Ratings: Crawford-Lundy 982K, Santa Cruz-Martinez 297K

[killakali]

No this proves that Haymon has run Showtime into the ground. Just a year and some change ago Showtime was pulling ratings on par with HBO. The Golden Boy split with Haymon and Haymon creating PBC has killed their creditably. If you look at the time line from the moment the lawsuit was settled and GB and Haymon went separate ways that's when Showtime went in the tank with ratings. It's not about the size of subscribers. Wilder this year does 500k ratings on Showtime when last year same time on showtime did 1.2mil ratings. You go from the best promoter to 3rd rate promoters and Haymon taking all showtime fighters off their network last year crippled Showtime Boxing. Since then their ratings are down across the board around 50%

degale-bute, jacobs-quillin also had terrible ratings to end the year for showtime last year

[gmc_rfc_06]

Ultimately, Showtime banked on Mayweather and now he's gone.

That leaves HBO holding Canelo, Pacquiao, Kovalev, Golovkin, Cotto, Crawford, Donaire, Bradley...

[The Big Dunn]

So you telling me subscriptions dropped by 2-3X? But only for Showtime because HBO is pulling the exact same ratings from a year and half ago while Showtime boxing ratings are down 2-3X. Subscriptions is not the story and you know it. Again the subscriptions are virtually the same for both channels as they were a year and half ago but one of them is still doing the same TV ratings for their Boxing content while the other has fallen off the cliff for Boxing content. This is all about Haymon his beef that caused the split of GB and losing GB as the promoter of his fights and getting 3rd rate promoters instead plus him taking all showtime fighters and bouncing them around other networks with the failed PBC has crippled Showtime. That's the obvious line in the sand moment when things went terribly south for Showtime ratings.

HBO's subscriptions are down as well. WHy else have they been reducing their budget?

Losing Canelo definitely hurt ratings. They didn't lose other GBP fighters except Matthysse, who isn't a huge draw.

[R_Walken]

haymon is training people to get their boxing from the major networks and basic cable.

I get that , but wouldn't Haymon want showtime to pull in decent #s so he could still use their budget for his fighters

but Shows #s have been absolutely pitiful recently and the cards have been pretty decent, I just don't get it

[bigdunny1]

HBO's subscriptions are down as well. WHy else have they been reducing their budget?

Losing Canelo definitely hurt ratings. They didn't lose other GBP fighters except Matthysse, who isn't a huge draw.

It's not about the fighters it's about Golden Boy actually promoting the fights. They were the promoter of the year back to back last 2 years for a reason. You go from the best promoters in the game to 3rd rate promoters who Haymon hires for a flat fee and have no investment in the fighters and no incentive to do a good job promoting because they are paid the same regardless and don't know if they will hold future events for these fighters. And fans see Golden Boy and know and respect that brand. Why do you think most of these PBC events can't even GIVE AWAY free tickets. Haymon losing Golden Boy for his fighters is part of the problem with Showtime ratings. Same haymon fighters on Showtime were drawing 2X the amount of viewers when Golden Boy was promoting these same fighters on Showtime.

[The Big Dunn]

It's not about the fighters it's about Golden Boy actually promoting the fights. They were the promoter of the year back to back last 2 years for a reason. You go from the best promoters in the game to 3rd rate promoters who Haymon hires for a flat fee and have no investment in the fighters and no incentive to do a good job promoting because they are paid the same regardless and don't know if they will hold future events for these fighters. And fans see Golden Boy and know and respect that brand. Why do you think most of these PBC events can't even GIVE AWAY free tickets. Haymon losing Golden Boy for his fighters is part of the problem with Showtime ratings. Same haymon fighters on Showtime were drawing 2X the amount of viewers when Golden Boy was promoting these same fighters on Showtime.

Stop over selling GBP. They have Canelo and Matthysse. They are not moving anything right now other than Canelo.

That said, I said in my initial post that more promotion is needed. The fights on show have been good. They were not promoted as well as they could've been and that is on Haymon and his associates.

[-PBP-]

The HBO main event was way worse Hank Lundy is a bum.

And that card got shit ratings too. Even better.

[bigdunny1]

Stop over selling GBP. They have Canelo and Matthysse. They are not moving anything right now other than Canelo.

That said, I said in my initial post that more promotion is needed. The fights on show have been good. They were not promoted as well as they could've been and that is on Haymon and his associates.

If they were not a important part of the puzzle then why with everything else the same and Haymon finding new promoters to work his fighters was he not able to keep the balling rolling at Showtime? GB is able to sell out even their small events like LA Fight Club while Haymon got Lara fighting in front of a rainy tent with just 100 people showing up to watch. You think crap like that would be happening if Golden Boy were promoting? Losing the best promoters in the game and dropping down to 3rd rate promoters who are not as good and not invested in the fighters is a bigger problem then you think. Hence the fact that they can't sell tickets and even when they just give them away for free the turn outs have not been that good. That's a promoters job to create interest in these events.

[The Big Dunn]

If they were not a important part of the puzzle then why with everything else the same and Haymon finding new promoters to work his fighters was he not able to keep the balling rolling at Showtime? GB is able to sell out even their small events like LA Fight Club while Haymon got Lara fighting in front of a rainy tent with just 100 people showing up to watch. You think crap like that would be happening if Golden Boy were promoting? Losing the best promoters in the game and dropping down to 3rd rate promoters who are not as good and not invested in the fighters is a bigger problem then you think. Hence the fact that they can't sell tickets and even when they just give them away for free the turn outs have not been that good. That's a promoters job to create interest in these events.

Canelo has a huge fanbase. as I said earlier his loss hurt. GBP is not doing much on HBO. Their fighters other than Canelo are "opponents" -Lemuiex and Matthysse.

Those cards are not doing good ratings either.

We agree that better promoting is needed.

[.!WAR MIKEY!.]

damn showtime did extremely poor