Kathy Duva questions the Haymon Boxing Model (good read)

[Cinci Champ]

Casual fans seem attracted to that type of spectacle. Besides, the quality of the fights should take care of themselves. First card had one dull fight and one very good one. Nothing to complain about.

ya there is no question some haymon cards last year or 2 were disgusting i was in the crowd for the broner transformer card and all i was thinking was why would it not be matyssee vs broner the whole 2 big names on same card same weight class fighting in different fights was bs but now that things are playing out its obvious haymon was just building names up for his new league and now the real fights will start taking place and he was not about to waste them before hand. He has no other choice thats what sponsors are going to want. I think as long as he keeps putting on good cards like he did this past weekend people will stop trying to bash a good thing. People are letting emotion get the best of them on this topic i hate arum with a passion but if he was the one doing this i would be defending it the same way if u cant see this is great for the fans then your trying way to hard

[Weebler I]

I understand what she's saying, but Haymon's only into phase 1 of his plan - take over the industry by choking everyone else out. That's the reason he's over spending on everything he does, he's taking complete control and trying to discourage others from opposing him.

Allegedly his investors have him backed for a 4 year plan. Once he becomes a monopoly or the PBC is atleast established as the major brand of boxing, you can expect him to become fiscally responsible.

It's ironic really. Alot of people in the sport mock the UFC due to the complete control it has over its fighters and the relatively low fighter pay, and alot of those very same people are currently under Haymon umbrella and that same scenario is heading their way. But the reality is, alot of boxers are overpaid due the HBO/Showtime subscriber model. Once they start having to earn their keep with viewerships (sponsors & ppv's) like the UFC, you'll see about the same level of pay for boxers.

Not sure about that, if he doesn't keep paying them big amounts, they'll just move back towards Top Rank and GBP.

He really needs to attract the really big sponsors to keep the money flowing.

That's why we're seeing the clean cut image from PBC, having the boxers in suits, no entourages, ring card girls etc.

[The Big Dunn]

ya there is no question some haymon cards last year or 2 were disgusting i was in the crowd for the broner transformer card and all i was thinking was why would it not be matyssee vs broner the whole 2 big names on same card same weight class fighting in different fights was bs but now that things are playing out its obvious haymon was just building names up for his new league and now the real fights will start taking place and he was not about to waste them before hand. He has no other choice thats what sponsors are going to want. I think as long as he keeps putting on good cards like he did this past weekend people will stop trying to bash a good thing. People are letting emotion get the best of them on this topic i hate arum with a passion but if he was the one doing this i would be defending it the same way if u cant see this is great for the fans then your trying way to hard

good post. Posters forget Haymon is going to build fighters the same way they have been for a while. I think he saw how Russell failed in against Loma and will adjust things.

Last year was the fallout from the lawsuit. This year will be different. Hell, broner already has a new date scheduled.

If this works, I expect HBO to start reinvesting in boxing as well. Same with showtime. Then maybe we get back to the time when network fights build guys, cable fights MEAN something, and then there is 1 or 2 ppv's a year that are really significant.

[North Star]

I didn't like anything from the debut show other than the Thurman/Guerrero fight.

I'm of the opinion that boxing cannot be fixed and grow by this want to be on network TV. I do not see the viewership rising over the initial show and that will most likely mean sponsors will not come calling. I believe boxing needs to be rebuilt from the ground up, in local communities and even in schools. Building popularity at the local community level, making it a community staple with small time shows and events will cause the sport to become more mainstream and will at that point, grow the viewership and attract sponsors at the top end.

[Motofan]

99% of the ad's were for boxing. I didn't see many outside sponsors at all. Al didn't sell much in the way of advertising for round one of his great plan.

[Hougigo]

I heard rumor,so don't quote me on this. The rumor was that haymon was giving mgm grand employees,discount s on tickets,and along with those discounts,came free tickets in order to make it appear as if they had a much larger audience. Do you know if this is true?

They do that for a lot of casino fights. Recently did that for wilder/stiverne.

What I wonder is how are they gonna get nbc to cut them a deal when everything is so expensive and the ratings are alright? 3.4 is really good avg, but they've cut series ,nbc, for viewership around there for failing to perform at a certain level.

Yea I question it too, but not my problem. I'll just sit back and watch for now

[Barcham]

I heard rumor,so don't quote me on this. The rumor was that haymon was giving mgm grand employees,discount s on tickets,and along with those discounts,came free tickets in order to make it appear as if they had a much larger audience. Do you know if this is true?

A member on another board I post on was given 25 free tickets by someone who knows who was working the venue that night. I think they gave a lot of free tickets and still only managed to fill half the arena.

[Vasyl’s dad]

If more people tune in, it should lead to a bigger investment in the program, which should result in better quality fights on TV, no different than HBO with BAD.

Boxing benefits because there is more programming available, which will need to be filled. This gives more fighters critical TV time for younger fighters. If the sport returns to the mainstream, this should attract more "athletes" to the sport as it did when boxing was bigger.

Having a wider pool of good fighters should mean more quality fighters and fights, which improves the product we see on TV. Its all cyclical.

Bewlsshiiit. Lack of money has never stopped a fight from getting made. A lack of balls does. There are quality fights every year. When quality fights don't happen, it's because one guy makes an excuse to not fight the other. We seen fFloyd do this. Now we see quillin, leo, and others do it. And it's not because of a lack of funding.

[mike1010011]

A member on another board I post on was given 25 free tickets by someone who knows who was working the venue that night. I think they gave a lot of free tickets and still only managed to fill half the arena.

So fat dan wasn't lying this time?

[saintpat]

I didn't like anything from the debut show other than the Thurman/Guerrero fight.

I'm of the opinion that boxing cannot be fixed and grow by this want to be on network TV. I do not see the viewership rising over the initial show and that will most likely mean sponsors will not come calling. I believe boxing needs to be rebuilt from the ground up, in local communities and even in schools. Building popularity at the local community level, making it a community staple with small time shows and events will cause the sport to become more mainstream and will at that point, grow the viewership and attract sponsors at the top end.

What are you doing in your community to make this happen?

I generally disagree: boxing had a boom in the mid-1970s in the U.S. because (a) the 1976 Olympic team created stars and all those gold medals got people excited and (b) the Rocky movie was released and captured the public's imagination.

Was there more to it than that? Sure. But ABC and CBS and NBC got really involved -- fights on free TV -- and people tuned in and that allowed the Ray Leonards and Durans and Hearnses to become household names, which eventually led to people paying to see them on closed circuit ... and eventually led to HBO putting out big money to buy its way into the sport.

Club shows (the community fights you're talking about) benefitted from this boom, which created more fights (most of the best of whom were fed to the big boys, but also some like Marvin Hagler were grown from the ground up without benefit of big-money promotions) and more opportunity.

It didn't happen the other way around. It wasn't a case of people started putting on club shows in their area and then people started watching Sugar Ray fight on Saturdays on network TV because they were so excited about the local boys they saw brawling at the armory.

If boxing booms again, more gyms will open and more fights at the local level will be held. That's how it works.