Clip: The Famous "Phantom Punch" from Ali to Liston

[THE REAL NINJA]

That's exactly how I saw it.
If we compare the punch delivered from Ali that resulted in Liston falling and the punch delivered from Tyson that resulted in Etienne falling....which one looks more like a dive?

he damn near broke his leg when he got hit wtf

[jack_the_rippuh]

he damn near broke his leg when he got hit wtf

That's your answer?

[BLOODSHED]

It doesn't affect Tyson with me. It wasn't the champion Tyson that Etienne gave up against.

While what you say could be true, even though I believe the Etienne KO was genuine.

Those two fights are on completely different levels.
If Etienne did take a dive.
That result doesn't tarnish Tyson's legacy nearly as much as Liston taking a dive tarnishes Ali's legacy. Don't get me wrong. Ali still ended up doing extremely well in his careers as a boxer, but when someone names his big wins and then brings up Liston II, there's always room for argument that his win in that fight was a result of Liston taking a dive.

[THE REAL NINJA]

[jack_the_rippuh]

It doesn't affect Tyson with me. It wasn't the champion Tyson that Etienne gave up against.

Exactly.
Those two fights are no where near each other in terms of importance during the times they took place.

[THE REAL NINJA]

[oldgringo]

Yeah that was a big shot.

[Yogi]

That result doesn't tarnish Tyson's legacy nearly as much as Liston taking a dive tarnishes Ali's legacy. Don't get me wrong. Ali still ended up doing extremely well in his careers as a boxer, but when someone names his big wins and then brings up Liston II, there's always room for argument that his win in that fight was a result of Liston taking a dive.

I don't see how that second Liston fight tarnishes Ali's legacy, because I don't really see anybody giving much credit to Ali for the outcome of the rematch. The first fight, sure, Ali gets his share of credit and deservedly so. But the second fight...****, if anything, that fight (and the first one to a lesser extent) severely hurts Liston's legacy because there was once a time during his championship reign when boxing writers/fans were arguing over who was the greatest Heavyweight of all-times...Joe Louis or Sonny Liston?

[EXIGE]

Both are legit.

Bloodshed, he took his mouthpiece out and then remained on the floor because he knew that if he got up, his legs would fail him and that there is a high chance of him receiving long term damage.

With the phantom punch, im going by the recent evidence that proves that the punch connected, and therefore could have resulted in a KD quite easily.... Flash KD, but legit nevertheless.

[cobracore]

Personally, i think it was a mixture of Ali's power being underrated, the specific spot he hit (the soft bit above your cheeks, the temple), and also Liston being off balance.

Look carefully. Liston sorta jumps forward with his punch, and Ali counters it, but notice that, as Ali hits him, Liston's front leg is actually off the ground, ever so slightly. Try standing with one leg off the ground, and let someone push you sideways on the temple - if he pushes you hard enough, you'll fall. It's a matter of balance.

Liston may have took a dive in that he didn't wanna get up - but personally, i don't think the punch was 'phantom'.