basically always favor you...how can that guy really get credit for taking big risks?

Like when Nelo fought Lara or Trout...yeah he stepped up I guess...but he also knows those guys can't hurt/KO him, and that he would be reasonably competitive with them and would always get the cards in that case...in a way it is like no risk.

Could say the same for him with the Jacobs fight...Cotto...GGG 1 I give him credit for taking the fight, but to be fair he didn't really come to fight that night, and tried to mimic the Jacobs gameplan which won Danny a few rounds...Nelo/his team probably knew that if he did similar there he could at worst get a draw etc on a couple cards.

For Floyd - I mean in his Money May days he knew that if he went 12 rounds with anyone he was getting the win in Vegas...he knew which guys would possibly give him trouble (I think) and also knew (from sparring/stories etc) who he could at worst go 12 with and in that case again he is getting a W.

Taking 'risks' is taking on a guy in his hometown/neutral...like Spence did with Brook, or like some of the Eastern Euros have done lately...taking on a guy on neutral/away terms is a real risk...taking them on, on your terms, is good business, don't get me wrong...but it isn't really taking a risk, when you know you will at worst be pretty competitive and then the cards will be in your favor.

I just have never really understood the logic that those guys were really taking risks...again, they have made good money decisions, and what is more important than that...but real risks are what Ali did facing George Foreman in Zaire...stuff like that is why many consider him the greatest, even though he had some blemishes.

I will say that Canelo going up to 175 to face Kov is a bit of a risk imo...but again, similar to the first GGG fight...if he knows that he can go 12 rounds with Kov, then how big of a risk is it really? He will probably get a good decision in that case, so where is the risk.

Not to get on him for that fight...because I do think it is a good fight and I applaud him for going up and taking it...but those fights become easier to take when you know you control the scoring.

100% Agree and most neutral fans know this.

Two other important factors which favor the A fighter are the below:

1 - the opponent knows that he cannot win by fighting a normal fight (e.g GGG outworked him clearly), yet got robbed, so some fighters HAVE to fight outside their gameplan which also risks their own gameplan, mental state, etc.

2 - the opponent is getting a top pay day and after a couple rounds of realising they ain't gonna KO the A fighter, they think "well fck it, i'm not going to KO him, so i'll just take the money" - this is pretty much what i expect Kovalev to do once he realises after 2 - 3 rounds that he won't be able to KO Canelo, so he'll just settle for a cruise as he'll be thinking i can't win by KO and i'm not gonna get a points win, so i'll just cruise easily for the $$$ and be happy with that.