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Mosley and De La Hoya were multiple peoples leftovers too. Both those fights mean nothing beyond money for both Pac and Floyd. They were old and washed up and both had been inactive like crazy before Floyd fought them.
Pacquaio has stepped into the ring with 4 great fighters in his career. Prime Marquez, prime Barrera and Morales and Mayweather. Mayweather has stepped into the ring with two Marquez and Pacquaio but the weight for the Marquez fight was obviously a joke so kind of disqualifies that and Pacquaio was washed up too.
Mayweather was very calculated about who he fought and when. Pacquaio less so at one point hence the fact he's fought better guys at better times.Comment
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Roach is right for once or maybe this is a rare moment when I absolutely agree with this mf
lol
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Regarding Roach's comments I think he'd beat Garcia, Porter easily enough but he'd have to receive some damage and problems getting past Spence and Thurman (which he would), but Crawford would beat him. His counter punching, versatility, intelligence and discipline would be a tough out.Comment
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Mosley had DESTROYED the "most avoided" boxer in Margarito so NO he was not washed up. He also held a lineal belt then and was the top guy at WW so your point is really moot and illogical.
Oscar was the biggest name Floyd could have fought at the time and had to agree to Oscar's demand of Ring size, Glove size, Judge selection, Weight, Ref plus purse split. Oscar was NOT washed up and was not coming off losses like Mosley or Rios or Mathysse or Broner (if that's Pac's next fight). But Oscar was weight drained in the PAC fight and had lost to Floyd so the advantages were all there for PAC and Freddie Roach said EXACTLY those words. If you follow boxing then you know how weight plays into stamina.
PAC did fight Morales BUT he lost one of the fights.
PAC did fight Barrera twice. 2nd fight was meaningless
PAC did fight Marques 4 times and those fights were all too close to call. That alone tells you PAC was not great. He got beat by these guys. Do you understand that? He got beat or got close wins hence the rematches.
More important, those fights were at 126. Do you think PAC could have fought Floyd at 130 or 125 or even 140?
As for the Marquez fight, Marquez himself is on record saying that the extra weight in the Floyd's fight would not have mattered. Floyd was just too fast and too good that's why he never bothered to ask for a rematch. Your logic seems to suggest that there is a possibility that Marquez could have beaten Floyd if the fight was at 144Ibs. Two years later, an older version of Marquez knocked out Marquez so go figure.
As for Floyd being calculating, that's just nonsense. Floyd moved up to 140 in 2004. He beat Gatti and the two guys at that weight are both on record in refusing to fight Floyd. Hatton and Cotto. This is on record. Both admitted it.
So Floyd moved up to 147 in 2006. the two belt holders then were Zab and Baldomir. He beat both and had leverage. At the time Floyd was not a PPV star. In fact Gatti was the reason Floyd was on PPV at 140.
I know you are going to say he ducked Cotto and Margarito but both guys were promoted by Arum and that fight would not have happened. More important, there was no way those two guys could have beaten Floyd. Especially the cheat Margarito.
After that Floyd fought belt holders at WW. Guys that weren't coming off losses or inactivity.
Guerrero was the WBC belt holder had only one loss eight years prior.
Ortiz had a fight of the year with Berto and held the WBC belt. Mosley had beaten Margarito and was a belt holder.
Cotto was the lineal champ at 154 and had two belts
Canelo was a belt holder at 154 and he is the one that called out Floyd and offered the catch weight (below is the proof).
Marquez was a big name and had arguably won all his three fights against Manny.
At 140 and 147 Manny has literally fought BUMS and ducked all the big names. Like try and fight Thurman or Porter three years ago. WTF
Lastly, In 2008 and 2009, Roach was on record so many times saying Manny was not ready for Floyd. For a guy who was in his prime then why would he not be ready for Floyd? That just tells you.
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Margarito was avoided by who? Floyd? That's about it. Williams had already beaten him and he got caught cheating not long after so it's possible he just ******. Mosley was 38 and had been out the ring for about 18 months in addition to that he'd only won about half his fights the last 8 years coming into the Floyd fight. He was washed up. What did he do in his next fight? Get a draw with Sergio Mora.
I stopped reading at the Pacquaio not being great. Too long winded and sounds like a fanboy and a hater. I actually disliked Pacquaio his whole career and attended the Marquez fights in person. Pacquaio is a great fighter without question and in what planet was the first Barrera fight close? It's a fact Mayweather has never entered the ring as good as that Barrera or the Marquez Pacquaio fought between 2004-2008. Marquez had barely left 126 and had only had two fights at 135 and then jumped up to 147 over night. No gradual buildup. For perspective when Floyd was fighting Oscar at 154, Marquez had his first fight above 126. 12 months prior they were three weight classes apart. It's irrelevant what would happen if they are the same size because it's mythical what's important is that the fight mattered not one bit because of the disparity in weight and size. Marquez by 2012 had a little more time to get up to the weight and he was fighting a guy from the same weight classes in Pacquaio. Marquez being a 126 pounder until he was 33 and Manny being at 130 until he was around 30 at the same age Floyd was at 154.
Also thought I'd add this. You don't think Pacquaio is great because of difficult fights with Barrera and Marquez, both of whom are great. That's cool. But I think you are diminishing the quality for Marquez and Barrera too. Like I said Marquez and Pacquaio are the only two great boxers Floyd ever fought and you seem like you love Floyd and probably think he's TBE or close right? Well you've just admitted Floyd only ever fought one great fighter and then that opens you up further that maybe Marquez isn't great? I love Marquez, he's my all-time favorite but I think Pacquaio rates higher than him historically (though I had him 4-0 h2h) so in your estimation it's arguable/probable Floyd never even beat one great fighter? WOW. Not sure how he can be TBE if he never even fought a great fighter.Last edited by chrisJS; 11-01-2018, 01:10 PM.Comment
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