Sugar Ray Robinson #1 for eternity?

[sicko]

YES...WHY because the ERA's in boxing are getting weaker and weaker and the fighters are become less SKILLED, people are looking to EXCITE, not many are very skilled or technically sound, many of the All Time Greats were very SKILLED BOXER...not just BRAWLERS

so it is going to become harder and harder for a fighter to reach that legendary status...especially when fighters are not fighting each other and they hide behind their Promoters and they pick and choose fighters to fight and they prefer to fight against styles they can look good against

so no, I don't see anybody ever coming close to Ray Robinson level nor Ali nor Henry Armstrong, that is usually The Top 3 on most All Time Great Rankings some just have them in different orders

it is going to take a fighter with balls and skills and is willing to fight anybody, anywhere at anytime in just about any weight class

[kendom]

He is absolutely right. Lots of fans and boxing experts don't think he was the greatest of all time. He had flaws. He lost 19 fights.
Most while he was shot or past his prime. The only fighter to ever beat him in his prime was top 10 ATG middleweight Jake Lamotta while he was a welterweight.

He had draws and split decisions even when he was young and in his prime.

Happens when you're fighting multiple times a month.

Some of those close fights the crowd thought he lost.
Except the boxing experts of the time.

The old timers kept saying he was the best so anyone who did not think he was the greatest just kept quiet.
NO only when it comes it comes to people like Jack Demspey can you say these things.
Joe Ghnouly
Pete Lello
Maxie Shapiro
Maxie Berger
Norman Rubio x2
Tony Motisi
Reuben Shank
Izzy Jannazzo x4
Ralph Zannelli
Sheik Rangel
Tommy Bell x2
George Costner x2
Jose Basora x2
Jimmy McDaniels
Cecil Hudson x2
Georgie Abrams
Jimmy Doyle
Bernard Docusen
Vic Dellicurti
Steve Belloise
Aaron Wade
Ray Barnes
Robert Villemain x2
Charley Fusari
Bobby Dykes
Holly Mims
Artie Levine
Cyrille Delanoit
Rocky Castellani
Denny Moyer
Hans Stretz
Ralph Dupas

Sammy Angott x3
Fritzie Zivic x2
Jake LaMotta x5
Henry Armstrong
Kid Gavilan x2
Carl Olson x4
Randolph Turpin
Rocky Graziano
Gene Fullmer
Carmen Basilio

Note: all fighters listed were rated in the RING's top ten at one point or another. Fighters in large are Hall of Famers.

THIS is the reason why people say he's the greatest off all time, along with his style of course.

I have seen others I thought were better. I am not saying he was not great. I just don't think he was the greatest. Could he beat a prime Hagler or Monzon or Hopkins? I don't think so.Floyd Mayweather thinks he is better. Mayby he is.

Floyd Mayweather is definetly NOT greater than Ray Robinson.

[Brother Jay]

Because the change in boxing landscape since Ray's time. We can all conclude that it is impossible for current fighters to accumulate 107 Victories with 108 KO's

he faced so many champions because he fought many times in a year unlike today where a Champion usually fight 3 to 4 times a year.


--

So is it possible for a fighter today to accomplish something that could possible be greater than Robinson's achievements?

Ahem .. Julio Cesar Chavez .. *cough*

[boliodogs]

If I can see films I go by my own eyes how good I think the fighter was.I don't care who he beat or how many fights he had. If I can see good films of a fighter in his prime I use this to compare him with other fighters I have seen. If I have not seen them fight then I just say I don't know how good they were. I don't go by the opinion of others.Sometimes if there are no films I can get an idea how good he was seeing films of guys he fought but that is not as good as seeing films of the fighter himself. Will there be a modern era fighter with 200 pro fights? Of course not. But does having a huge number of fights automatically make you better? Robinson was welterweight champ for 3 years and 8 months and defended that tittle 5 times. During those 3 years and 8 months he also had 32 non tittle 10 round fights. Some of those 32 guys were not very good. He did not put his tittle on the line nearly as often per year as Hagler or Duran did.

[MRBOOMER]

If another depression comes up it'll happen again...
Fighters will really be fighting for food haha not fighting for cars and homes

[edgarg]

not to be rude

but how can someone win 107 fights and KTFO 108 opponents

If he has 215 fights with no losses or draws

[hugh grant]

Many people think SRR is the greatest for good reason. Some say Pac is the GOAT. The reply to that is commonly "i dont think so".

Then when asked, so what would Pac have to do? The silly reply is usually sometehing like, first hed have to beat floyd 147 , Sergio at 154 and then maybe beat Ward, or something ridiculous like that. Other replys will be along the lines of there justs isnt the fighters or competition around for Pac to beat to put him along SRR? So no matter what Pac does hes in a no win situation.
If Pac said, "ok, i will fight Sergio at 154, no CW, will that then make me the GOAT"? The reply will be no probably. So theres no point in Pac continuing his career then. This goes back to what i was saying, little 10 years with ambitions of being the GOAT, being told no you cant be the goat no matter what you do, you might as well take up american football. Thats a potential superstar lost to another sport. It is maybe irresponsible to say SRR cant be surpassed.

SRR could have fought these type challenges and he probably would have lost, like he did do in the higher weights.

[boliodogs]

Kendom, PFP is a matter of opinion not a matter of long lists. Your are welcome to your opinion of Robinson but you can't force your opinion on me. I know Robinson's record very well. I have it in front of me now and I have studied it many times. I know who he fought, what the age, record and weight of both Robinson and his opponent was, and how the fight was scored. I am a 53 year veteran of watching boxing so I make up my own mind on who I think is best. I don't give a damn what others think unless I have never seen the fighter in action. I have seen plenty of films of Robinson and even saw him fight live in an exibition fight. I have also seen plenty of the guys I rate over him. You left out the fact that Robinson lost to Basilio, a welterweight who he out weighed by 7 pounds. He lost to Turpin in his prime. He beat Fullmer once and lost to Fullmer twice. He lost to LaMotta and he lost to Ralgh Jones by a large margin when he was 33 years old and never gave Jones a tittle shot. He beat Armstrong when he was 23 and Armstrong was 33 and wased up after 160 pro fights. He also outweighed Armstrong by 6 pounds. So much for your list. As for Floyd not being better, Floyd said he was better than Robinson. I just said maybe he is. You can't say for sure he isn't better because they never fought and have no common opponents so it's just your opinion, not fact. I do know Floyd is 35 and has not lost yet and has had only two fights that were even close. By the time Robinson was 35 he had lost lots of fights The draws and split decisions he had in his prime were not a result of him fighting several times in one month but nice try with your excuses. If he was so superior why would the crowd think he lost? Some of the experts agreed with the crowd. So you keep Robinson as your pfp greatest of all time and I will keep my picks.

[therealpugilist]

Henry Armstrong is the greatest fighter pound for pound in my book. Sugar Ray Robinson fits this all around prototype of what an p4p fighter is supposed to have like speed chin, heart, boxing skills, etc.....but Henry Armstrong proved he was the greatest fighter p4p of all time...his style was a buzzsaw but he had a great chin and very underrated defensive skills, slipping dipping and rolling alot of shots.


Only fighter to win the featherweight, lightweight, and welterweight titles lineally and drew for a forth title.

Holds the record for most title defenses at welterweight with 20

from 1937-1940 went 59-1-1(51 kayos) while winning those titles
Wins over Barney Ross, Midget Wolgast, Baby Arizmendi, Lou Ambers, Lew Jenkins, Mike Belliose, Frankie Kilick, Benny Bass, Chalky Wright,Willie Joyce , Tippy Larkin, Sammy Angott, Cefernio Garcia(who he drew with and defended his title against at 147),

[Canelo Phresh]

Many people think SRR is the greatest for good reason. Some say Pac is the GOAT. The reply to that is commonly "i dont think so".

Then when asked, so what would Pac have to do? The silly reply is usually sometehing like, first hed have to beat floyd 147 , Sergio at 154 and then maybe beat Ward, or something ridiculous like that. Other replys will be along the lines of there justs isnt the fighters or competition around for Pac to beat to put him along SRR? So no matter what Pac does hes in a no win situation.
If Pac said, "ok, i will fight Sergio at 154, no CW, will that then make me the GOAT"? The reply will be no probably. So theres no point in Pac continuing his career then. This goes back to what i was saying, little 10 years with ambitions of being the GOAT, being told no you cant be the goat no matter what you do, you might as well take up american football. Thats a potential superstar lost to another sport. It is maybe irresponsible to say SRR cant be surpassed.

SRR could have fought these type challenges and he probably would have lost, like he did do in the higher weights.

if pac beat floyd and sergio without any manny weights he might have a legit shot at goat.