how successful has haymon and the pbc been so far.... be honest

[Deevel916]

From a business perspective its been a failure. Haymon blew thru the majority of the half a billion dollar investment given to him by Waddell and Reed by giving his fighters inflated purses and putting on cards that have done nothing but lost money. All that and PBC still has no real traction or following. Just check their ratings. They've been dismal at best.

From a boxing fan perspective, its been so so. I'll rate it a 3. The majority of their fights are either non competitive or boring. They have managed to give us some good fights but they have the potential to give us even more but refuse to do so in an attempt to preserve their top guys.

[BlakBread904]

I voted 3 stars. as a hardcore head, PBC has been a mixed bag. I've seen some really good fights on the platform, but also a lot of filler. I work with a lot a of casual fans, and in 2015 they tended to miss the more exciting matchups (Huck/Glowacki, Fonfara/Clevery) and instead caught more of the dull **** (Tarver/Cunningham), and expectedly, are turned off. Boxing as a niche sport these days cant afford that.

In 2016 I'd like to see more quality, less quantity. Although, I hold my breath a bit. PBC is still establishing itself and looking to corral more sponsors in order to start making a profit. It's only business sense that they won't unleash all their best, most competitive matchups so soon.

[BWC]

I wouldn't give it 5 stars but I have to strongly disagree with anyone that claims that HBO were better last year, people always complained about the bad matchmaking but we got a lot of good fights last year on PBC, and imo more than what HBO offered, in 2015 we had Wilder vs Stiverne, Garcia vs Peterson, Khan vs Algieri, Broner vs Porter, Santa Cruz vs Mares, Thurman vs Guerrero, Jack vs Dirrell, Jack vs groves, Degale vs Dirrell, Beterbiev is making good progress, Spence is being moved along, and more, these were all intriguing matchups on paper and they were all for free, we also had a lot of good exciting fights every week or every other week.

HBO imo didn't offer better matchups this year, Kovalev vs Pascal, Cotto vs Canelo, Fury vs Klitschko, Bradley vs Rios, GGG vs Lemieux (15 to 1 fav), Mattysse vs Postol, Mattysse vs Provodnikov and that's about it, Crawford, Lomachenko and Walters all had a disappointing year imo, so I don't see why PBC is getting all that criticism when it offered more high level fights for free and with fair rational commentary compared to overpriced PPVs with biased opinionated BS politics-motivated commentary by HBO! Sure PBC is not perfect and they should step their game up a lot, but compared to HBO they're doing very well.

HBO has been doing boxing since the late 70's. LOL of course they are an established brand in the sport. PBC has been around for nine months folks. And it's already the No 2 Boxing brand in the US. Plenty of room to grow..

[Deevel916]

HBO has been doing boxing since the late 70's. LOL of course they are an established brand in the sport. PBC has been around for nine months folks. And it's already the No 2 Boxing brand in the US. Plenty of room to grow..

From a roster standpoint yes. What's crazy is, Canelo alone is bigger than all the top PBC fighters combined!

[kafkod]

being honest that damn hbo makes pbc look cheap and 2nd class... the presentation has a big thing to do with it.

I've seen PBC on Spike here in the UK. I've also watched fights from PBC shows on YT.

I have to say, the presentation of the PBC fights I've seen was terrible, and the commentary made it even worse.

There seems to be less atmosphere in the arena at a PBC show than there is on Mars or the surface of the moon.

[bigdunny1]

HBO has been doing boxing since the late 70's. LOL of course they are an established brand in the sport. PBC has been around for nine months folks. And it's already the No 2 Boxing brand in the US. Plenty of room to grow..

They were going to be No 2 in Boxing by default the moment they bought all the time buys on numerous networks before they aired any fights. Haymon crippled Showtime and started PBC with all those fighters. No matter what they were going to be the No 2 provider of boxing. So that is not a sign of success for PBC. The sheer high volume of fights doesn't speak to the QUALITY of the fights. They literally aired 10X more fights then anybody else. They have a high QUANTITY of fights it's the overall QUALITY they lack. Look at the 2015 fight awards and see how little represented PBC was. The fight of the Year was Vargas vs Muira NOT a PBC fight. Out of the top 5 candidates for fight of the year from most of the top boxing outlets they had maybe 2 nominations DESPITE having 10X more fights then everybody else. Look at the rest of the awards how many went to PBC fighters? Few if any. So the real question is how is PBC putting out anywhere near the same quality of fights when HBO dominated them all major awards DESPITE having 1/10th the amount of fights as PBC? That's due to the high amount of crap mismatches they aired vastly outweighing the few fights that you went thinking this is going to be a great fight. Even more shocking out of the few fights that turned out to be good NONE appeared on PBC's biggest and most important broadcasts ie NBC, CBS primetime. Instead their best fights were lesser names on Friday night fights on Spike or Tuesday nights on FS1 in fights few watched. Basically they wasted any momentum they could of gotten from those fights and aired bad fights on the biggest networks NBC, CBS that most casuals saw. HBO's fight of the year candidates were all viewed either live by millions among their most highly viewed fights of the year or were on a huge PPV that had almost 1mil buys. Meaning HBO put their best fights on their best platforms. They didn't put their best fights on HBO Latino where few saw them. Saying they are number 2 to HBO sounds good until you realize that the gap between 1 and 2 is so massive. That's like saying Arena Football is the number 2 league in the US for Professional Football. Technically true but means little.

Lastly because of the sheer volume of fights and networks PBC investors are paying they do not have the luxury to build slow. If they wanted that approach they wouldn't of burned through the hundreds of millions like they did in year 1. And the ratings do not suggest they are building or growing by the way. It's actually the opposite the ratings are trending down not up. Which again wouldn't be that alarming if PBC started very small on say 1 network. But PBC clearly came out with a aggressive business model to take over boxing and stomp out it's competition. Neither of which has happened. Instead you end up with a cheap looking product that people consider minor league boxing at a price that is MORE then the major leagues of boxing is spending to produce. Example you can't pay guys like Lara who have no fanbase 1mil to fight tomato cans under a rainy tent in front of 100 people for a fight that draws ratings worse then WNBA on ESPN2 and expect that to last long.

[Deevel916]

http://theinscribermag.com/sports/bo...-paid-off.html

Al Haymon, arguably the biggest power broker in the sport currently, launched the Premier Boxing Champions series on March 7 on NBC. The series also broadcast throughout the year on CBS, ABC, ESPN, Spike, NBCSN, Fox Sports 1, CBS Sports Network and Bounce TV. With the $450 million financial backing of the hedge fund Waddell & Reed Haymon was able to bring the PBC to this many networks by buying the airtime from them & assuming responsibility with the production. This was welcomed by the networks as their resources wouldn’t be taxed as much.

Using his experience in the music tour industry, Haymon crafted the PBC production to have the feel of a concert rather than a boxing card. Extravagant lighting, opposite ramps for each fighter to walk on, and a soundtrack made by composer Hans Zimmer were additions that made series stand out to the audience but not as much as what was missing. Staples such as a ring announcers, ring girls holding round cards, and the walk a fighter’s team made holding title belts were either completely scrapped or in the case of the ring announcer replaced by an someone unseen using a PA system. The main staple kept by the PBC has been the television teams which vary by the network.

It has been almost a year since the launch of Haymon’s experiment and so far it has produced mixed results for various reasons, most of them caused by how secretive he has been with the PBC’s books.

The cause of this is partly the Muhammad Ali Boxing Reform Act. The law, enacted in 2000, prohibits boxing managers from also being promoters for their clients, something that Haymon has been accused of doing before the PBC was launched. Prior to that Haymon, who is technically listed as the manager of over 200 fighters, allegedly used Golden Boy as a cover for his promotional work with the company’s then CEO Richard Schaefer acting as a middle man. Once Schaefer left Golden Boy on in a bitter business dispute with company co-founder and president Oscar De La Hoya on June 2, 2014 Haymon began laying the foundation for the PBC.

While Haymon has worked with other promotional companies like DiBella Entertainment, Warriors Boxing, and Groupe Yvon Michel in staging PBC cards the notion that he is the actual promoter has not gone away. Lawsuits alleging Ali Act violations have been filed by Golden Boy and Top Rank and are currently being litigated in courts. The Top Rank lawsuit has recently being allowed to go to the discovery phase meaning the PBC’s books and the contracts of Haymon fighters can be obtained by Top Rank lawyers. Haymon himself may also have to give a deposition under oath.

Another negative for the PBC has been lack of real ground-level support for their cards. With the exception of the August 29 featherweight fight between Abner Mares and Leo Santa Cruz at the Staples Center and World Boxing Council heavyweight champion Deontay Wilder’s two defenses in Alabama little grassroots support has been given to help PBC fights draw crowds. It has now become common practice for PBC cards to not even charge admission to get in and still have venues be half empty. This is partly a result of many PBC fights being announced with as little as five weeks before the fighters go to the ring. Normally boxing cards, particularly with 12 round main events, are given at least two months to be promoted well. This also translates to television as the PBC has not been able to grab a consistent audience that make the move to broadcast channels a success due to scheduling cards at the same time as other sporting events such as college and NFL football. The highest PBC broadcasts on average have been on NBC with over 1 million viewers, numbers that would be considered great for HBO or Showtime but not for a broadcast channel. These flaws, while damaging, could be by design thanks largely to the sheer amount of cards the PBC broadcasts.

The plan Haymon had for the PBC didn’t anticipate much of this. After the March launch the PBC was meant to ride a boom from casual fans thanks to the May 2 megafight between Floyd Mayweather, Haymon’s biggest client, and Manny Pacquiao. The thought was that Mayweather’s mainstream notoriety and affiliation with Haymon would bring more eyes to the PBC and help shape the narrative that their fighters were boxing’s elite. The disdain that the actual Mayweather-Pacquiao fight received turned off those very casual fans the PBC coveted leaving a smaller, but much more informed hardcore base to cater to. While the PBC did have good stage good fights like Mares-Santa Cruz and the cruiserweight tile bout between Marco Huck and Krysztov Glowacki it also staged many bouts that were seen as mismatches where the A side was overpaid to face pedestrian opponents. Doing as much as possible to avoid mentioning sanctioning bodies or fighters outside its circle and signs of showing favoritism to certain PBC fighters did not help much in getting fans and media su****ious of Haymon’s true intentions to change their minds.

While Haymon has been able to control nearly all the aspects of operating the PBC the one he can’t may be the biggest, the fact the money he’s using is not his own.

Waddell & Reed has wanted in the boxing business for several years as it and Haymon were behind an effort to buy Golden Boy through Schaefer from De La Hoya in 2014. That desire has been costly so far. While helping finance the PBC the hedge fund has seen a rough 2015 where its stock lost 42% of its value leading to downgrades from three financial firms. The specific investment Waddell & Reed has made into Haymon Boxing, the company used to operate the PBC, has lost as much as 59% of its value according to court filing from late 2015. It’s fairly common for investments to operate at a loss for the first year so the PBC can be considered safe. However, if the hedge fund continues to lose overall value it may try to stop the bleeding by selling profitable assets such as its stake in Formula 1 Racing along with shutting down investment that lose too much money, a category the PBC may fit into.

Time will tell whether the PBC experiment at its current scale was worth it for all parties involved but Haymon may learn in the end that boxing’s mercenary and chaotic nature is too much for one man to control.

[BWC]

http://theinscribermag.com/sports/bo...-paid-off.html

Al Haymon, arguably the biggest power broker in the sport currently, launched the Premier Boxing Champions series on March 7 on NBC. The series also broadcast throughout the year on CBS, ABC, ESPN, Spike, NBCSN, Fox Sports 1, CBS Sports Network and Bounce TV. With the $450 million financial backing of the hedge fund Waddell & Reed Haymon was able to bring the PBC to this many networks by buying the airtime from them & assuming responsibility with the production. This was welcomed by the networks as their resources wouldn’t be taxed as much.

Using his experience in the music tour industry, Haymon crafted the PBC production to have the feel of a concert rather than a boxing card. Extravagant lighting, opposite ramps for each fighter to walk on, and a soundtrack made by composer Hans Zimmer were additions that made series stand out to the audience but not as much as what was missing. Staples such as a ring announcers, ring girls holding round cards, and the walk a fighter’s team made holding title belts were either completely scrapped or in the case of the ring announcer replaced by an someone unseen using a PA system. The main staple kept by the PBC has been the television teams which vary by the network.

It has been almost a year since the launch of Haymon’s experiment and so far it has produced mixed results for various reasons, most of them caused by how secretive he has been with the PBC’s books.

The cause of this is partly the Muhammad Ali Boxing Reform Act. The law, enacted in 2000, prohibits boxing managers from also being promoters for their clients, something that Haymon has been accused of doing before the PBC was launched. Prior to that Haymon, who is technically listed as the manager of over 200 fighters, allegedly used Golden Boy as a cover for his promotional work with the company’s then CEO Richard Schaefer acting as a middle man. Once Schaefer left Golden Boy on in a bitter business dispute with company co-founder and president Oscar De La Hoya on June 2, 2014 Haymon began laying the foundation for the PBC.

While Haymon has worked with other promotional companies like DiBella Entertainment, Warriors Boxing, and Groupe Yvon Michel in staging PBC cards the notion that he is the actual promoter has not gone away. Lawsuits alleging Ali Act violations have been filed by Golden Boy and Top Rank and are currently being litigated in courts. The Top Rank lawsuit has recently being allowed to go to the discovery phase meaning the PBC’s books and the contracts of Haymon fighters can be obtained by Top Rank lawyers. Haymon himself may also have to give a deposition under oath.

Another negative for the PBC has been lack of real ground-level support for their cards. With the exception of the August 29 featherweight fight between Abner Mares and Leo Santa Cruz at the Staples Center and World Boxing Council heavyweight champion Deontay Wilder’s two defenses in Alabama little grassroots support has been given to help PBC fights draw crowds. It has now become common practice for PBC cards to not even charge admission to get in and still have venues be half empty. This is partly a result of many PBC fights being announced with as little as five weeks before the fighters go to the ring. Normally boxing cards, particularly with 12 round main events, are given at least two months to be promoted well. This also translates to television as the PBC has not been able to grab a consistent audience that make the move to broadcast channels a success due to scheduling cards at the same time as other sporting events such as college and NFL football. The highest PBC broadcasts on average have been on NBC with over 1 million viewers, numbers that would be considered great for HBO or Showtime but not for a broadcast channel. These flaws, while damaging, could be by design thanks largely to the sheer amount of cards the PBC broadcasts.

The plan Haymon had for the PBC didn’t anticipate much of this. After the March launch the PBC was meant to ride a boom from casual fans thanks to the May 2 megafight between Floyd Mayweather, Haymon’s biggest client, and Manny Pacquiao. The thought was that Mayweather’s mainstream notoriety and affiliation with Haymon would bring more eyes to the PBC and help shape the narrative that their fighters were boxing’s elite. The disdain that the actual Mayweather-Pacquiao fight received turned off those very casual fans the PBC coveted leaving a smaller, but much more informed hardcore base to cater to. While the PBC did have good stage good fights like Mares-Santa Cruz and the cruiserweight tile bout between Marco Huck and Krysztov Glowacki it also staged many bouts that were seen as mismatches where the A side was overpaid to face pedestrian opponents. Doing as much as possible to avoid mentioning sanctioning bodies or fighters outside its circle and signs of showing favoritism to certain PBC fighters did not help much in getting fans and media su****ious of Haymon’s true intentions to change their minds.

While Haymon has been able to control nearly all the aspects of operating the PBC the one he can’t may be the biggest, the fact the money he’s using is not his own.

Waddell & Reed has wanted in the boxing business for several years as it and Haymon were behind an effort to buy Golden Boy through Schaefer from De La Hoya in 2014. That desire has been costly so far. While helping finance the PBC the hedge fund has seen a rough 2015 where its stock lost 42% of its value leading to downgrades from three financial firms. The specific investment Waddell & Reed has made into Haymon Boxing, the company used to operate the PBC, has lost as much as 59% of its value according to court filing from late 2015. It’s fairly common for investments to operate at a loss for the first year so the PBC can be considered safe. However, if the hedge fund continues to lose overall value it may try to stop the bleeding by selling profitable assets such as its stake in Formula 1 Racing along with shutting down investment that lose too much money, a category the PBC may fit into.

Time will tell whether the PBC experiment at its current scale was worth it for all parties involved but Haymon may learn in the end that boxing’s mercenary and chaotic nature is too much for one man to control.

This article is just pure speculation. He has no idea what Haymon's "plan" was for the PBC, he's just speculating what the plan actually was. He says himself PBC's financial performance is unknown so anyone saying "PBC is a business failure" or "PBC is a business success" can automatically be discounted as talking out their arse..

[sicko]

So far I would agree with 3 Stars

It has plenty of room to grow and of course they could use some upgrades and improvements in certain areas but I think they're on the right path. The only issue I see has nothing to do with Presentation or Matchmaking or any of that it is just reaching out and grabbing a demographic and fans that don't care about boxing. Remember they don't know these fighters yet so big match ups to us don't mean **** to them right now. PBC needs to do more than just satisfie us who are already Boxing fans and know these fighters.

You must show potential growth with in that most important Demographic and that is 18-35 because that is the Demo that spends the most money. So beyond just match making, PBC fighters need to be out marketing themselves and their sport/promotion in general. I don't see any PBC Fighters out here doing interviews on ESPN, haven't seen any of them on Firsttake discussing boxing or any of that. While UFC Fighters are all over the place Promoting and Selling themselves to casuals. So outside of the ring is where more work needs to be done IMO. Have to do something to grab the attention of Casuals and NO, big match ups between 2 Fighters they don't know yet is not the Only Answer.

[Deevel916]

This article is just pure speculation. He has no idea what Haymon's "plan" was for the PBC, he's just speculating what the plan actually was. He says himself PBC's financial performance is unknown so anyone saying "PBC is a business failure" or "PBC is a business success" can automatically be discounted as talking out their arse..

Of course. Its speculation based on what we've seen thus far. The author even states that. "Time will tell whether the PBC experiment at its current scale was worth it for all parties involved but Haymon may learn in the end that boxing’s mercenary and chaotic nature is too much for one man to control"