Can someone help me about the Mayweather vs Top Rank Situation?

[A-Wolf]

Some inquiries....

1. How does Top Rank refuse a Delahoya fight with Mayweather, because there wasn't enough money to be made on his end?

Mayweather wanted 20 million for Delahoya, and actually made 25 million+ after the fight. That's a few million for Arum.

2. How was Top Rank able to offer 8 million for a Margarito fight, but only 6/7 million for Cotto and Hatton who were arguably as or more popular at the time?

3. Did Mayweather buy out of his contract before the Baldomir fight with the Delahoya fight already lined up?

I'm not big on negotiations so if anyone could help me out here it'd be appreciated.

I'll address this one.

The simple answer is Arum wanted desperately to make Margarito a star to increase the value of his product. The more complex answer has to do with newly acquired Arum controlled television broadcast rights In Mexico at the time.

Bob Arum is a chess player. He's always thinking four, five, six moves ahead on the board. The eight million dollars was an investment towards future earnings in the multi multi millions had Margarito prevailed over Mayweather. The eight million dollar figure (big money to Floyd at the time) was an attempt at tempting Mayweather to actually make the match which was of course foolhardy on Arum's part.

[Calabis]

That was an awesome read. Thank you for that. Do you have a link though?

yes wasn't sure if I could post them


http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/box...ory?id=2420382

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/mo...ticle-1.289909

[bravestone]

I'll address this one.

The simple answer is Arum wanted desperately to make Margarito a star to increase the value of his product. The more complex answer has to do with newly acquired Arum controlled television broadcast rights In Mexico at the time.

Bob Arum is a chess player. He's always thinking four, five, six moves ahead on the board. The eight million dollars was an investment towards future earnings in the multi multi millions had Margarito prevailed over Mayweather. The eight million dollar figure (big money to Floyd at the time) was an attempt at tempting Mayweather to actually make the match which was of course foolhardy on Arum's part.

So you believe Arum knew Floyd would turn that down if Arum turned down the DLH extension simultaneously?

[Ray*]

Ok so Floyd would rather have not extended the contract:

In order to pursue Delahoya and grow his own brand?

and basically work as a freelance boxer working with other promoters.
Does Mayweather have a license?

Pretty much, Arum never thought he would amount to this. He basically didn't bat an eyelid when the $750 K was written into his last contract with Top rank. After leaving Arum he was able to market his career the way he wanted to and the way he thought Arum should have, he got paid lot of money to fight Baldomir thanks to Arum "$8m" offer to Mayweather to fight Margarito and then he was able to get the De la Hoya fight, a fight Arum said "There was no money in" and " you know when to fold them" etc Mayweather and his team basically outfox Arum just like De la Hoya did.

[HeroBando]

Yeah, Top Rank should've just let the fight happen. Reminds me of the Delahoya/Mayweather negotiations really now, why not just have TR let the fight go on?

I dunno, Bob is a jackass, but that offer sure sounds fishy.

[bravestone]

Pretty much, Arum never thought he would amount to this. He basically didn't bat an eyelid when the $750 K was written into his last contract with Top rank. After leaving Arum he was able to market his career the way he wanted to and the way he thought Arum should have, he got paid lot of money to fight Baldomir thanks to Arum "$8m" offer to Mayweather to fight Margarito and then he was able to get the De la Hoya fight, a fight Arum said "There was no money in" and " you know when to fold them" etc Mayweather and his team basically outfox Arum just like De la Hoya did.

That's what I don't get..how is there 8 million for guys like Baldomir, but not 20 million for a DLH fight!?

I mean was Arum that bitter?

[Ray*]

That's what I don't get..how is there 8 million for guys like Baldomir, but not 20 million for a DLH fight!?

I mean was Arum that bitter?

Of course Arum is bitter. Hopefully he would be retired or gone from boxing sooner rather than later. You saw what he said about Cotto AFTER Cotto left him and refuse to participate in another catchweight fight against Pacquiao. The man is just a disgusting human being to deal with sometimes.

[Calabis]

Pretty much, Arum never thought he would amount to this. He basically didn't bat an eyelid when the $750 K was written into his last contract with Top rank. After leaving Arum he was able to market his career the way he wanted to and the way he thought Arum should have, he got paid lot of money to fight Baldomir thanks to Arum "$8m" offer to Mayweather to fight Margarito and then he was able to get the De la Hoya fight, a fight Arum said "There was no money in" and " you know when to fold them" etc Mayweather and his team basically outfox Arum just like De la Hoya did.

Great Point

The source of the dispute stems from Mayweather’s time as a Top Rank fighter. Tim Smith from the Daily-News chronicles the initial fallout, contractual buyout, and eventual lawsuits filed between the two camps. Some of the finer points include:

Mayweather claims that Arum shortchanged him on matches against Arturo Gatti in 2005 and Zab Judah in 2006. In the lawsuit, Mayweather said he was due 85% of Top Rank's revenue from the Gatti fight and 80% from the Judah fight. He claims Arum has refused to turn over the records for accounting.
"There's no question we owe him some money," Arum said. "There's no dispute there. But he owes us a lot of money, and the people he's involved with owe us even more. After 98% of the money we owed him was paid, we stopped paying him for a reason.

"We're owed ... in the millions. We welcome this lawsuit. We wanted it to be filed. We have counterclaims and cross claims against certain other individuals involved with Mayweather.”

Arum and Mayweather parted ways in 2006 after Mayweather paid $750,000 to buy out his contract. That was triggered by Arum's refusal to guarantee Mayweather $20 million to fight Oscar De La Hoya, another Top Rank client, who successfully sued Arum to get out of his contract in 2001.

Mayweather believes that Arum stymied his career during the time that he was promoting both Mayweather and De La Hoya (from 1996-2001).

With the facts laid out so well, it is unnecessary to embellish the data. It is evident their dispute rages as a result of unresolved legal issues; money that is owed, fights that weren’t made, and respect that has been lost. Despite Arum’s attempt to sway public opinion, the data clearly disproves his claim that Mayweather is somehow “fearful” and is “ducking” Miguel Cotto. If anything, Mayweather is asserting his independence and is showing confidence in his newly acquired ability to do business with his interest, not Top Rank’s in mind.

As part of his smear campaign against Floyd, Arum often states that “Mayweather does not want to fight Cotto,” but he never quite confirms that “Cotto wants to fight Mayweather.” A better question would be does Arum truly want Mayweather to fight Cotto? If so, why hasn’t he made Floyd and offer? The 8 million dollar offer to fight Antonio Margarito in 2006 is well documented but where are the 10-20 million dollar proposals to fight Cotto? Could it be that Arum realizes the match-up is a potential lose-lose situation for Top Rank? Is the risk worth the reward? Mayweather will certainly gear all the pre-fight negotiations in his favor--from the money split, to the size of the ring, gloves, weight, location, etc...Also, it’s expected that Mayweather will not give Arum any options on future fights. Finally, if Cotto is soundly defeated, Top Rank loses their top prospect. His unblemished record will be gone, his aura of invincibility gone, and depending on how badly he is defeated, his market value will depreciate.

Knowing that he won’t get the upper hand at the negotiation table, Arum has resulted to insulting, criticizing, and feeding the fans “fearful” nonsense about Mayweather. It should be noted that he utilized these same tactics when De La Hoya left him in 2001. The role reversals have obviously been chipping away at his ego. According to Mayweather’s advisor Leonard Ellerbe, Arum’s “a bitter old man because Floyd outsmarted him,” the evidence suggest that this may be true. So as the flame war continues, it appears this very personal business battle will rage on indefinitely. It took Golden Boy Promotions and Top Rank years to work together and it may likewise be the same with Mayweather Promotions. What is unmistakable however is that De La Hoya left Arum and has thrived, Mayweather left Arum and has thrived; would it be ironic if Cotto ultimately did the same? “The world awaits.”

[bravestone]

Great Point

The source of the dispute stems from Mayweather’s time as a Top Rank fighter. Tim Smith from the Daily-News chronicles the initial fallout, contractual buyout, and eventual lawsuits filed between the two camps. Some of the finer points include:

Mayweather claims that Arum shortchanged him on matches against Arturo Gatti in 2005 and Zab Judah in 2006. In the lawsuit, Mayweather said he was due 85% of Top Rank's revenue from the Gatti fight and 80% from the Judah fight. He claims Arum has refused to turn over the records for accounting.
"There's no question we owe him some money," Arum said. "There's no dispute there. But he owes us a lot of money, and the people he's involved with owe us even more. After 98% of the money we owed him was paid, we stopped paying him for a reason.

"We're owed ... in the millions. We welcome this lawsuit. We wanted it to be filed. We have counterclaims and cross claims against certain other individuals involved with Mayweather.”

Arum and Mayweather parted ways in 2006 after Mayweather paid $750,000 to buy out his contract. That was triggered by Arum's refusal to guarantee Mayweather $20 million to fight Oscar De La Hoya, another Top Rank client, who successfully sued Arum to get out of his contract in 2001.

Mayweather believes that Arum stymied his career during the time that he was promoting both Mayweather and De La Hoya (from 1996-2001).

With the facts laid out so well, it is unnecessary to embellish the data. It is evident their dispute rages as a result of unresolved legal issues; money that is owed, fights that weren’t made, and respect that has been lost. Despite Arum’s attempt to sway public opinion, the data clearly disproves his claim that Mayweather is somehow “fearful” and is “ducking” Miguel Cotto. If anything, Mayweather is asserting his independence and is showing confidence in his newly acquired ability to do business with his interest, not Top Rank’s in mind.

As part of his smear campaign against Floyd, Arum often states that “Mayweather does not want to fight Cotto,” but he never quite confirms that “Cotto wants to fight Mayweather.” A better question would be does Arum truly want Mayweather to fight Cotto? If so, why hasn’t he made Floyd and offer? The 8 million dollar offer to fight Antonio Margarito in 2006 is well documented but where are the 10-20 million dollar proposals to fight Cotto? Could it be that Arum realizes the match-up is a potential lose-lose situation for Top Rank? Is the risk worth the reward? Mayweather will certainly gear all the pre-fight negotiations in his favor--from the money split, to the size of the ring, gloves, weight, location, etc...Also, it’s expected that Mayweather will not give Arum any options on future fights. Finally, if Cotto is soundly defeated, Top Rank loses their top prospect. His unblemished record will be gone, his aura of invincibility gone, and depending on how badly he is defeated, his market value will depreciate.

Knowing that he won’t get the upper hand at the negotiation table, Arum has resulted to insulting, criticizing, and feeding the fans “fearful” nonsense about Mayweather. It should be noted that he utilized these same tactics when De La Hoya left him in 2001. The role reversals have obviously been chipping away at his ego. According to Mayweather’s advisor Leonard Ellerbe, Arum’s “a bitter old man because Floyd outsmarted him,” the evidence suggest that this may be true. So as the flame war continues, it appears this very personal business battle will rage on indefinitely. It took Golden Boy Promotions and Top Rank years to work together and it may likewise be the same with Mayweather Promotions. What is unmistakable however is that De La Hoya left Arum and has thrived, Mayweather left Arum and has thrived; would it be ironic if Cotto ultimately did the same? “The world awaits.”

Oh wow....how do most fighters stay with this guy?

[HeroBando]

Oh wow....how do most fighters stay with this guy?

Because the alternative is getting paid like Mares. Who do you think is getting it better, him or 11 fight 11 fan Rigo?

It's the "let them eat cake" attitude, you've been around too long to be selling that. 99% of the fighters in the sport have a promoter and need one. Even Mr promoter Floyd is still only that in name after all these years. Only one guy has truly gone off on his own. So it's not a percentage play