"Boxing Historian" Muhammad Ali Was A BUM

[ßringer]

Must be MARKBNLV's dad.

[ßringer]

The man is allowed his opinion. Everyone gets called a racist hater if they are not an Ali fan. And who the hell is Ellie Suckbeck to argue with him? A damn Jew with a video camera?

The irony!!!

[S. Saddler 1310]

Here is the facts:

oh boy, here we go.

Did Ali have one punch KO power: No.

is that alone a strong basis for a slamming critique of the HWGOAT? no

Does Ali get more repect for his achievments because of his current condition: Yes.

try no. he gets the respect he deserves for being the HWGOAT.

Did Ali's trainer save his ass against Cooper by buying time?: Yes.

greatly exaggerated.

Did Ali lose to Norton those times?: Yes.

arguable.

The man told no lies here.

for a start, the unpleasant old bounder stated that Norton was "robbed" three times. Norton officially won his first fight with Ali. maybe he wasn't 'lying', but he is clueless.

[DreamFighter]

The man is allowed his opinion. Everyone gets called a racist hater if they are not an Ali fan. And who the hell is Ellie Suckbeck to argue with him? An idiot with a video camera?

of course he is allowed an opinion.

So is everyone else, and there opinion is that this man is an idiot.

Hes way beyond the Klitscho fan who thinks his man is an ATG.

[NoLove]

is that alone a strong basis for a slamming critique of the HWGOAT? no

Of course not, but like I said, it is a fact.

try no. he gets the respect he deserves for being the HWGOAT.

So did many others. Joe Louis beat many greats? He doesn't get anywhere near the recognition Ali does. You really think he gets no sympathy?

greatly exaggerated.

Watch the fight.

arguable.

Ali disagrees with you in his autobiography.

[joseph5620]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJ223

I like this old guy, he gives his honest opinion, and makes a good point but I wouldn't call Ali a bum that is harsh he sounds like a Flom0 there lol. but people take into account the type of political figure he was and use that aura and his illness and all the hype and publicity he received during the civil rights movement and celeb backing he had and call him the greatest, but if he didn't stand up against the war or was used as a political civil rights figure he would be just another boxer with a loud mouth.

Judge his boxing not his outside accomplishments and political movement.

Ali had a lot of suspect wins too, like when Dundee cut his gloves, also his norton fights, and he was knocked down by a small fighter and almost out, lost the first fight to Frazier, struggled with frazier, to me Ali's best win is George Foreman but even that is tarnished because Foreman could have been slipped mickey and given drugged water in that corrupt country, also Ali used PEDS for the Holmes fight just watch the 30 30 episode. I think Cus D Amato called Ali a bum who fought nothing but bum of the month, Cus even said he could develop a fighter to beat him.

I like Ali but I do think he is kinda overrated, my favorite heavyweight was Larry Holmes, very underrated and also George Foreman and Lennox Lewis.

I stopped reading when you said "Dundee cut his gloves" That never happened and is a myth. I lost interest in anything you said after that.


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[S. Saddler 1310]

Of course not, but like I said, it is a fact.

yet it is not strong basis for, or even a worthwhile point in, a slamming critique of the HWGOAT. so i'm not sure what your argument is supposed to be, really.

So did many others. Joe Louis beat many greats? He doesn't get anywhere near the recognition Ali does. You really think he gets no sympathy?

Ali is the HWGOAT. many others can not make that claim. Louis is Ali's nearest rival historically, and he quite rightly gets sympathy himself for having been screwed over by his country.
by "recognition", do you mean that Ali's fame is greater than Louis' nowadays? that's just the way it goes sometimes. he made a huge impact on culture and is fresher in the consciousness of man than Louis. in a critical sense, Louis does not receive as much "recognition" as Ali because his resume is inferior. Ali fought a who's who of two eras, his is the greatest HW resume bar none, it's not even close.

sympathy in a general public sense does not transfer into critical appraisal among historians. sorry, buddy.

Watch the fight.

watch it yourself. Ali received no more than the customary minute between rounds.

Ali disagrees with you in his autobiography.

it's arguable, no matter what Ali's opinion is on his performance in fights II and III of the trilogy.

[S. Saddler 1310]

I stopped reading when you said "Dundee cut his gloves" That never happened and is a myth. I lost interest in anything you said after that.

Dundee may have worsened a tear in the glove, but the gloves were never changed and Ali did not receive more than the customary minute of recovery time between rounds.

[S. Saddler 1310]

come at me, Ali-disparaging vagabonds and bounders.

[DanboSmitty]

Everything can be discredited because boxing is not based on simple true and false or fact vs fiction. There are always going to be excuses and circumstances that take away from a victory and sadly it's something that permeates all of boxing taking away a lot of respect that fighters should be getting. At the end of the day it's 2 grown men in the ring and 1 comes out the winner, regardless of the circumstances.