Objectively, which of Pac's catchweights were unfair?

[Frank Ducketts]

The Cotto fight. He didn't need a catchweight. I was happy Pac beat the living **** out of Margarito.

[~AK49~]

Pac said he's not going beyond 147 anymore. Cotto taunted him, said "He offered 150 to Marg, why not me? Does he fear me?". So Pac offers 150, Cotto remembers he's drained at 150. That's after requesting 150 for his previous title defense.

Pac already put an immense beating on cotto. Time for pac to say 'okay, you come in at 152-154, whatever youre comfortable at, and ill come in at whatever im comfortable at.'

Thats not unreasonable, especially considering 1), the beating pac has already placed on cotto and 2). [B]regardless if cotto weighs in at 147 or 154, he is still walking out to the ring in the 158-165 range.

[Pullcounter]

None of them.... Pac never put a gun to anyone's head and forced them to sign on the dotted line...

[Fasttimes]

@ the pac turds defending their hero and saying it didn't matter.

If they didn't matter Pac wouldn't have forced it

[Ray Corso]

Theres NOTHING wrong with the offers!! If they didn't want the contracts they didn't have to sign them. Theres way to much BS on a few pounds given or taken + (plus) pounds have always been a part of boxing. I don't like them for title bouts but if both agree its a done deal.
Cotto dropping a pound or two is meaningless!!! He got beat by a better fighter plain and simple! Ray.

[The Big Dunn]

The Cotto fight. He didn't need a catchweight. I was happy Pac beat the living **** out of Margarito.

exactly. if the two pounds didn't matter why did he insist on it.

[bojangles1987]

De La Hoya was not a lumping catchweight fight.

[Frank Ducketts]

exactly. if the two pounds didn't matter why did he insist on it.

A pound or two does matter in todays game. Ask Pacquiao fans why he came up with the 'take it or leave it' offers. They have no answer other than saying that those guys didn't have to take the fight. The took those fights on money and for the fans.

[Elotero]

De La Hoya - Pac jumped 2 weight classes for this fight. First time fighting at welter, coming off a lightweight fight. ODLH was the A side, he called the shots, so this was all on him. No issues with this one.

Cotto - Fighting for Cotto's welterweight title. Since Cotto weighed in the previous fight at 146, only 1 lb less at a 145 lb catchweight was supposedly fair. But if it's only 1 lb, why not just fight at the welterweight limit?

Margarito - Tony was a career welterweight. Plus, Pac didn't even come close to making the super welter limit. No issue with this one.

Marquez 3 - The catchweight was basically their real weights without having to cut weight and rehydrate. Pac is not a full fledged welter, more like a filled out junior welter who doesn't feel like cutting weight. He's the A side, so he can call the shots on the weight. No issue with this one.

So the only one I have issue with is the Cotto fight. Cotto had a history of trouble making weight for 147 as it is, plus Cotto was the champion. The others are no big deal for the reasons stated above.

Tony and Cotto. Oscar asked for it.

Let it be known these arent the only weight games he has played. Making fighters move up or down to face him. The Filipino Canelo.

Forcing Morales to fight at a lower weight. Imposing fines for not making weight.

Attempting to CW Cotto again this year.

The JMM CW at WW backfired on that ass. They thought Manny would have the edge.

Having Bradley come up to WW because he carried even less power.

Fighting Marquez AGAIN at an unnatural weight for Marquez.

Lining up Bam Bam Rios who just had his first fight at Jr WW for a fight at WW.

How many more weight conditions does it have to be for folks to realize its not just the catchweights?

[Brother Jay]

De La Hoya - Pac jumped 2 weight classes for this fight. First time fighting at welter, coming off a lightweight fight. ODLH was the A side, he called the shots, so this was all on him. No issues with this one.

Cotto - Fighting for Cotto's welterweight title. Since Cotto weighed in the previous fight at 146, only 1 lb less at a 145 lb catchweight was supposedly fair. But if it's only 1 lb, why not just fight at the welterweight limit?

Margarito - Tony was a career welterweight. Plus, Pac didn't even come close to making the super welter limit. No issue with this one.

Marquez 3 - The catchweight was basically their real weights without having to cut weight and rehydrate. Pac is not a full fledged welter, more like a filled out junior welter who doesn't feel like cutting weight. He's the A side, so he can call the shots on the weight. No issue with this one.

So the only one I have issue with is the Cotto fight. Cotto had a history of trouble making weight for 147 as it is, plus Cotto was the champion. The others are no big deal for the reasons stated above.

Objectively ... anytime a fighter has to use catchweights to manipulate his opponents at a weight that he's been making for years it becomes completely unfair.

When competing in ANY division, you're supposed to beat the men in that division, not find ways and excuses to weaken them to supposedly even the odds.

That's complete and utter bull****.

Its one thing to have a legitimate catchweight match. That's what Ward/Dawson was. There were no illusions about Ward matching and beating the LHW champion. No, instead we all understood from the beginning that Dawson was coming in as a SMW to challenge Ward. No one can really be mad at Ward because Ward isn't and is aware that he cannot claim to be the LHW champion because of the way his match against Dawson was structured.

There is no bogus pretense with the way Ward and Dawson went about making their match. No one implied that Ward did anything but defend his SMW crown.

There was no smoke or mirrors that attempted to make Ward seem like he was campaigning as a LHW.

That's EXACTLY what Pacquiao does.

He wants people to see him as a legitimate WW and jrMW challenger but plays weight games to validate his run in those divisions.

How could Pacquiao even begin to fix his mouth to say that he defeated DelaHoya more convincingly when he knows that he had Oscar come down to a weight that made him look like a zombie?

What's worse is that the comparison completely neglects to mention the different factors at play between the two bouts. However, that was no accident. To admit that Manny had DLH come in 145 would be to admit that the two performances could not be compared in any legitimate fashion. The same goes for Cotto and Margarito as well.

Those three fights were arguably the most important performances in Pacquiao's career.

And they're all tainted. There really is no argument. Not only were DLH, Cotto and Margarito weight manipulated, but they were also coming off career losses before Pacquiao would fight any of them.

Some people pretend that Manny was "tooooo small" and it warranted his opponents sweating down, but Pacquiao has been coming in on fight night at 144 since fighting Barrera. Why would Pacquiao then need to weaken his opponents?

And it still continues. Team Pacquiao tried to rematch Cotto until Cotto would have no part of any mannyweights again. Once Cotto made that clear he was no longer a viable opponent.

But some people are desperate for recognition and will take the bullshit over nothing at all.

I guess its no worse than some claiming that Bruce Lee was the greatest fighter in the world after having fought virtually no one unless it was choreographed and in the movies.

Its the same brand of idol worship.