Why the constant false comparison of modern heavyweights to ancient heavyweights?

[SN!PER]

Hercules would probly be like a super middleweight by today's standards.

I'd whoop him bad.

[daggum]

valuev is clearly the best heavyweight of all time. look how big he was

[Robbie Barrett]

OP is right. Old HW's like Marciano wouldn't be HW's today. They wouldn't be able to compete with the best HW's of the past 25 years. Marciano was the size LHW's are today.

[boliodogs]

Old heavyweight champs Jess Williard at 6 foot 6 inches and 250 pounds and Primo Carnera at 6 foot 6 inches and 260 lean pounds were as big as almost any modern heavyweight champ. When comparing and rating heavyweights I don't go old against new. I go man against man. I consider their size, skills, stamina, punch resistance and punching power and make my choice. I don't think great heavyweights of the past like Jack Johnson, Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey, Rocky Marciano, Sonny Liston and Ali would be over matched against today's Wilder and AJ. Those guys could fight their ass off, punch like the kick of a mule, take a punch and had great stamina. Ali wasn't a great puncher but he made up for that with extra speed. Johnson wasn't a huge puncher but had great skills. The rest of them were real punchers with both hands and had lots of speed. They were great then and would be great today. Ray Robinson is still the number 1 choice as the all time best PFP after all these 75 years or so since he was in his prime. Many of today's heavyweights weigh so much because they are hog fat. If they were as lean as Dempsey or Louis they would be closer to 200 pounds than the 250 blubbery pounds they weigh. AJ and Wilder are lean and Wilder's 220 pounds and AJ's 240 pounds are lean weights but both of them have many other flaws.

[Robbie Barrett]

Old heavyweight champs Jess Williard at 6 foot 6 inches and 250 pounds and Primo Carnera at 6 foot 6 inches and 260 lean pounds were as big as almost any modern heavyweight champ. When comparing and rating heavyweights I don't go old against new. I go man against man. I consider their size, skills, stamina, punch resistance and punching power and make my choice. I don't think great heavyweights of the past like Jack Johnson, Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey, Rocky Marciano, Sonny Liston and Ali would be over matched against today's Wilder and AJ. Those guys could fight their ass off, punch like the kick of a mule, take a punch and had great stamina. Ali wasn't a great puncher but he made up for that with extra speed. Johnson wasn't a huge puncher but had great skills. The rest of them were real punchers with both hands and had lots of speed. They were great then and would be great today. Ray Robinson is still the number 1 choice as the all time best PFP after all these 75 years or so since he was in his prime. Many of today's heavyweights weigh so much because they are hog fat. If they were as lean as Dempsey or Louis they would be closer to 200 pounds than the 250 blubbery pounds they weigh. AJ and Wilder are lean and Wilder's 220 pounds and AJ's 240 pounds are lean weights but both of them have many other flaws.

Comparing slow skill less HW's back in the day to todays HW's.

Primo Carnera would get KTFO in the first round by every top 20 HW of today.

The fact that they were considered threats on size alone supports the theory that todays HW's would be too big/strong/skilled for the little men to compete with.

You'll never convince a reasonable person that someone the size of Kovalev/Ward is going to do **** to fighters like Anthony Joshua in a boxing ring.

Guys like Ward and Roy Jones were far more skilled than the likes of Marciano and the same damn size. Nobody believes they'd beat the best HW's.

[Redd Foxx]

Boxing fans have a hard time scaling things in order to make relevant comparisons. They get caught up on the name "heavyweight" and their minds can't make it over that wall to see that yesterday's HW is not the same as today. Not only are the classes different, but we now have dehydration to make weight, which changes things quite a bit.

If someone tries to have a legit conversation w/ you about someone like Lennox Lewis vs Marciano, you know you're talking to a fool. A more interesting debate is whether past fighters were better conditioned than in recent years.

[PRINCEKOOL]

Ancient heavyweights, How old are you! 6 months old?

We have been only this very same topic many times before, I have a feeling that these threads are made by boxing fans who only really started watching boxing like 10 years ago! Maybe even less! Just like Bernard Hopkins once stated, we live in microwavable Gold fish type society.

Boring thread.

[Cutthroat]

Old heavyweight champs Jess Williard at 6 foot 6 inches and 250 pounds and Primo Carnera at 6 foot 6 inches and 260 lean pounds were as big as almost any modern heavyweight champ.

Willard and Carnera were big but that's where the comparison ends. They were slow, uncoordinated, and lacked the overall skill and agility these modern heavies show. It's as clear as day when you watch film and compare them to today's fighters.

Furthermore these men are anomalies, how many other 6'5+ existed in their time? You'd be hard pressed to find more than a handful.

In 1970 the world's population was 3.7 billion
In 2017 the world's population is 7.6 billion

Double the population, far greater diversity.

When comparing and rating heavyweights I don't go old against new. I go man against man. I consider their size, skills, stamina, punch resistance and punching power and make my choice. I don't think great heavyweights of the past like Jack Johnson, Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey, Rocky Marciano, Sonny Liston and Ali would be over matched against today's Wilder and AJ. Those guys could fight their ass off, punch like the kick of a mule, take a punch and had great stamina. Ali wasn't a great puncher but he made up for that with extra speed. Johnson wasn't a huge puncher but had great skills. The rest of them were real punchers with both hands and had lots of speed. They were great then and would be great today.

The problem is old heavies showed great speed, power, chins against other old heavies. Joe Louis got dropped by Tony "two ton" Galento, Ali by 185lb Henry Cooper. Neither Galento or Cooper possess anything close to the size or power to modern journeymen like Mike Mollo or Joey Abell and if it was them that landed I'd bet money Ali and Louis stay down.

Ray Robinson is still the number 1 choice as the all time best PFP after all these 75 years or so since he was in his prime. Many of today's heavyweights weigh so much because they are hog fat. If they were as lean as Dempsey or Louis they would be closer to 200 pounds than the 250 blubbery pounds they weigh. AJ and Wilder are lean and Wilder's 220 pounds and AJ's 240 pounds are lean weights but both of them have many other flaws.

Most boxing analysts will always go with the older generations, they've been taught these men were invincible by their teachers.

The older generations produced some great fighters that held a lot of longevity but it's going on 2018 and times have changed dramatically.

Most heavies are in shape and carry a few extra pounds. Very few are actually obese, the only guys I can really think of are guys like Breazeale who is 6'7 with a monstrous chin and KO power and Miller who is fat but very agile for his size.

There are A LOT of guys in amazing shape in the heavyweight division, it was filled with fat fighters in the 00's but not really anymore.

[billeau2]

I'm talking about pre-Tarver Roy. Can't judge him by his worst days.

I go by precedent. Look at Jones record and who he fought, yes he was not at his best but tarver pressing him and Johnson afterwards makes me wonder what would happen if he fought a heavy weight who comes forward. Ruiz was slow and lethargic and not a presser by any means, not even that good really.