Who ranks higher alltime? Wlad or Tyson

[LacedUp]

wlad wasn't no where near his prime when he suffered those defeats.

prime is not determined by age or no of figts. in case of wlad is defined with manny's involvement with him.

wlad is much better figter now than he used to be when he fough sander/Brewster. he does everything better. even his speed was improved. he was faster and more elusive against haye then against any of his previous opponents.

Nowhere near his prime huh? I seem to remember Wlad defending his world title for the 6th time vs Sanders. Can you name me any other world champion in history who wasn't prime at 27 after holding their title for 3 years and defending it 6 times?

Fighters lose in their prime. Wlad certainly lost twice in his prime. Just because he doesn't lose now, has no implication on whether he was prime then or not. When has he fought a big strong natural heavy, that is quick and can punch like Sanders? Eh... There's your reason.

Wlad lost on his prime. Please don't stoop to the level of guys like the one who posted above you.

[Simurgh]

Nowhere near his prime huh? I seem to remember Wlad defending his world title for the 6th time vs Sanders. Can you name me any other world champion in history who wasn't prime at 27 after holding their title for 3 years and defending it 6 times?

Fighters lose in their prime. Wlad certainly lost twice in his prime. Just because he doesn't lose now, has no implication on whether he was prime then or not. When has he fought a big strong natural heavy, that is quick and can punch like Sanders? Eh... There's your reason.

Wlad lost on his prime. Please don't stoop to the level of guys like the one who posted above you.

Sorry but I can't agree.

Watching Wlad for a long time and re-watching his fights on the regular basis leaves no doubt in my mind he wasn't in his prime during those fights.

I define prime as a fighter's peak.

Tell me one think. If today's Wlad or Wlad from Haye's fight fights Sander's/Brewster's version of Wlad who would win that one?

I have today's Wlad winning 19/20 times against that version that lost to Sanders.

Saying he didn't improve and became a better fighter is neglecting all the good stuff Manny did with Wlad - and IMO the difference is massive.

[LacedUp]

Sorry but I can't agree.

Watching Wlad for a long time and re-watching his fights on the regular basis leaves no doubt in my mind he wasn't in his prime during those fights.

I define prime as a fighter's peak.

Tell me one think. If today's Wlad or Wlad from Haye's fight fights Sander's/Brewster's version of Wlad who would win that one?

I have today's Wlad winning 19/20 times against that version that lost to Sanders.

Saying he didn't improve and became a better fighter is neglecting all the good stuff Manny did with Wlad - and IMO the difference is massive.

I never said that he was the best Wlad ever on the night he fought Brewster. You're not your best when you are losing.

But prime defines physical, mental and fighting prime. Like Lennox before him, he has a long prime. I understand that he wasn't vintage, or the best Wlad, but he was prime nevertheless. Like Lennox was in his prime when he lost to McCall.

No shame that he lost, he came back stronger like true champions do. But he hasn't faced great fighters since, and you have to admit that. If you can't admit it, I'd like for you to back it up.

[Szef]

Wlad was 27 years old with 41 professional fights when he fought Sanders: He was in his ****ing prime dip****.

Poet

No he wasn't. He was and is in his prime when Steward started to train him and you fuckin know it. Go listen to Bowie and get lost lavender boy

[Simurgh]

I never said that he was the best Wlad ever on the night he fought Brewster. You're not your best when you are losing.

But prime defines physical, mental and fighting prime. Like Lennox before him, he has a long prime. I understand that he wasn't vintage, or the best Wlad, but he was prime nevertheless. Like Lennox was in his prime when he lost to McCall.

No shame that he lost, he came back stronger like true champions do. But he hasn't faced great fighters since, and you have to admit that. If you can't admit it, I'd like for you to back it up.

Ok. Wlad form 2002 to late 2005 was not the prime version of Wlad. It was good but not prime.

What I am saying here is that he didn't develop his style to the level of today's Wlad. I am taking into account all fights - not just where he lost.

He relied on his straight right too much, he didn't control the distance nowhere near as good as he does it today, his defense wasn't as good, I never seen him adopt to fighter's style in the middle of fight like he did against TT I (awkward crafty big southpaw), he didn't pace himself as well as he is doing that today, his jab although was already extremely good it wasn't multipurpose one - he always had a stiff jab but these days he can use it as a distance measure very well, his left hook is much better these days and finally his mentality is better - I think Wlad from 2002/05 would start to panic if he was hit by those clean punches from Haye or Wach. He knows what to do now. He was coming back at Sanders and Brewster after being KD. That was a big mistake.

So mentally and fighting-wise he is a much better fighter than he used to be. Physically, I think he improved there as well - maybe not as much, but I remember Haye commenting on how Wlad's physic is getting better and better every time he fights.

Lennox was closer to his prime in the sense he was more complete fighter when Manny took him, but IMO he wasn't in his prime when Oliver KOed him. Similarly to wlad he rely too much on his right.

[slimshandy69]

Wlad is breaking records and has literally not lost a round since 2004

Tysons best wins are???Burbick??Bruno???spinks???

Comon Tysons not fit to be in a 100000 mile radius of Wladimir Klitsckos shoes laces.

[Malius]

I think this comparison is very similar to RJJ / Hopkins debate.
Explosiveness/Dominance over longevity

[titanium]

Tyson unified all the titles and was undisputed. That is what counts in the real world.

[DreamFighter]

of cretins posting here about Wlad being prime now. Athletes start losing fitness from 30 onwards due to changes in lung and cardio, but at first its not noticeable and can be bucked with other advances like being smart. However you cant change what you are losing, and your prime is still around the age of 27-32.


All this change of style malarkey making him primer as well what a load of BS. Wlad is a near forty year old man not an infant, if you haven't developed your prime style before you are 35 then exactly what kind of incompetent boxer are you? Simple matter is that WLad fights weaker opponents than even a 38 year old unfit fat part time golfer, and he runs in abject fear from them until they gass and then KOs them and that's why he keeps winning.

But if he raises his bar and you put him in the ring with the next 38 year fat part time golfer and hes going to end up KOed again.

Taking nothing away from his remarkable longevity and professional approach to being an athlete, hes done a good job of that and hes a surprisingly good defensive boxer for a guy who dwarves most of his opponents.

[DreamFighter]

Tyson higher really, wlad has never reached the level he did and would never be able to.

Whereas Tyson with the right protection and management could have lasted as long as Wlad.