Canelo testing positive for Clen/PEDS

[Boxing_1013]

It is surreal and the "fans" of this sport are a joke.

Canelo, 27 year old in his prime, rising super star finally moves up to 160lbs to fight hype job [their words] GGG at 36 years old in his twilight and gets completely embarassed the first time around and is only saved because of some ridiculous score card even the most die hard Canelo cant defend.

Then he gets busted for PEDs heading back into the rematch. The timing is pretty damn suspect if ask me.

And then again, he, imo, loses another decision that should have been 7-5 GGG.

It's not just these two fights that are suspect but nearly his entire career is suspect. The first fight was a CLEAR victory for GGG. The second should have been scored a GGG win it a draw.

I'm low on Canelo because of those suspect score cards and the fact he actually got busted for PEDs. I think hes a great talent, but definitely not ATG because of that.

People rag on GGG because of his weak resume but I doubt there is a single fighter, including floyd on Canelos resume that GGG couldnt beat. The margin between GGG and Canelo is razor thin, but if Canelo in his prime needed help to squeeze by an old GGG I doubt he could have beaten a younger GGG.

I personally dont want to see GGGvs Canelo 3 because GGG will need the knock out, but the recent firing and hiring of a new coach makes me believe that GGG believes he can out box Canelo. You might think I'm crazy when I say that but when GGG started to box and not Mexican style in the 2nd fight he found a lot of success.

Good post man, we share a lot of the same opinions. I remember following GGG years ago and was impressed by his amateur pedigree when I started researching him. He has always shown a lot of good boxing skills in his career yet for whatever reason has not seemed to get much respect for them from some, or even most, groups.

He starts everything off with that great jab of his and that is the ideal way to do it. I think a lot of his resume is him dominating various good-really good fighters of all different styles, so I give him credit for that. I think a lot of other fighters would have had slip ups during that run, or would have at least gone to decision in a close fight. Never happened for him and I think that is impressive.

I want him to get the 3rd (and 4th or 5th lol) Canelo fight, as long as he retains his health, so he gets the big payday(s). I think some people will never give him respect in the ring no matter what he does, so he may as well get paid.

It is disappointing when we as fans can't agree on what should be clear victories for fighters, regardless of what the judges may say. I think 19/20 times there is a clear winner in a fight, and 1/20 times it is a 7-5 6-6 either way type of fight.

But such is life. That's why we are called fans I guess - we are fanatical. I try to keep it real with what I see in the ring but I am sure I have my biases like anyone else. But I do always try to score it how I see it, and honestly do not care at all if my guy wins a fight. Just never really enters my mind to try and give 'my fighter' rounds he doesn't deserve.

[R-Hand Southpaw]

Good post man, we share a lot of the same opinions. I remember following GGG years ago and was impressed by his amateur pedigree when I started researching him. He has always shown a lot of good boxing skills in his career yet for whatever reason has not seemed to get much respect for them from some, or even most, groups.

He starts everything off with that great jab of his and that is the ideal way to do it. I think a lot of his resume is him dominating various good-really good fighters of all different styles, so I give him credit for that. I think a lot of other fighters would have had slip ups during that run, or would have at least gone to decision in a close fight. Never happened for him and I think that is impressive.

I want him to get the 3rd (and 4th or 5th lol) Canelo fight, as long as he retains his health, so he gets the big payday(s). I think some people will never give him respect in the ring no matter what he does, so he may as well get paid.

It is disappointing when we as fans can't agree on what should be clear victories for fighters, regardless of what the judges may say. I think 19/20 times there is a clear winner in a fight, and 1/20 times it is a 7-5 6-6 either way type of fight.

But such is life. That's why we are called fans I guess - we are fanatical. I try to keep it real with what I see in the ring but I am sure I have my biases like anyone else. But I do always try to score it how I see it, and honestly do not care at all if my guy wins a fight. Just never really enters my mind to try and give 'my fighter' rounds he doesn't deserve.

Good post and definitely green K.

I know I have my biases but if you are aware of your own bias you can use it to help you be more objective with your opinion.

For example. People think GGG is only a big puncher who relies on his granite chin to beat opposition into defeat. Now these "fans" take that false narrative and apply that to the Canelo only because it fits their agenda.

Look at all the people on this forum who rooted for Canelo. So many of them wanted Canelo to win just because GGG is white/eastern euro whatever. And when he didnt "Mexican style" Canelo there is no way he could have won.

But a real boxing fan knows that despite boxers having distinct styles it's how they adapt in fights that makes them great or not.

In the first fight GGG did have a hard time hitting Canelo but he won the fight easily because of his jab and ring generalship. Canelo did display great defense, but flashy defense doesnt give you "more points " and neither does "body punches". You cant pick and choose what works to fit your agenda.

GGG has great defense also. Maybe a slight notch under Canelo, but it's not as flashy so for the normal casual they dont see it. One guy literally posted a clip of what he thought was Canelo laying it to GGG and for real, it was nothing but GGG showing great defense. He pulled on a punch, rolled with the hook that followed and smothered the body shot after that.

Do people think great defense is just making punches miss? Because reducing damage is also great defense. It's just like when GGG uses elbows to block body shots. Subtle but no one looks for it because they choose not to.

I was genuinely suprised myself when GGG started to box. Usually come forward fighters struggle to fight on the back foot but he looked completely natural. That was a far cry from what Canelo did the first fight. While Canelo retreated corner to corner and literally did laps in the ring GGG fought off his back foot and nearly the entire fight kept the fight in the middle of the ring. I think Canelo had GGG on the ropes maybe once?

This is why I think GGG split with Abel. When Abel said he was losing, I think it was maybe round 8? I had the fight pretty even at that point and was like what?

Abel probably thought GGG was losing because he abandoned the game plan. It's like people say, some trainers dont know what they're talking about because they're not the one taking the punches. GGG seemed to agree.

Even as a GGG fan and a boxing fan I know that if you're the older slower guy it's a dumb idea to stand a trade with someone who has almost has as much power as you and is faster than you. That's a dumb idea.

That's why GGG hooked up with Banks. It's not that GGG needs to play safe, like kiltscho style, but he believes he can out box Canelo. The thing though is will his body hold up? In boxing terms he is ANCIENT. Most people dont keep boxing this far into their careers especially at the highest level.

And yes. Unlike all the other Canelo fans who tell you jabs mean nothing the jab is literally the first punch you use/learn and it sets up your offense. Sometimes you dont even need anything other than the jab, especially when you have a jab like GGG which isnt used at all to set up his power punches when it's a power punch itself. If its snapping peoples head back and they're eating it all night who cares to throw anything else especially when your opponent is waiting to counter the follow up.

[pasawayako]

No big deal. Canelo with PEDS is just fine.

[kidbazooka]

Serious question - why doesn't anyone care that Canelo pissed dirty and got popped for PEDs? Like it hasn't hurt his image or earning ability at all. People just haven't cared.

My opinion is that of the 3 fan groups out there:

1) Floyd fans don't care because if he succeeds, it makes Floyd look good. Especially if he has success against GGG who they also hate.

2) Canelo fans will back him regardless. They just haven't seemed to care one bit.

3) GGG fans want the payday that comes from Canelo so they haven't made a big deal about it.

What are everyone else's thoughts?

If any other fighter pissed dirty like that I would just think they would lose a ton of support and Canelo didn't lose one fan. It's kind of surreal when you think about it.

Seems like that all ppl talk about around here.

Better question is why don’t people care about Tyson Fury and Saunders testing positive for PEDs?

[Combat Talk Radio]

Serious question - why doesn't anyone care that Canelo pissed dirty and got popped for PEDs? Like it hasn't hurt his image or earning ability at all. People just haven't cared.

My opinion is that of the 3 fan groups out there:

1) Floyd fans don't care because if he succeeds, it makes Floyd look good. Especially if he has success against GGG who they also hate.

2) Canelo fans will back him regardless. They just haven't seemed to care one bit.

3) GGG fans want the payday that comes from Canelo so they haven't made a big deal about it.

What are everyone else's thoughts?

If any other fighter pissed dirty like that I would just think they would lose a ton of support and Canelo didn't lose one fan. It's kind of surreal when you think about it.

You forgot the 4th group.

4) Boxing fans who saw the man serve his time, get ramped up testing before the second G fight and the Jacobs fight and come out clean, and realize that at some point, you have to stop punishing a non-repeat offender especially with only trace amounts found.

[Curtis Harper]

I feel the way everyone in BOXING feels. It's a non issue. Of all the scandals, Nelo's is the least of them by an extremely wide margin.

[Curtis Harper]

That ''Always hated him'' selection !!!!!

The emotional crew signing in
They're the ones who tainted his beef.

[Boxing_1013]

Good post and definitely green K.

I know I have my biases but if you are aware of your own bias you can use it to help you be more objective with your opinion.

For example. People think GGG is only a big puncher who relies on his granite chin to beat opposition into defeat. Now these "fans" take that false narrative and apply that to the Canelo only because it fits their agenda.

Look at all the people on this forum who rooted for Canelo. So many of them wanted Canelo to win just because GGG is white/eastern euro whatever. And when he didnt "Mexican style" Canelo there is no way he could have won.

But a real boxing fan knows that despite boxers having distinct styles it's how they adapt in fights that makes them great or not.

In the first fight GGG did have a hard time hitting Canelo but he won the fight easily because of his jab and ring generalship. Canelo did display great defense, but flashy defense doesnt give you "more points " and neither does "body punches". You cant pick and choose what works to fit your agenda.

GGG has great defense also. Maybe a slight notch under Canelo, but it's not as flashy so for the normal casual they dont see it. One guy literally posted a clip of what he thought was Canelo laying it to GGG and for real, it was nothing but GGG showing great defense. He pulled on a punch, rolled with the hook that followed and smothered the body shot after that.

Do people think great defense is just making punches miss? Because reducing damage is also great defense. It's just like when GGG uses elbows to block body shots. Subtle but no one looks for it because they choose not to.

I was genuinely suprised myself when GGG started to box. Usually come forward fighters struggle to fight on the back foot but he looked completely natural. That was a far cry from what Canelo did the first fight. While Canelo retreated corner to corner and literally did laps in the ring GGG fought off his back foot and nearly the entire fight kept the fight in the middle of the ring. I think Canelo had GGG on the ropes maybe once?

This is why I think GGG split with Abel. When Abel said he was losing, I think it was maybe round 8? I had the fight pretty even at that point and was like what?

Abel probably thought GGG was losing because he abandoned the game plan. It's like people say, some trainers dont know what they're talking about because they're not the one taking the punches. GGG seemed to agree.

Even as a GGG fan and a boxing fan I know that if you're the older slower guy it's a dumb idea to stand a trade with someone who has almost has as much power as you and is faster than you. That's a dumb idea.

That's why GGG hooked up with Banks. It's not that GGG needs to play safe, like kiltscho style, but he believes he can out box Canelo. The thing though is will his body hold up? In boxing terms he is ANCIENT. Most people dont keep boxing this far into their careers especially at the highest level.

And yes. Unlike all the other Canelo fans who tell you jabs mean nothing the jab is literally the first punch you use/learn and it sets up your offense. Sometimes you dont even need anything other than the jab, especially when you have a jab like GGG which isnt used at all to set up his power punches when it's a power punch itself. If its snapping peoples head back and they're eating it all night who cares to throw anything else especially when your opponent is waiting to counter the follow up.

Great post man - we see things much the same way. Basically agree with everything you said.

I will be interested to see how GGG looks in a 3rd Canelo fight, or even against another good fighter at his age.

As you alluded to, I think Canelo learned some things from the first fight, and changed his style a bit to stand more in front of GGG. He started to get comfortable there with where he wanted to be distance wise.

As a result, and since GGG was having trouble with Canelo's speed at that range, he improvised and starting boxing and moving some, as you said still keeping the fight in the center of the ring. Thought it was a great improvisation from him and thought it won him the fight. That and the fact that imo he ran through Canelo in rounds 9 10 and 11.

Those early rounds Canelo's speed will always trouble GGG imo, relatively speaking. And those mid-late rounds, GGG's workrate and constant pressure will always bother Canelo since he will have slowed down by that point, and his stamina issues are probably always there for him to some extent.

But great insights man, glad to see someone else on here who is not a complete fanboy and actually analyzes impartially what goes on in fights.

I will say I think GGG is still basically the same guy he always was - if he is aging much I think he is doing it very gracefully in the ring. I just think a prime Canelo, with his hand speed and general style, would always be a somewhat tough matchup for GGG. GGG's only real flaw is he is not the fastest at MW. With everything else he is basically number 1.

But GGG is a bad matchup for Canelo (and anyone else) too, because of his constant scoring (jab mainly), workrate, and boxing skills. It is just so hard to win clean rounds against him because of those things, and he almost always has quite a few clear rounds in his favor, if he isn't getting the KO. Just a great fighter.

[Boxing_1013]

You forgot the 4th group.

4) Boxing fans who saw the man serve his time, get ramped up testing before the second G fight and the Jacobs fight and come out clean, and realize that at some point, you have to stop punishing a non-repeat offender especially with only trace amounts found.

Fair enough - I basically am in that category myself - and when I made a poll after that post I included a section for that (though I do still think the result was shady, and am still su****ious of him today - but I think over 50% of guys are juicing so I don't really care I guess).

I will say this though - the next fan I find on here who has no real rooting interest for GGG, Canelo, or Floyd/Wilder etc, that will be the first!! Lol. I'm sure there are a few on here though.

[Boxing_1013]

Seems like that all ppl talk about around here.

Better question is why don’t people care about Tyson Fury and Saunders testing positive for PEDs?

Just seems like he is a bigger star now than he was before - but as others said, winning and time can do that for someone.

Good points about Fury and Saunders btw - it hasn't really affected Fury much at all has it. Saunders has never really been a star though so I think people just don't really care about him.

If anything I'm pissed he pissed dirty and we didn't get to see Andrade Saunders.