Jack Dempsey vs Today's Heavyweights

[robertzimmerman]

Personally, I rank Dempsey as high as Mike Tyson on any all time list because that's who he essentially was at that point in time but he would probably not be a top 50 heavyweight by today's standards. Just way too small. You have to realize that he weighed like 190 lbs. for most of his fights and most light heavies come in at that weight now. Heavies average 230 lbs. now easily. He was just too small to have been competitive and would get clobbered badly.

The 190 that he weighed was almost all muscle, with hardly any body fat. That was also on a 6'1 frame, with a 77" reach. You can't label him as just being a modern day LHW. He would more than likely have been a CW today.

Saying he was just too small to have been competitive is completely ignorant.

He would have struggled today against the much bigger elite HW's. However, take a look at today's top 50 HW's. I guarantee you you won't even have heard of half of them.

He would have had a shot at beating most of the top 20 HW's. List them and watch footage of them. Outside of the elite, the HW division isn't that strong. Jack had the size and the style to have beaten a lot of guys today.

If Mike Tyson had fought in the 40's, would you be saying that there's no way he would have been able to have competed with today's guys because he was too small? Jack Dempsey wasn't particularly small, and if today's HW's were in the shape that he was in, many of them wouldn't be weighing 230 plus. And like Mike proved time and again, the right blend of size and style can overcome even huge disparities in size.

[robertzimmerman]

Dempsey knocked out the champion who was 250 lbs, 6'7" at least. Dempsey knocked out Carl Morris who was fast, a top contender, 240 lbs and about 6'5. A man killer they thought of him as. Dempsey handled Firpo who was 220 lbs @ 6'4 and was argued as one of the strongest fighters of his era. Dempsey could handle him just fine. Other fighters not so much.

Dempsey was as big as Holyfield in measurements. Perhaps not weight but height, reach and tale of the tape he was almost identical. Holyfield had no problem with the heavyweights he fought as far as strength goes.

This is a great post.

[-Kev-]

Dempsey knocked out the champion who was 250 lbs, 6'7" at least. Dempsey knocked out Carl Morris who was fast, a top contender, 240 lbs and about 6'5. A man killer they thought of him as. Dempsey handled Firpo who was 220 lbs @ 6'4 and was argued as one of the strongest fighters of his era. Dempsey could handle him just fine. Other fighters not so much.

Dempsey was as big as Holyfield in measurements. Perhaps not weight but height, reach and tale of the tape he was almost identical. Holyfield had no problem with the heavyweights he fought as far as strength goes.

We need to see footage of these guys before we go around calling them fast, man killers, strong or anything like that.

[robertzimmerman]

I didn't mean to upset you but boxing was pretty new when Dempsey was champion and a lot of skill and technique has evolved since then. Those fighters were lumbering and total stiffs and would not be in the top 100 heavyweight rankings today.

Sorry but that's the truth.

More ignorance.

Again, I invite you to look at today's HW division in more detail.

Today, we have a champion in Wilder who has poor coordination, who struggles against C class guys, who needs his great power as a get out of jail card.

Again, look at the top 20 guys, and then come back and tell me that Jack couldn't have beaten some of them with his attributes.

[robertzimmerman]

He'd be a heavyweight.

Who's gonna' stop him from being one?

If you had a time machine, I'm sure Jack would relish trying his hand against the best HW's of today. But I was looking from the perspective of if a guy of his size turned pro today.

[Kigali]

If you had a time machine, I'm sure Jack would relish trying his hand against the best HW's of today. But I was looking from the perspective of if a guy of his size turned pro today.

He'd clean out cruiser then heavy.

[Mr.MojoRisin']

I didn't mean to upset you but boxing was pretty new when Dempsey was champion and a lot of skill and technique has evolved since then. Those fighters were lumbering and total stiffs and would not be in the top 100 heavyweight rankings today.

Sorry but that's the truth.

Now I know that you haven't done your research. You must be new to the sport...

Boxing has been under traditional rules since 1892. That doesn't mean boxing was founded in 1892, that just means that instead of fighting each rd until someone went down they fought for 3 minutes with 1 minute of rest. From the film I have seen, it was actually around Dempsey's time that fighters started to get more modern in their pacing and stance.

So what percent of fighters employ shifting in their game today? How many of them are masters of feinting in order to put their opponent out of position? How many fighters today use the Bob and Weave? How many of them throw 6 inch knockout punches?How many have mastered the art of inside fighting?

I guarantee you that you won't use more than 1 hand to count the amount who do even one of those things. Guess what, Dempsey and fighters from his era did ALL of those things.

Are you really going to tell me that Benny Leonard wouldn't be at least a champ today? That Harry Greb wouldn't be a threat today? Fitz? Langford? Tunney? C'mon, get outta here with that BS.

Sorry but that's the truth.

[Mr.MojoRisin']

We need to see footage of these guys before we go around calling them fast, man killers, strong or anything like that.

You can read plenty of newspaper accounts online if you look, read Dempsey's autobio, and most importantly watch the footage. We have footage of Firpo and Willard. None of Carl Morris but you can read plenty of newspaper accounts and Dempsey's own testimony to back it up.

I've done my research. Time for you to do yours.

[Kigali]

Now I know that you haven't done your research. You must be new to the sport...

Boxing has been under traditional rules since 1892. That doesn't mean boxing was founded in 1892, that just means that instead of fighting each rd until someone went down they fought for 3 minutes with 1 minute of rest. From the film I have seen, it was actually around Dempsey's time that fighters started to get more modern in their pacing and stance.

So what percent of fighters employ shifting in their game today? How many of them are masters of feinting in order to put their opponent out of position? How many fighters today use the Bob and Weave? How many of them throw 6 inch knockout punches?How many have mastered the art of inside fighting?

I guarantee you that you won't use more than 1 hand to count the amount who do even one of those things. Guess what, Dempsey and fighters from his era did ALL of those things.

Are you really going to tell me that Benny Leonard wouldn't be at least a champ today? That Harry Greb wouldn't be a threat today? Fitz? Langford? Tunney? C'mon, get outta here with that BS.

Sorry but that's the truth.

[Mr.MojoRisin']

Just do the math people. Dempsey fought 3 super heavies. Fulton, Morris, and Willard.

Each got knocked out in the first rd save for Willard however that should have technically been a first rd knockout had the bell not range 10 seconds early.