Reason's Why Wladimir Klitschko Is Not An ATG

[D-MiZe]

No. The joke is on you and your insane logic - Better single win - Higher ATG ranking.

That's seriously funny. I hope you are joking though.

No what's seriously funny is make you a stupid assumption.

I base ATG rankings on;

- Resume
- Attributes
- Performances


The point I'm trying to make, which is funnily enough the only thing you aren't picking apart is that Wlad has not beat the sort of opponent that warrants an ATG ranking. Now, I do not consider Joe Calzaghe an ATG either but arguably he has a better claim then Wlad with his win over Hopkins.

Both men dominated their respective divisions, Calzaghe had to move up for that big win though, Wlad doesn't really have the opportunity. That's unfortunate but ultimately, that's what I look for in ranking a fighter. The only way you can prove your ability is by beating a fighter who's already proven to be very, very good.

[Pacquiao'd]

Not an atg imoTheres no one on his resume bc the division is so weak

[Jedi Vader]

I will go with Emanuel's opinion...

“Wlad has the best footwork, co-ordination and balance of any fighter I have ever worked with. He’s the most accurate, single-punch knockout guy I have seen.

A guy can be completely fine, not hurt, and Wladimir can put his lights out with one shot.

He is the most powerful natural talent I have worked with. In terms of jab, Wladimir is the best and after him I would put Lennox.

Lewis was a more versatile fighter but in terms of boxing arsenal, Wladimir is better.”

I don't mind how someone ranks the fighters. It's personal and subjective. What I mind is when someone tries to prove how his own views are right and of others are wrong.

I won't try to convince noone Wlad is ATG. I believe he is and many do. Whoever doesn't, that's fine, but don't trying to convince other how they are wrong and you are right only because your subjective criteria or affinities towards particular fighter are not fulfilled.

I have some stuff to do now... will drop by later this evening.

So will I.

Q: On a somewhat related note Emanuel, a lot of fans claim that the heavyweight division is weak right now. Can you recall any time in history where the division had a similar state and what do you think needs to be done in order for this to recover in the eyes of the fans?

A: I think that the heavyweight division is the weakest that I ever saw it, that I can recall, I would put it this way, but if you look back at history it happens like this. I think it’s worse now because you don’t have anything coming from the amateurs. That’s what troubles me. It used to be weak, but you always had the George Foreman or even Klitschko. He is the last of the amateur program fighters from ’96. He’s the last product that came from the amateur system to the pros and that was what, about fourteen years ago now, and that’s what the problem is. There’s nothing coming from the amateur system, and I don’t see it worldwide, even these Cubans or whatever and the Russians. I don’t see much coming. I don’t see anything else coming up. It’s a weak heavyweight division and I don’t see anything too much coming up that’s going to make it any better in the future.

But if you look back through history, Joe Louis had that era when he went on the “Bum of the Month Club” as they called it and he was fighting with ‘Two Ton’ Tony Galento, the bar tenders, and this and that. Then I remember when Tyson was the same way. Nobody was up there for Mike. He was at the time considered fighting Pinklon Thomas and them, but I still thought those were better fighters but the public thought he was that dominating, but that was still a tough era. They said the same with Lennox. Lennox was having a weak division, but I thought that was better still. You still had guys such as Shannon Briggs and good competitive guys out there.

This is the weakest that I have ever seen it but it’s part of heavyweight history and that’s why we have these “Bum of the Month Clubs” and all that, and all of a sudden out of nowhere—somebody explodes on the scene. Right now, the biggest explosion has been David Haye and it’s nothing he did in the ring. Just verbally running his mouth he’s created a lot of excitement and a big buzz about himself. But it is weak, and I never saw it this weak and I hope that it will change but I just don’t even see it changing for maybe about another five years.

http://www.e a s t sideboxing.com/weblog/news.php?p=23586&more=1

[Jedi Vader]

No what's seriously funny is make you a stupid assumption.

I base ATG rankings on;

- Resume
- Attributes
- Performances


The point I'm trying to make, which is funnily enough the only thing you aren't picking apart is that Wlad has not beat the sort of opponent that warrants an ATG ranking. Now, I do not consider Joe Calzaghe an ATG either but arguably he has a better claim then Wlad with his win over Hopkins.

Both men dominated their respective divisions, Calzaghe had to move up for that big win though, Wlad doesn't really have the opportunity. That's unfortunate but ultimately, that's what I look for in ranking a fighter. The only way you can prove your ability is by beating a fighter who's already proven to be very, very good.

Have you noticed how Nelson ducked your question in telling us who Klit's best two wins are?

[Huxley]

Longevity & dominance don't count for much when the competition is weak.

Nor is he an ATG regardless as he's regarded by most not to be an ATG. To me, all an ATG needs to do is prove himself. Sal Sanchez only held his belt for 2 years but is considered by most to be an ATG.

Resumes, 99% of the time are fact. Who you beat and how you beat them, the odd occasion there is robberies etc. But it's a record of proven ability, Wlad's claim to greatness is speculation.

Wlad doesn't really have any 'special' attributes either. He utilises a style that maximises his physical gifts, strong jab, powerful right cross, snapping left hook, quick feet but nothing that I'd consider 'special'.

Wouldn't call Wlad's competition weak. Yes he's had some soft opponents over the years, but so has any great champ down history. Especially when Wlad has all these titles, it's unavoidable he ends up fighting quite a few less desirable mandatories.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

This thread has lasted forever......

There is a difference between ATG and a Hall of Famer...

ATG is the absolute greatest of the great,,, Guys like Ali, SRR, SRL, Duran, Floyd

Hall of famers or just a great fighter can dominate their era but maybe not an ATG
Guys like Cotto, Wlad, Virgil Hill, Morales, those guys are great, will be hall of famers, best of their era, JUST NOT THE BEST OF ALL TIME

No way is wlad an ATG, He is great but def not an atg... He will go down in history but not on the same level as ali, SRL, SRR etc

[Simurgh]

This thread has lasted forever......

There is a difference between ATG and a Hall of Famer...

ATG is the absolute greatest of the great,,, Guys like Ali, SRR, SRL, Duran, Floyd

Hall of famers or just a great fighter can dominate their era but maybe not an ATG
Guys like Cotto, Wlad, Virgil Hill, Morales, those guys are great, will be hall of famers, best of their era, JUST NOT THE BEST OF ALL TIME

No way is wlad an ATG, He is great but def not an atg... He will go down in history but not on the same level as ali, SRL, SRR etc

And there is no ATG definition that everybody agrees on.

When I talk about Wlad I talk about HW alone.

And he is most definitely HW ATG! He would dominate most eras and would be a very taught fight for any HW that ever lived.

[Jedi Vader]

And there is no ATG definition that everybody agrees on.

When I talk about Wlad I talk about HW alone.

And he is most definitely HW ATG! He would dominate most eras and would be a very taught fight for any HW that ever lived.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Steward says all that stuff about how wlad is the greatest guy ever but that is all just BS, he was just trying to hype wlad up....

Steward knows that tommy hearns was the best guy he ever had... Iv seen him say it a million times...
Kinda like when arum had floyd and called him the best iv seen since SRL but then floyd leaves and manny is best ever...

[STEELHEAD]

And there is no ATG definition that everybody agrees on.

When I talk about Wlad I talk about HW alone.

And he is most definitely HW ATG! He would dominate most eras and would be a very taught fight for any HW that ever lived.

and you have your head up your ass!