DAZN #1 Global sports streaming app

[Ray*]

It seems like the same posters who keep wishing DAZN to fail are the ones who defended PBC to the death when others wished PBC would fail

Yep, they are the same exact posters that I was referring to in my previous post. I was one of them, use to be one of them. Funny how those posters are now on the outside wanting the death of another network. I use to be side by side with them criticising those that were wishing the death of PBC back then, funny this posters can’t keep their energy on.

[Motorcity Cobra]

Yep, they are the same exact posters that I was referring to in my previous post. I was one of them, use to be one of them. Funny how those posters are now on the outside wanting the death of another network. I use to be side by side with them criticising those that were wishing the death of PBC back then, funny this posters can’t keep their energy on.

Yep. I want boxing in America to be seen by as many people as possible. Why do you want the opposite if you're a fan of the sport? Why would a fan of the sport want to see the sport get less popular?

[Thuglife Nelo]

Yep. I want boxing in America to be seen by as many people as possible. Why do you want the opposite if you're a fan of the sport? Why would a fan of the sport want to see the sport get less popular?

Finally my son you are seeing the light. Forget Haymon dude. You’re a smart lad, but the PPV’s are trash, and it’s sad that a guy like you who appreciates boxing was rolling with the LDBC like an idiot. You know DAZN growth is inevitable. This is how rational people think, which is why you’re turning around like a good boy.

Remember you said this:

“I want DAZN to fail because this is a niche sport.”

Repent my son! Your sins are forgiven. Haymon is Satan! And Popeyes chicken sandwiches are really made to give colon cancer. Stop following the LDBC.

Sincerely,
-Yuri Foreman

[Boxing_1013]

I moved around some of your replay to better address them.

This is what I mean. It is great for you and me as individuals because we are saving money but bad for the sports long term health. 20 dollars for a Canelo fight is unstainable DAZN is going to have to either continue to raise their prices or move to some sort of PPV model. The problem is they have people like you that now expect PPV to cost 20 instead of 75.

This would not be an issue if DAZN could grow the sport and bring in millions of new fans willing to pay 20 dollars. But, the reality is there are only about 1.5 to 2 million people maximum that will pay for a fight. As much as we grumble about paying 75 bucks we paid it. What there never was are people that would have paid 20 dollars for a fight but not 75.

What I am really getting at is the DAZN business model replaced the Million people that would pay 75 for a Canelo fight or about 75 million dollars in the boxing economy with 600,000 people paying 20 dollars or about 12 million. That is over 60 million removed from the boxing economy.

When DAZN fails and it will that is money that will mostly not return. Which gets me back to my last sentence from the original post. Big fights will be harder to make when you have a B+ side to A side that will expect 5 million plus but the money is no longer there. It will be hard for a while to expect fighters to go back to being happy about taking a million or 2 million flat fee or accept they can't get a 4.5 million guarantee against a PPV that will get 500k buys.




Overpay is not even the right word for what they are doing. They overpaid for Canelo because realistically in market without DAZN he would still likely get 20-25+ million per fight guarantee. So given they are a new platform and brand they had to go over the top but they did not go ****** here. The problem is everyone else and they are not overpaying a little they are overpaying 5 to 10 times what they would be paid in a world without DAZN.

To use that Dervy GGG fight again. That fight would have to be one of the 25 biggest fights ever held to come close to break even. DAZN is bleeding money showing boxing.

I think you make some good points...I would say that in general with fighters you see them, once they hit a certain pay level, they don't want to take a pay cut for future fights...Canelo, Floyd, Ward, McGregor etc...all come to mind in recent times...so I wouldn't really blame any future situation like that on DAZN.

I also think that DAZN has a different business model currently than anything we have seen before...it is really hard to estimate how many annual subs they have for the $100 annual rate, and also how many bumps they get during the year at the $20 per month rate, to justify paying the prices they are paying fighters.

We would have to have access to their balance sheet to see in what ways they are deriving income, and then also what their fixed and past/future costs are...just kind of a guessing game at this point as to their viability currently and in the short-long term.

I would say though that there are a lot of people, like me (and maybe you) who would be in the market for the $20 per fight model, rather than the $80 per fight model....simple math will tell us that you would need 4x the amount of people tuning in at the $20 rate to make it work similar to the $80 model.

But the model DAZN has of retaining subs and getting constant cash flow in, with the annual subs and then the few monthly inflows from the big fights throughout the year...well a lot of businesses would love to have a cash flow centric business model...PPV at those $80 rates is all too random...the rates/model DAZN is more viable in a way because of the cash flow.

I definitely see what they are trying to do as a business and it can work...hard to really say how viable they are though without perusing the balance sheet though.

As I mentioned a week or so ago, I've gotten about 5 or so fights so far with my DAZN purchase this summer that I've really enjoyed...and now will get a GGG fight, Canelo-Kov, and AJ Ruiz 2....that is quite a value imo for $100.

[Boxing_1013]

I never get that, the same people who want PBC to succeed and use to defend PBC and wonder why anyone would want them to fail (Like 3/4 years ago) are now wanting the downfall of DAZN. This is one thing I don’t get, I was one of those people who backed PBC when they first came into the boxing market, I use to criticise those that wanted them to fail.

Since then those same posters that were on the same page as me with the whole PBC thing are now the ones wanting the downfall of DAZN. Asking how many subs they have, coming here with paid shill adverts on how DAZN is going down etc

Makes you wonder why they are doing all of that.

I really wonder if some people are getting paid to post on here...seems outlandish sometimes, but other times it makes too much sense.

I wasn't really around on this site during the PBC days...I support DAZN mainly because they are eliminating, at this time, the high priced PPV model which I hate...I have no real issues with Haymon...and I like there being different competitors in the marketplace anyway...competition in a free market always leads to better quality products at a cheaper cost...so I am all for that.

My 2 cents is that Arum with ESPN, every solid fight is on ESPN+, and every fight that is pretty good they put on PPV...give or take a few of course...fortunately I have ESPN+, but if I didn't I basically would get no good fights there...and still miss out on the ones that go to PPV.

To be honest I am kind of underwhelmed with Haymon's tenure so far...I like the thought of free boxing...but I don't really like the matchups we have really been given so far with his stable...what is going on now at 147 is a notable exception though...but at the same time, Spence-Porter, that is a $15 fight for me...an $80 PPV, I just can't do that at all.

But I do agree with you that hoping that any of those ent-ities fail, well just because you woke up on the wrong side of the bed, well that's crazy imo!...should back the results and products imo, not who is behind them.

[Motorcity Cobra]

I really wonder if some people are getting paid to post on here...seems outlandish sometimes, but other times it makes too much sense.

I wasn't really around on this site during the PBC days...I support DAZN mainly because they are eliminating, at this time, the high priced PPV model which I hate...I have no real issues with Haymon...and I like there being different competitors in the marketplace anyway...competition in a free market always leads to better quality products at a cheaper cost...so I am all for that.

My 2 cents is that Arum with ESPN, every solid fight is on ESPN+, and every fight that is pretty good they put on PPV...give or take a few of course...fortunately I have ESPN+, but if I didn't I basically would get no good fights there...and still miss out on the ones that go to PPV.

To be honest I am kind of underwhelmed with Haymon's tenure so far...I like the thought of free boxing...but I don't really like the matchups we have really been given so far with his stable...what is going on now at 147 is a notable exception though...but at the same time, Spence-Porter, that is a $15 fight for me...an $80 PPV, I just can't do that at all.

But I do agree with you that hoping that any of those ent-ities fail, well just because you woke up on the wrong side of the bed, well that's crazy imo!...should back the results and products imo, not who is behind them.

What's outlandish about wanting American boxing to grow and be on the same platforms as NFL, NBA, NHL and even soccer. Soccer has made major inroads in America because it's been on broadcast tv. Now major cities have professional soccer teams. Unfathomable just 25 years ago.

What nobody can explain to me is how DAZN helps American boxing grow.

[Boxing_1013]

What's outlandish about wanting American boxing to grow and be on the same platforms as NFL, NBA, NHL and even soccer. Soccer has made major inroads in America because it's been on broadcast tv. Now major cities have professional soccer teams. Unfathomable just 25 years ago.

What nobody can explain to me is how DAZN helps American boxing grow.

Man you know I like ya...I really do...and I think you have a fair point on some of that stuff.

And if the other networks weren't charging PPVs, and had all their fights on cable, or for a low price, I would love it.

I would also say that imo, in today's era, the gladiator sports are not going to be promoted and publicized that heavily, even if they were always on mainstream TV...imho stars will be born in these sports by the force of their personality, with talent obviously helping...and with the use of social media.

Look at Conor McGregor...he didn't rise to fame by being on network TV..he rose to fame because he made a name for himself in the media/social media...that gets your name recognition out there, and then from there people become interested in you and follow you, and follow you to your fights and platform.

Floyd imo wasn't a star due to fighting on network TV...he was a star because he generated enough attention over the years, and it kept snowballing, and a lot of people kept tuning in to see him get beat...when it never happened, they kept doubling down, and the story grew and grew.

I just think to be a star, you need to have the personality, and the talent, and they then need to study how some of the recent stars have made it happen...being the bad guy always seems to help...

[daggum]

What's outlandish about wanting American boxing to grow and be on the same platforms as NFL, NBA, NHL and even soccer. Soccer has made major inroads in America because it's been on broadcast tv. Now major cities have professional soccer teams. Unfathomable just 25 years ago.

What nobody can explain to me is how DAZN helps American boxing grow.

it helps saudi boxing. why doesnt anyone care about the poor saudis! they are our greatest allies! stand with saudia

[andocom]

Exactly, I didn't see any Tyson fights on free TV, same goes for Floyd and McGregor. Stars aren't made by free TV.

Also remember how a PPV gets broken down between the Promoter/Cable Company/Network, dazn doesn't have to pay that cable company tax.

Say a $80 PBC Showtime PPV is really:
$8 for Showtime.
$36 for PBC.
$36 for your cable company.

So $80 is a bit steep for a lot of people, but $20 sounds fine, so 2.5X will take that deal, use 1 million PPV to make it a round number, that PPV is $44M for Showtime & PBC, but $50M for Dazn & GBP/Matchroom. Obvious made up numbers but it shows you don't need to do 4X to get equal revenue.

Dazn aren't paying your cable company anything so right off the bat almost half of your PPV price is saved, 45% is outrageous but what can you do they have that market locked, or they did before the internet and streaming video.

Lets face it, long term not only is cable PPV dead, but cable & broadcast TV are as well, and they all know this. Pay a cable company 45% to carry a video stream, something that realistically costs maybe 50c, good luck. Demand your viewers watch when you want, again good luck with that. I work with the advertising industry and believe me, everyone knows how this ends. Very well might not be dazn, but it will be their model.

[Phenom]

Exactly, I didn't see any Tyson fights on free TV, same goes for Floyd and McGregor. Stars aren't made by free TV.

Also remember how a PPV gets broken down between the Promoter/Cable Company/Network, dazn doesn't have to pay that cable company tax.

Say a $80 PBC Showtime PPV is really:
$8 for Showtime.
$36 for PBC.
$36 for your cable company.

So $80 is a bit steep for a lot of people, but $20 sounds fine, so 2.5X will take that deal, use 1 million PPV to make it a round number, that PPV is $44M for Showtime & PBC, but $50M for Dazn & GBP/Matchroom. Obvious made up numbers but it shows you don't need to do 4X to get equal revenue.

Dazn aren't paying your cable company anything so right off the bat almost half of your PPV price is saved, 45% is outrageous but what can you do they have that market locked, or they did before the internet and streaming video.

Lets face it, long term not only is cable PPV dead, but cable & broadcast TV are as well, and they all know this. Pay a cable company 45% to carry a video stream, something that realistically costs maybe 50c, good luck. Demand your viewers watch when you want, again good luck with that. I work with the advertising industry and believe me, everyone knows how this ends. Very well might not be dazn, but it will be their model.

How many fights that realistically be on PPV that was shown on DAZN since it launched?