My Problem with Adrien Broner

[soul_survivor]

This is a bit of a self indulgent thread considering everyone is posting about last night's fight but I really wanted to get a couple things off my chest. Coming into this fight I had Broner a big favourite, possibly winning by stoppage. Say what you want about the kids personality and lack of charisma/likability but he knows how to box and hits hard. His time at SFW was terrific, the kid was champion when he was barely 21 and was knocking out grown men. His move up to and subsequent dismantling of DeMarco was terrific but not as impressive as everyone makes it out to be.

In my eyes, DeMarco wasn't the clear divisonal number one, Burns has a very good case for that slow (in the absence of Broner is probably the best at 135). But props where props are due and Broner beat DeMarco up. It was classy and brutal but the Floyd wanabe showed us some real cracks, he can't hit while the other guy is hitting back and he takes too many punches. He seems to be tailor made for a guy like Matthysse, Maidana or even Ortiz (in the right frame of mind). Unless Broner has Ali levels of recuperative power and chin he can't take punches from those guys and keep marching them down.

Broner is an offensive fighter with what looks to be a solid defense but really isn't. He may want to be like Floyd but he is levels behind.

The Paulie fight showcased how easily Broner can be found, a bit more pop and Broner would have been backed up, sadly the always entertaining Paulie has always lacked power. I reckon there are B level featherweights who probably hit harder. But all the punches Broner took, all the defensive skill he lacked, none of that surprised me as much as his inability to step through the gears, an accusation I've leveled at the likes of Kell Brook in the past. Broner was happy landing shots every now and then and just walked straight forward with minimal head movement.

I'm worried now, can Broner be a true champion and fight guys like Lucas, Garcia, Ortiz, Guerrero, Maidana and even Devon/Khan? He certainly has the power but the defense is too predictable. Add to that a totally classless post fight interview and Broner maybe heading further away from the superstardom US networks seems to want to bestow on him.

Just a look at possible WW/LWW opponents:

First of all the top 140 pounders out there are:
Garcia
Matthysse
Peterson
Judah
Rios
Alvarado
and Amir Khan (if he hasn't moved up to 147)

Who can Broner beat realistically? I reckon he has enough power to stop Khan and hurt Peterson and Judah. Can he beat them? Possibly. Garcia, Mikey and Lucas not only hurt Broner but possibly stop him.

Now the WWs:
Alexander
Brook
Bradley
Guerrero
Thurman
Maidana

Alexander would probably outbox Broner for a number of rounds and get a decision. Guys like Bradley, Guerrero and Maidana throw far too much and have chins to match. Bradley and Guerrero would smother Broner for every minute of every round and Maidana may even stop him...then again, he has been down and Broner has the power to hurt him. I might be the only one but I'm not high on Thurman and think Broner stops him but that fight doesn't happen any time soon. Brook on the other hand may be Broner's best bet, he often fails to escape second gear and can get hit and hurt. Broner may work him over and go through for a decision.

I've obviously left out JMM, Pac and PBF, those guys beat the **** outta Broner.

I think it benefits Broner to stay away from the smaller but more dangerous fighters at 140 and make a quick buck at 147 fighting faded forces like Mosley (every likelihood this fight happens next).

Oh and for the record, my card for Broner v Malignaggi:
1. Paulie
2. Paulie
3. Broner
4. Broner
5. Broner
6. Paulie
7. Broner
8. Broner
9. Paulie
10. Broner
11. Broner
12. Paulie

115-113 Broner damn close fight for a faded guy against a one time supposed world beater.

Having said that, Broner is still 23 and most fighters at 23 are still learning the ropes. The guy needs to clean up his act outside the ropes but in between them he is learning lessons he needs.

[craigus1990]

I said in a previous thread that a lot of the things Paulie did well were things that not that many fighters in and around the weight class are that good at. He used his versatile jab, great footwork, head movement and intellect to box a great fight. Not many people can use their feet like Paulie to avoid the counter shots coming back.
I totally agree that Broner needs to learn not to go into his shell so much. The transition between defense and offense for him takes too long and he is unable to do them both at the same time very often. It is clearly evident that at the moment his style is like a poor mans version of Floyd vs Mosley. He has the high shoulder and is hard to hit clean but he lacks all of the things that make Floyd so good, like the lateral movement, the footwork, the pull counters and many other things. Saying this though, I don't see many people having the footwork and mix of defense and offense to beat Broner at the moment who are viable opponents.
I think Guerrero would have about as good a chance as anyone because he is southpaw, tall, long, throws lots of shots from all angles, has a good chin, throws good body shots etc. I think most people however would lose to Broner... Bradley squares up too often and is too open for right hands, he also doesn't have power to trouble Broner... Garcia again is too open and his shots are tailor made for Broners defense, all his shots would be caught on the gloves/shoulder... The same goes for Lucas... No point naming TR fighters because they are not happening... Floyd fight won't happen... Khans chin just would not hold up.... Kell Brook might be interesting because Kell can use his feet when he wants to and throws nice shots but let's face it, he hasn't even had a title fight yet so he needs to step up his competition before we weigh that one up. So as much as I hate to say it... I think Broner goes undefeated for a little while yet.

[SkillspayBills]

Demarco was WITHOUT A DOUBT the Number 1 guy at 35. Anyone that says different is a hating scumbag.

[UTEP]

]Demarco was WITHOUT A DOUBT the Number 1 guy at 35[/B]. Anyone that says different is a hating scumbag.

How the hell was Demarco #1 when Vazquez was champ Waaayyyyy before DeMarco was??? also Abril's schooling of Brandon Rios is better than anything DeMarco did at 135.

[-EAGLE-]

Demarco was beaten the **** up by Edwin Valero and his style was perfect for Broner. **** outta here

[Curtiz]

broner has no power in this division lol

[StarPower]

Broner will be fine as long as hes focused. He tends to fight down to his competition. He seems more worried about becoming a star first, and a great fighter second. Going 12 rounds with Paulie was actually good work for Broner.

[toshmurph]

How the hell was Demarco #1 when Vazquez was champ Waaayyyyy before DeMarco was??? also Abril's schooling of Brandon Rios is better than anything DeMarco did at 135.

You got in before me! I was never too high on Demarco, I always thought Vasquez was the man at 135.

[pgolf]

DeMarco was a solid win, but Vasquez IMO was #1. And that was at lightweight. He's now fighting @147. Top level fighters are bigger punchers (except Paulie) who can take a punch.

Also, keep in mind DeMarco is sloooww. In Broner's last two fight, he didn't look that fast and he was there to be hit.

[soul_survivor]

I said in a previous thread that a lot of the things Paulie did well were things that not that many fighters in and around the weight class are that good at. He used his versatile jab, great footwork, head movement and intellect to box a great fight. Not many people can use their feet like Paulie to avoid the counter shots coming back.
I totally agree that Broner needs to learn not to go into his shell so much. The transition between defense and offense for him takes too long and he is unable to do them both at the same time very often. It is clearly evident that at the moment his style is like a poor mans version of Floyd vs Mosley. He has the high shoulder and is hard to hit clean but he lacks all of the things that make Floyd so good, like the lateral movement, the footwork, the pull counters and many other things. Saying this though, I don't see many people having the footwork and mix of defense and offense to beat Broner at the moment who are viable opponents.
I think Guerrero would have about as good a chance as anyone because he is southpaw, tall, long, throws lots of shots from all angles, has a good chin, throws good body shots etc. I think most people however would lose to Broner... Bradley squares up too often and is too open for right hands, he also doesn't have power to trouble Broner... Garcia again is too open and his shots are tailor made for Broners defense, all his shots would be caught on the gloves/shoulder... The same goes for Lucas... No point naming TR fighters because they are not happening... Floyd fight won't happen... Khans chin just would not hold up.... Kell Brook might be interesting because Kell can use his feet when he wants to and throws nice shots but let's face it, he hasn't even had a title fight yet so he needs to step up his competition before we weigh that one up. So as much as I hate to say it... I think Broner goes undefeated for a little while yet.

I get what you're saying, Broner is no push over but I just don't think he beats any of the elite at 140 or 147. Lucas can definitely beat Broner, or so I think anyway, I know it's all hypothetical but with the pressure Paulie was able to apply, Lucas would do a lot more damage. I know Paulie's footwork has always been god but he was slowing down when Khan fought him, last night was the slowest I'd ever seen him and Broner still couldn't hit him as often as he would have liked.
Guerero v Broner might be a good fight cos Robert is wild and far too open but I just don't see Broner hurting a big guy like The Ghost. That would be a hell of a close fight.

But can we all agree the Floyd/Broner comparisons must stop?