Tyson vs Liston

[Ray Corso]

Ali beat up Liston in the first fight, take a look at his face! No fix was in for that! The bookies took a beating and when the fix is in the book wins, if you knew anything about a book you'd know that! There are no broke bookies unless their ****** enough to bet!
Liston was a very good puncher with both hands, had a hard accurate jab and a straight right hand that could hurt you. He was well schooled as a young fighter and the Miami gym at that time had great trainers and spar work. One of his young spar partners was a very young (188lbs) kid who Liston had trouble catching!
As for Tyson vs Liston it would be a great match up! Neither guy was particularly good on retreat so it could be two bulls in the center of the ring.
Liston had all the punches but Mike had better feet and I'd think that he'd try to catch Sonny at angles! It would be interesting for sure both close in size
Sonny 6' 1/2" 212lbs / Mike 5' 10" 216lbs. (at their best in my opinion)

I would favor Tyson but he had to be careful and focused.
People under estimate Liston's punch arsenal, he had beautiful upper cuts and hook's and kept his shots short and clean at his best! He had a great reach and
was a quick stepper so he kept his power moving with him. Steppers tried to main tain both feet close and ready to sit down on shots, it's not easy to learn but if you have power it's important to try and master the technique. People who don't know anything about boxing think a fighter is slow because they have no knowledge of Methods & Techniques. Joe Louis learned to employ this technique to be able to fire power at any given sequence!

Tyson vs Liston...great fight, I'd pay to see it!!
Ray

[creekrat77]

I would say Tyson has the edge. His expertise is slipping and getting on the inside, there for a conventional boxer puncher with abnormally long arms would be in trouble with prime Tyson. Tyson's killer instinct and speed would be the difference. He wouldn't waist time getting on the inside because there is where he is most effective with his power. Floyd Patterson's problem was his power wasn't enough to base his fight strategy on so he sat there with not the same impulsiveness to get on the inside as Mike would. Patterson was target practice. Unless Liston could back Tyson up then it's a KO for Mike, Liston wasn't the type to back up win or lose

[abdelfadeel]

Contrary to popular belief, his best range was not inside, it was mid-range.
Sonny Liston would not have that hard a time with Tyson.Liston would used the jab to pick off the smaller Tyson and set him up for big rights and uppercuts.Tyson's style was exactly like Floyd Patterson's (Cus trained him also) but with much more power.Sonny can take anything Tyson dishes out,and that would discourage Mike big time.A great heavyweight contender named Cleveland Williams unloaded on Sonny in the first round of their first fight,bloodying his nose and possibly breaking it.Williams had big time power like Tyson and probably the same amount of speed.Williams was also bigger than Tyson.Liston simply shook off the blows and figured Williams out,eventually knocking him out in 3 rounds.Sonny took Williams down in the 2 round in their rematch.Liston would pound the smaller Tyson around the ring and do what nobody ever did with a prime Tyson and that's dominate him.Sonny takes this in no more than 5 but probably ends this much earlier by 3rd round knockout.

[Elroy1]

So let me get this straight Abdel...

You are comparing a match up between Mike Tyson and Liston, to the performance and outcome of Liston's opponent PATTERSON!

Patterson at 189 and 194lbs respectively in both their fights, who had a much softer body composition than Tyson at 215-220lbs who, at his length, looked like a starving greyhound. An UTTER featherfist and ultra fine glass jaw vs Tyson, an ultimate power puncher and ironm chin.

I repeat, your telling me THIS Floyd Patterson...

http://www.phillyboxinghistory.com/boxer_categories/visiting/cards/card_patterson_floyd.jpg

Is in any way a comparable opponent than THIS Mike Tyson?

http://nattyornot.com/wp-content/upl...dybuilding.jpg

That's like me squashing an ant and then claiming that because I crushed that ant I would also be able to crush an elephant, simply because they had the same trainer/style. THIS sounds more plausible to you than "ELEPHANT STOMPS ME".

Your are an absolute fool and for any reasonable person, your whole idea there was carried away with the garbage the moment they clicked on those images.

Floyd Patterson was one of the weakest HW champions ever to have graced the sport but he can be excused for this because HE WAS NOT A HW as we would describe one today.

He is testament to EXACTLY what I spoke about Liston.

Liston never beat anybody who was not a CRUISER or a BUM, or on a loss streak, or combination thereof.

THIS^ is the record of Liston, comparable to butterbean.

Explain HOW he would beat Tyson?

He isn't fast enough to land punches on Tyson.
He isn't skilled enough to box Tyson.
He isn't strong/tough enough to withstand Tyson.

Landslide victory for Tyson.

I made the Scaff comparison for a reason, not to degrade Liston *which I admit it does, BUT..

Liston was slow as a snail (like Scaff)
Liston could hit pretty hard for his size (Scaff was big boy)
Liston was extremely uncoordinated (just like Scaff)
Liston to take a little bit of damage (again, Scaff)

I will give you one thing. I think Liston could have beaten every previous HW. I think he'd have been too big for Rocky. I think he might have even beat Joe Louis but that would be a good fight.

If you had claimed Liston would beat Louis, that would have been reasonable, but he doesn't even play within 3 leagues of Tyson.

[Ascended]

elroy said it perfect just like sammy slow and easy to read and trolls like ray and abdel acted blind to seeing him say the facts and still said son wins people here are so crazy the truth hurts

[4truth]

Tyson would have Liston looking for a soft place to lie down. Speed kills.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR9Tn6RDb-P9xI1IURz2884Dx10UZtfStr37-6uQ5cqaHiTfyGEp_pg9eUjZIhcrKTIk0M&usqp=CAU.jpg

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

They are:

Style How does he box?
Punching Power Is he swatting flies or cracking jaws?
Speed Can you see his punches coming or do they sneak up on you?
Chin - Can the boxer take a pounding and stand his ground?
Defense Is he a human punching bag or is he hard to hit?
Heart Does he have the desire to peel his sweaty carcass off the canvas and return to battle?
Psychology Can he get inside his opponent's head and nullify his training?
Key Losses Who did the boxer lose to and why?
Stamina/Endurance Is he grabbing his knees in the eighth round?

style-Liston. the classic swarmer vs slugger. Not to mention tyson had trouble with jabbers as seen by Douglas.
punching power-this is a no brainer. liston was of the hardest punchers off all time. whole tyson's punching power was something to watch, it just wasn't in the same class as liston.
speed- Tyson. For years Mike Tysons hand speed has been overlooked. He packed such lethal punches that few people noticed his speed. In his documentary, Mike Tyson states that he studied quick exciting boxers and he modeled his style after them.

Watch a few clips of Tyson throwing punches and youll see what I mean. Tyson would whip out five or six hooks and uppercuts in the blink of an eye. It was extremely rare to see a boxer beat Mike Tyson to the punch.
Chin-Liston. Only down twice in his career and one of them was a dive. Mike Tysons armor came with a major *****. His chin was relatively nonexistent. It was never really tested, but it failed on those rare occasions that he needed it.

His chin was put to the test in bouts with Lennox Lewis (Tyson was KOd), Evander Holyfield (Tyson lost on a TKO in which he admits to blacking out) and Buster Douglas (Tysons most infamous KO loss). Their really is no comparison in this.
Defense. Tyson. Watch some clips and you'll see what i mean. While Liston's defense was underrated, it wasn't on that level.
Heart-Liston. Liston took Cleveland Williams best shots and wasn't discouraged. Not to mention Williams also broke his nose. He came back to win. Liston also fought 6 rounds with a broken jaw
Mike Tyson never displayed great heart. He fought back to win against Razor Ruddock but that was basically it. After taking punishment, he was visibly demoralized in bouts with the Irish Champion Kevin McBride, Evander Holyfield and Lennox Lewis. Tyson could dominate a fight, but he didnt possess the will to dig deep and deliver punishment when the chips were stacked against him.
Psychology. Liston
In his documentary, Tyson flat out says the following, I walk around the ring and never take my eyes off my opponent. Im looking for a sign of his fear. Hell fight hard for two or three rounds but I KNOW I broke his spirit.

Tyson relied on fear, but he struggled openly when boxers did not fear him.

There was another major ***** in Mike Tysons psychological armor. His confidence was directly tied to Cus Damato. Damato built up Tysons confidence in himself and Tyson lost a good chunk of that when Damato died.

You cant escape a good debate about Mike Tyson without hearing, if Cus Damato didnt die. Nobody can deny Cus standing as a great trainer. However, Tysons admitted reliance on Damato is a definite weak point. Liston avenged one of his losses. something tyson never did. Williams stood up to Liston and he was bombed out. Tyson even openly stated he would be intimidated by Liston and would lose to him. Liston wasn't intimidated by anyone.

Key Losses- Liston
Liston only had 1 legit loss since both his fights with Ali were fixed, and the martin ko was when he was a very old man. And his only legit loss was avenged twice. He was laughing and Marshall took this oppurtinity to punch him in the mouth, breaking his jaw in the process. Tyson only had 3 legit losses, the other 2 losses happened when he was ultra washed up and had no buisness being in the ring.
Buster Douglas was 63 with an 83 reach that gave Tyson major trouble. Douglas also troubled Tyson with his jab.
Lennox Lewis was 65 with an 84 reach that dominated Mike Tyson.
Evander Holyfield was 62 with a 78 reach that kept Tyson at bay.
Liston was also taller than Mike and had an 84 inch reach. Jabs troubled Tyson. Also none of those 3 men had jabs on the same league as Liston.
Stamina-Liston. Liston went the distance when he seldom needed to. Liston seemed to have endless energy against Whitehurt throwing as many punches as Marciano.
Tyson was a power fighter who only had 18 fights (32 percent) go past the fourth round. Tyson fans will point to his devastating punching power as the main driver behind this statistic. In his documentary, Mike Tyson provides contradictory information that no fan can deny.

Tyson says, I had a lung problem, thats why my fights didnt last long.

48 or 85 percent of Alis fights went past the fourth round with the majority of them going the distance.

Tysons power and suspect lungs kept him out of long fights, but his lack of endurance was apparent in fights that went long. Tyson lost six fights; five of those losses came after the fourth round.

Pre Clay Liston knocks Tyson out.

The Clay-Liston fights were not fixed either, Clay just broke Liston mentally IMO. He couldn’t believe a man would show him such disdain in the build up and when Clay backed it up in the ring Liston completely fell apart.

[lopetego]

Pre Clay Liston knocks Tyson out.

The Clay-Liston fights were not fixed either, Clay just broke Liston mentally IMO. He couldn’t believe a man would show him such disdain in the build up and when Clay backed it up in the ring Liston completely fell apart.

Nah, the ¨phantom punch¨ match was definetly fixed

no way Liston, one of the toughest, grittiest guys in the business would get KO'd with a half assed punch like that

specially from Ali who wasn't a big puncher at all

imagine if Floyd-Margarito actually happened and Floyd KO'd Margo with one punch. it was that ridiculous

that was a dive

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

Nah, the ¨phantom punch¨ match was definetly fixed

no way Liston, one of the toughest, grittiest guys in the business would get KO'd with a half assed punch like that

specially from Ali who wasn't a big puncher at all

imagine if Floyd-Margarito actually happened and Floyd KO'd Margo with one punch. it was that ridiculous

that was a dive

I think he dived cause he didn’t want to be in there personally. Clay had broken him but he had to take the rematch cause he needed the money. It was a quit rather than a fix IMO.

[Ascended]

Nah, the ¨phantom punch¨ match was definetly fixed

no way Liston, one of the toughest, grittiest guys in the business would get KO'd with a half assed punch like that

specially from Ali who wasn't a big puncher at all

imagine if Floyd-Margarito actually happened and Floyd KO'd Margo with one punch. it was that ridiculous

that was a dive

why couldn't he ali dropped joe and joe was way tougher to taking shots he could see so stop overrating your weird

and why did you say ali wasnt a big puncher he was a sharp puncher most the time those types are the ones who cause damage from mutiple punches cause of the sharp effect and it's been mutiple people with those type of punches that dropped people so your talking like a person who doesnt know much about how boxing or different type of punches work