The all new, Mayweather/Pac Master Discussion Thread - The fight that will never be.

[Brother Jay]

Care to explain? To get you up to speed, Wess, is saying Floyd's resume is so much better than Manny's at WW that he calls Manny an exposed fighter.

I proved to him that it was not the case ..... especially considering that Floyd had a 3 year start on Manny ... if Manny fought 3 more years, Manny would have killed Floyd's resume at WW.

Again, explain and then one can take your post serious ... until then you are just considered a Manny hater or FLoyd fanny!

I'll explain.

Mayweather's wins at WW came over men who were ranked 1, 2 or 3.

Manny Pacquiao's wins came over men who were ranked 5th .. with Cotto being the only one who was ranked 4th.

Its really just that simple.

Floyd fought champions who were coming off career wins with the exception of Judah.

All of Pacquiao's competition at WW were either beaten badly in their previous fight before Manny, or they had a tune up against a bum in between.

For you to try to justify Manny's resume being comparable to Floyd's at WW is laughable.

Usually you are one of the few that competently discusses Pacquiao's career and decisions. However apparently Pacquiao hasn't left you alot of room or evidence from which to defend him, and now even you are reduced to having to supplement fiction for facts.

Manny's entire career above 135lbs is a joke.

Like it or not, without the DLH, Cotto and Margarito wins, Pacquiao would have to rely on his win over Clottey and Mosley .. both of which the boxing world have labeled as bullshit cherry picking.

Know your boxing.

Manny has 40 straight fights against bums. Its shameful padding. Not only that, but 2 of those bums managed to knock Pacquiao out.

That means he has only 19 other fights in which to judge him. Of those 19 fights, Manny specifically targeted 6 of his opponents coming off career losses. The trend is undeniable. They are DLH, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito and Mosley. Two of which were catchweights AND one of which was a vacant title against a then banned cheater.

19-6=13. 13 fights in which to judge Pacquiao.

They are:

1-Barrera
2-Marquez - DRAW
3-Battery
4-Morales - LOSS
5-Velazquez
6-Morales
7-Larios
8-Morales
9-Solis
10-Barrera
11-Marquez
12-Diaz
13-Marquez

Now, outside of those 13 fights, I challenge you to show me a legitimate match not including any catchweights that would serve to enhance the value of Manny Pacquiao's legacy. The 6 that I mentioned were all coming off of career losses and therefore were ranked out of the top three .. the ranked spots that have all to do with legacy.

Like it or not, RANK AND CONDITION OF A FIGHTER'S OPPONENTS ARE ALL THAT MATTERS AS IT PERTAINS TO WEIGHING A LEGACY VALUE.

If anything else were relevant, then opinions would hold weight in a conversation about the merits of legacy. They don't.

I said that to say that Manny Pacquiao's star power comes from three specific matches: DLH, Cotto and Margarito.

Take those three wins away and Manny's biggest wins come over Barrera, Morales and Marquez(2 which are VERY debatable, the last was a robbery).

Now go ahead and make a case for Pacquiao being a superstar without those three wins when you take a good and honest look at the 13 fights he has since first fighting Barrera.

For sure Manny puts on great performances. That's undeniable as well. However great performances do not equal a great legacy when the opposition doesn't warrant the value given to enhance one's legacy.

Your arguments are weak. Your so-called facts are really just strongly expressed opinions. Manny Pacquiao had a chance to be great but instead he let Arum protext him from any real greatness.

Just ask Manny and he'll tell you:

"You have to ask my promoter"

[ADP02]

Anyone else care to take the challenge? As ADP02 has failed miserably on multiple attempts. I beleive it is due to comprehension problems. The poor kid can't stop talking about Mayweather when questions about Pac arise.

Like I said, just changing the subject or making wise comments because you just realized that when you look at Floyd vs Manny's resume at WW you can't objectively prove that Manny's resume is exposed while simultaneously say that Floyd's resume is great at WW ... especially given that Floyd had a 3 year start.

So I have the comprehension problems? I went along with your sharade but you can't even stick to the discussion that YOU PICKED!!!

Here is what you said "Let me remind you of the topic. We are discussing Pac at WW and how his record doesn't compare to that of Floyd's WW record. "


Funny how you like to own yourself .....

[ADP02]

I'll explain.

Mayweather's wins at WW came over men who were ranked 1, 2 or 3.

Manny Pacquiao's wins came over men who were ranked 5th .. with Cotto being the only one who was ranked 4th.

Its really just that simple.

Floyd fought champions who were coming off career wins with the exception of Judah.

All of Pacquiao's competition at WW were either beaten badly in their previous fight before Manny, or they had a tune up against a bum in between.

For you to try to justify Manny's resume being comparable to Floyd's at WW is laughable.

Usually you are one of the few that competently discusses Pacquiao's career and decisions. However apparently Pacquiao hasn't left you alot of room or evidence from which to defend him, and now even you are reduced to having to supplement fiction for facts.

Manny's entire career above 135lbs is a joke.



Your arguments are weak. Your so-called facts are really just strongly expressed opinions. Manny Pacquiao had a chance to be great but instead he let Arum protext him from any real greatness.

Just ask Manny and he'll tell you:

"You have to ask my promoter"

Brother Jay, at least you tried .... Wess can't because he realized the truth ....

Jay, I already discussed this early on ....... Floyd can get just so much credit NOT MORE for fighting some of those who are on his resume ..... but I would say the same with some of those that Manny fought too.

Those are numbers game that you bring up but that doesn't always state the truth about the fighter on hand. Here is an explanation to what I mean:

Baldomir: You can say Baldomir was the champ until you face turns blue but Baldomir is not better than a C fighter. Starting to get my point?

No?

Marquez: ..... but but Marquez was ranked #2 P4P .... YES but he was 2 fights removed from fighting at 130lbs plus those 2 fights were at 135 not WW!!!! but that is how Floyd likes them !!! Starting to get my point?

No?

Ortiz: ..... but he was the champ ..... YES but Floyd SUCKER PUNCHED his way to beat this naive fighter for one. Secondly, Ortiz went life and death against his only fighter at WW ..... that is all he had to show for at WW before Floyd .... 1 freaking fight!!! What is Ortiz's record today? 1-2 at WW .... Floyd fought an Ortiz that needed more time at WW as the naive fighter was NOT READY to take on Floyd yet ..... but that is how Floyd likes them !!! Starting to get my point?

No?

Hatton: ..... but he was the champ ..... YES but Hatton too had only 1 recent fight at WW and looked average. Notice that Hatton then went back down to fight at JWW for several fights? Only reason he came back up is because Floyd wanted another JWW to fight...... but that is how Floyd likes them !!!Starting to get my point?

No?

Khan: .... but he was the champ at 140 ...... YES ..... Khan was supposed to be FLoyd's next fight. Until Khan was KOed, many Floyd fans were defending this too! If it would become official I bet you even those that were on the fence or not liking this would be defending Floyd's pick like as if their life depended on it ..... No? Just like when Floyd was rumored to ask for $100 million or All PPV money .... at first some were against it but now they are on-board with Floyd's crappy offer. Anyhow that is how Floyd likes them !!!


I can go on but I would hope that by now, YOU GOT MY POINT!!!

.

[WESS]

Like I said, just changing the subject or making wise comments because you just realized that when you look at Floyd vs Manny's resume at WW you can't objectively prove that Manny's resume is exposed while simultaneously say that Floyd's resume is great at WW ... especially given that Floyd had a 3 year start.

So I have the comprehension problems? I went along with your sharade but you can't even stick to the discussion that YOU PICKED!!!

Here is what you said "Let me remind you of the topic. We are discussing Pac at WW and how his record doesn't compare to that of Floyd's WW record. "


Funny how you like to own yourself .....

Again, you fail...

You avoided the questions once again (that have nothing to do with Mayweather). Why can't you just answer the question son? Is it really that hard son? Come on now..... the answers have a number and a name.

[WESS]

I'll explain.

Mayweather's wins at WW came over men who were ranked 1, 2 or 3.

Manny Pacquiao's wins came over men who were ranked 5th .. with Cotto being the only one who was ranked 4th.

Its really just that simple.

Floyd fought champions who were coming off career wins with the exception of Judah.

All of Pacquiao's competition at WW were either beaten badly in their previous fight before Manny, or they had a tune up against a bum in between.

For you to try to justify Manny's resume being comparable to Floyd's at WW is laughable.

Usually you are one of the few that competently discusses Pacquiao's career and decisions. However apparently Pacquiao hasn't left you alot of room or evidence from which to defend him, and now even you are reduced to having to supplement fiction for facts.

Manny's entire career above 135lbs is a joke.



Your arguments are weak. Your so-called facts are really just strongly expressed opinions. Manny Pacquiao had a chance to be great but instead he let Arum protext him from any real greatness.

Just ask Manny and he'll tell you:

"You have to ask my promoter"

He will ignore EVERYTHING you posted pertaining to Pac and bring up Floyd to justify Pac's record that is in question. He has a VERY tough time with comprehension. I have made it very clear for the poor kid but he just can't seem to understand the questions.

[maguirre]

It's always the same theme these Maynever fanboys keep repeating. Pac is overrated, blah, blah... They still don't realize that it just makes Floyd look worse. Why is Floyd so scared of an overrated boxer then? Everyone fought Pac 'cept Floydie. Explain that to me.

[ADP02]

Again, you fail...

You avoided the questions once again (that have nothing to do with Mayweather). Why can't you just answer the question son? Is it really that hard son? Come on now..... the answers have a number and a name.

Like I said, just changing the subject or making wise comments because you just realized that when you look at Floyd vs Manny's resume at WW you can't objectively prove that Manny's resume is exposed while simultaneously say that Floyd's resume is great at WW ... especially given that Floyd had a 3 year start.

So I have the comprehension problems? I went along with your sharade but you can't even stick to the discussion that YOU PICKED!!!

Here is what you said "Let me remind you of the topic. We are discussing Pac at WW and how his record doesn't compare to that of Floyd's WW record. "


Funny how you like to own yourself .....




But I will actually answer your question just to show how Floyd has you wrapped around his finger in thinking the way you do! ..... next post!

[WESS]

Like I said, just changing the subject or making wise comments because you just realized that when you look at Floyd vs Manny's resume at WW you can't objectively prove that Manny's resume is exposed while simultaneously say that Floyd's resume is great at WW ... especially given that Floyd had a 3 year start.

So I have the comprehension problems? I went along with your sharade but you can't even stick to the discussion that YOU PICKED!!!

Here is what you said "Let me remind you of the topic. We are discussing Pac at WW and how his record doesn't compare to that of Floyd's WW record. "


Funny how you like to own yourself .....




But I will actually answer your question just to show how Floyd has you wrapped around his finger in thinking the way you do! ..... next post!

Show me where in the questions that you keep avoiding does it say anything about Floyd?

You fail again.

[WESS]

It's always the same theme these Maynever fanboys keep repeating. Pac is overrated, blah, blah... They still don't realize that it just makes Floyd look worse. Why is Floyd so scared of an overrated boxer then? Everyone fought Pac 'cept Floydie. Explain that to me.

Another little side line cheerleader that never brings anything boxing related to the table...

next............

[WESS]

When was the last time Manny went into a division and beat the top 2 guys or 2 of the top 3 guys in a division?


Who was the last WW that Pac fought and beat who looked good in their previous fight or just simply came off a win?

Anyone????????