Why don't any boxers use this kind of stance anymore?

[Tom Cruise]

Boxers were way better back then, doe.

Evolved techniques, doe

[SlySlickSmooth]

Carl Froch already retired

[Weltschmerz]

Evolved techniques, doe

Pulev got KTFO.

[Biolink]

B-hops stance is kind of the evolution of that. Left arm not extended as far, but still acts as a defensive barrier and his right hand is in a better position to catch the jab and especially the left hook.

[Biolink]

Evolved techniques, doe

Looks awkward, but pretty smart actually. Wlad's right hand is in a position to catch Pulev's jab if he tried to jab with Wlad which basically renders anything he could do useless since he's not landing a right hand on the giant.

[SplitSecond]

You know guys.... a little knowledge goes a long way.

Fighting with smaller gloves means more of a direct connection when hitting. The foward lead punch was done from that stance without turning the hand over, a little piston action to the chin usually and it was often a ko punch. When you introduce larger gloves you break this connection and need to square up more, turn the arm over (which is how this punch became the jab) and that is why this stance change.

this stance is the most biomechanically correct way to hit, but one cannot transfer the blow with larger gloves. Also this stance allows many more variations in how to defend and attack...James Figg used a fencing vocabulary to teach boxing, orginally one could retreat, lunge, etc. In this stance one can very quickly come back foot to front, close to grips, and avoid blows with footwork.

When boxing developed its own vocabulary guys started to change stances to reflect the specific concerns of punching. Still, this was a good method and allows one short crisp punching and the ******* use of footwork.

The stance doesn't add magical properties to your footwork, and sure the right hand might be ****ed(albiet there is more to throwing a punch correctly than the starting position of your arm), the jab is definitely not in the best place nor is it most mechanically correct, it's there more for pawing to cling/push down on an opponents own arm. The style they used was arm flailing, pushing style which we occasionally saw in George Foreman, and modernly Mayweather and his face pushing and Klitschko.

[billeau2]

This was my initial thought as it reminds me of how Vitali fights. Maybe with the chin tucked a bit more, but Vitali seems to stay very well positioned in his fights relative to his opponent and covers ground quickly, though he looks very awkward and not at all "slick".

When a fighter throws a jab and wants to create distance the elbows naturally flank outwards....One can see the problem with this in MMA because when those elbows go up, the body becomes vulnerable under the punching arm. Also, the head is a great defense against a jab if you want to close ranks quickly. With an ungloved hand particularly you could break the hand on a person's head throwing a jab like it is done today.

Again, the guys from that time had a lot to deal with in terms of the grapple which was a legitimte fighting distance and instead of trying to use the arm turning, to create distance, the legs would transfer weight into a front legged position. This protects one from the grapple because the elbows should/can remain tucked, leaving no opening to get grabbed.

All fighters have to have ways of creating distance. Its one of the single most important advantages in boxing. The old way of thinking was to take the lead hand and lunge. In this way they would wind up with a single side facing the opponent, the body was not exposed because the elbow still guarded the flank, and the person could transfer weight to continue the attack. To get a mental picture of this imagine a fencer lunging in with a straight thrust.

[BKM-2010]

You know guys.... a little knowledge goes a long way.

Fighting with smaller gloves means more of a direct connection when hitting. The foward lead punch was done from that stance without turning the hand over, a little piston action to the chin usually and it was often a ko punch. When you introduce larger gloves you break this connection and need to square up more, turn the arm over (which is how this punch became the jab) and that is why this stance change.

this stance is the most biomechanically correct way to hit, but one cannot transfer the blow with larger gloves. Also this stance allows many more variations in how to defend and attack...James Figg used a fencing vocabulary to teach boxing, orginally one could retreat, lunge, etc. In this stance one can very quickly come back foot to front, close to grips, and avoid blows with footwork.

When boxing developed its own vocabulary guys started to change stances to reflect the specific concerns of punching. Still, this was a good method and allows one short crisp punching and the ******* use of footwork.

Actually because attacks were often distinct from other movements involving counters, etc, when a fighter attacked they looked like they were running in towards the opponent....Makes sense actually because why square up except if you are attacking? why expose more of your body to attacks?

You will find many pics of Johnson in this pose as he goes in to attack and again it can be reduced to the principle: If I want to hit you with both hands, both hands should be foward from the shoulder line.

Brilliant teachings as always sir.

Obviously never watched Johnson... The man perfected the "white boy" style... But at the same time made it useless when Wilard put him on his ass..

Useless against Willard? Lol Johnson won almost every round leading up to round 26 before age/fitness caught up to him and he became open for Willard's attacks.

What's amazing about Johnson was his hand-eye coordination. he was perhaps the best ever when it came to blocking and parrying punches with gloves and open palms, and those were tiny gloves.

[Tom Cruise]

Looks awkward, but pretty smart actually. Wlad's right hand is in a position to catch Pulev's jab if he tried to jab with Wlad which basically renders anything he could do useless since he's not landing a right hand on the giant.

His right hand is not in a position to catch a jab. Nor is it in a position to throw a punch, nor is his arm in a position to block body shots. Its in no mans land

[billeau2]

I didn't know that about the samurai woodcuts. Good stuff.

I know all about some circle walking though..lol.. studied bagua and tai chi under sifu buckman.. a disciple of Master Park Bok-Nom... did some sessions with the grandmaster as well, but always kept my loyalty to Buckman. There is all kinds of crazy politics in those kung fu federations... disciples mad at other disciples for stealing students ect. It gets pretty divisive I must say.

Yes the politics can be exasperating. Circle walking, the eight (ba) hexograms, great stuff. Tai Chi and Bagua were viable arts, even being used on the battle field at times in history. One sticky situation with Tai Chi is the speed and knowledge of the art as it applies to combat. You probably have come up against those who claim the art was never a combat boxing system. It actually was and is a great system, unfortunately many teachers were not taught the art as a fighting art. I studied...and when I say studied I mean dabbled! in Chen M Ching's/Ben Lo's large form. I enjoyed it, at the time though I was a ****y kid, so a lot of it went over my head...later when I went back to it seasoned a bit more I got a lot more out of it.

But when you see the loading and unloading that makes things like circle walking effective, you can see how boxing is essentially explosive and the trick is coordinating the step with the hit.