Julio Cesar Chavez: GOAT

[RubenSonny]

Nice post crold. But, Robinson did not go 88-0 before his first loss. THAT is incredible. And, Dundee knew Robinson, trained Ali, and his opinion cannot be ignored. I'm going with Chavez. I think prime Chavez beats prime Robinson.

Ever heard of Miguel Ruiz?

[Sweet Pea 50]

So.

In a fight.

SRR. vs JCC. At 147.

I mean, they did both fight at WW.

Sounds about even.

[CubanGuyNYC]

I don't know if I'd agree on Ali. Greater as a figure but I think a STRONG case can be made Duran was a better fighter. I rate Duran higher all-time of the two.

As a figure, there's no question. Ali is an icon. I believe his greatness rightfully considers his almost singular standing in the sport...indeed in sport. As a fighter? You may or may not be right. It's a much more interesting point, however, since there's not nearly as much debate in the other department.

[ElBossHogg™]

Easy.

"Men Lie, Women Lie, Number Dont Lie"

Chavez holds records for most successful consecutive defenses of world titles (27), most title fights (37), most title-fight victories (31) and he is tied with Joe Louis for most title defenses won by knockout (21). Chávez also has the longest undefeated streak in boxing history, 13 years. His record was 89-0-1 going into his first loss to Frankie Randall and had an 87 fight win streak until his draw with Whitaker.


Again

"Men Lie, Women Lie, Number Dont Lie"

Damn you speak nothing but the truth. So Amazing.

[Wiley Hyena]

Prime Ray knocks Chavez's head off... I mean, the guy stopped much bigger guys with relatively tougher chins (at the very least considering the size)

I cannot agree. Difficult to find anybody with a "relatively tougher chin" than Chavez. At the same weight class, I go with Chavez.

Lets take the Meldrick Taylor for example. Here is a guy that was on his way to being the next Sugar Ray, maybe even more... When he fought Chavez, Taylor was unbeatable. After Chavez, Taylor never seriously competed again. It's difficult to relatively compare the athlete in Ray's time and in Chavez's time. What we do know, however, is that they are bigger, faster, and stronger, now.

Nope. I'm going with the numbers. 88-0. Chavez.

[CubanGuyNYC]

I like this post even tho I disagree with it. Duran was awesome. But the "Robinson, Ali, and Armstrong were all objectively greater" statement is a debatable opinion.

What I see is 88-0. Thats Julio Cesar Chavez.

Everything's "debatable", when you come down to it. You might think Jimmy Carter was a greater president than Teddy Roosevelt, and articulate your viewpoint wonderfully, but those that study U.S. politics will (very) largely disagree with you. The same goes with ATG boxers. Almost everyone will place those three men above Duran, let alone Chavez. I think a more realistic debate lies in how high JCC should be rated, say, outside the top-ten.

[Skittlez]

A ****** ****** thread filled with ****** ****** answers.

[crold1]

After Chavez, Taylor never seriously competed again.

Oft repeated, always overstated. He slipped, but he still had some quality wins left. Taylor came back to win wide against the very capable Aaron Davis two fights after Chavez and came off the floor twice to beat a solid Glenwood Brown before the Norris/Espana double beating.

And how are they bigger, faster, and stronger now below Heavyweight? You must just be goofing. Chavez was 5'7 and between 130 and 140 at peak. That's about the average for great fighters in those weights for about the last whenever the hell.

A Jr. Welterweight has to weigh in at 140 same for Chavez same as it was for Niccolino Locche a generation before and Danny Garcia now. Maybe if we make a case about day before weigh-ins, but that wasn't the problem in Chavez's prime it is now as the concept was still new and methods for draining were evolving, but it doesn't apply to everyone either.

[U_TALKING_2_ME?]

Chavez is not even the greatest Mexican Boxer of all time, that honor also goes to Duran, his father was Mexican

[CubanGuyNYC]

Nope. I'm going with the numbers. 88-0. Chavez.

You place that high a value on the numbers? I won't argue that they don't have a place, but do you believe they tell the whole story?