“Fighting Words” – Jermain Taylor: Undisputed, Undeserving

[STEELHEAD]

Like I said, Taylor would never look impressive vs Hopkins. No one would. You cannot make the man fight. It's difficult. Taylor beat him the best way he could. The wins are legit and it's in the books. Taylor will look impressive in future fights. He has looked impressive vs anyone not named Hopkins.

No one made a name for themself any better than Taylor with their performances leading up to the Hopkins fight, so no one deserved a shot anymore than he. Additionally, from watching the top 160 lbs guys like Ikeke, Abrahman, Sturm, and so forth...well, Taylor would deafeat them all to be blunt.

totally agree.

this article indirectly puts down hopkins skills too.

jez,and he makes it like eastman was a live contender against hopkins.

i can see how he could slant everything like that. just like i slant things in taylors favor. neither side is off that much.

[vB Martin]

This article is pure, venomous crap. Did someone lose money on the fight?

Also, if you're going to claim to be a writer, at least get your facts straight:

In need of a clear, decisive win to cement his identity, Taylor’s rematch with Hopkins was twelve rounds more of the same – the same tentative performance, the same mechanical and mental flaws, the same unanimous decision going his way...

and:

[QUOTE]...while a majority of informed observers filled their cards out in favor of the forty-year-old[/QUOTE]Who are these "informed observers"?

[RastaSmoker]

This article is pure, venomous crap. Did someone lose money on the fight?

Also, if you're going to claim to be a writer, at least get your facts straight:

and:

=BIGPOPPAPUNK]while a majority of informed observers filled their cards out in favor of the forty-year-old

Who are these "informed observers"?

i agree completely

[BLOODSHED]

Unimpressive, sort of.
Underwhelming, definately. Hopkins beat himself. He just didn't seem active enough and didn't throw too many punches in a row. This worked against BHop as it made him look like the less active fighter even tho he landed more jabs and power shots than Taylor and at a higher connect rate.

Jermain Taylor, having defeated longtime great Bernard Hopkins on two consecutive occasions, is the undisputed middleweight champion.

He is also unimpressive, underwhelming and undeserving.

[oldgringo]

A column is meant to incite debate, so your opinions are just as valid, although I will attempt to answer questions of bias.

I like Taylor's personality plenty, but I cannot be impressd by either fighter, not Taylor, nor Hopkins, after the 24 rounds that they performed. It's easy to make charges of bias when someone has an opinion that you don't agree with, but that is a convenient excuse that avoids the true idea of a column, which is debate, debate, debate.

So, I am unimpressed with Taylor, and feel that his rise to champion is motivated by two controversial decisions (which it is, according to more than 90% of press in the first fight, pretty much everyone but HBO and the state of Arkansas, and a very large split for the sequel), as well as adept promoting that got Taylor the shot, and not other middleweights that I'm attempting to imply may be much, much better than the version of Taylor that we're seeing.

So, since, like I said, columns are meant to incite debate, I will attempt to respond to your opinions respectfully, since, mainly, I'm just cool like that. =)



Well, if Hopkins suddenly grew old over night and look washed up, what does it say about Taylor that he wasn't able to take the fight to Hopkins and truly take the title? Taylor doesn't look good against fighters who force him to go forwards, hasn't done so since stepping up competition against Marquez... he is much, much better as a counterpuncher, and he is an adept counterpuncher, at that. That is why Pat Burns was telling Jermain to use angles, to be out of the immediate range of Bernard's shots and able to hit Hopkins, but it was a strategy that he had difficulty following up on, as Hopkins is a difficult puzzle to solve.



It matters when pointing out that there are other middleweights who may be more deserving, considering that Taylor faced none of them in his path to facing Hopkins. He was moved along with adept promoting, made the heir apparent in the hope that his considerable athletic ability would show through, and that they could make successful pay-per-view shows worth tons and tons of money. Hence why you didn't see Hopkins vs. Felix Sturm (who absolutely won that fight against De La Hoya) or any of the other lesser names at 160 whose mechanics and in-ring ability seem to have much more potential than this version of Taylor.

Mind you, Taylor could finally get that fight against a decent opponent, aside from Hopkins, where he shows the value that plenty have been expecting, including myself, but the point of this article is that, while watching the two fights, I'm thinking, "These are our champions?"



I guess you wouldn't have liked my past columns excoriating Andrew Golota. It's an opinion, my friend, an opinion, and a developed one, at that. Nor do I know what I'd be jealous of... if you read a variety of press reports of the past two fights, we are not impressed with Taylor, and we're waiting to see what he's been purported to be. I've been following Taylor for years, and even though I've written a negative article about him, one which a family member said I was too harsh (but it was still my opinion), I still think Taylor has much more of a future than Golota, at the moment.



If you can show where I used anything that would compromise my integrity, aside from having an opinion, which is allowed in a column and not a straight-news report (and even straight reporting in boxing is subjective, based on how you score rounds), then please dictate how so, and I will read it respectfully.



Well, if it's Taylor's time, he's surely not showing much reason for people to be excited, and even the Arkansan has been down about his performance for two straight fights, for good reason.

It was a harsh article, yes, I can agree with that, but it is founded on an opinion of a writer who has good reason to be unimpressed with someone who is supposed to be the future, but has eked out two controversial decisions, not taking it to the old man like Hatton did to Tszyu, or like so many other fighters have in crossroad matches.

You don't have to like the article, or at least the opinion within, but that's the point, and that means I'm doing my job. And when Taylor shows that it is his time, finally, I'll be on the computer, typing exactly that.

Heck, if you've read my column on a consistent basis, I wrote a column before the first fight stating that Taylor had nothing to lose, win or loss against Hopkins. And it's still true, because his career has not been ruined by two close, close fights against a future Hall-of-Famer, something that has happened to plenty of other challengers who never showed their faces with as much posterity again. But at the same point, it is difficult to coronate him until he shows that he is head and shoulders above the competition that was passed over in favor of these successful promotions, an occurrence that Taylor may still get to.



Pretty much what I've been saying, except for the part about emotion. Emotion indicates bias, something I do not have against Taylor. While I did not score either fight for Taylor, mounting bias charges would insinuate that I do not like Taylor, nor do I want to see him succeed. I like Taylor, an opinion that is allowed, but I do not root for any fighter over another. The closest I can come to wanting to see someone succeed is wanting to see Carlos Maussa on television more, because he makes me laugh.

I appreciate everyone's feedback, and one poster aside, I appreciate the lack of flaming, and hope that the debate remains respectful but becomes more developed.

Thanks!
---David

Very nice post, good to see someone who doesn't have to shout back at people when they insult him.

I agree with much of what you said.

[BK Saddizzle]

Give respect where it's due Scott Steiner. I'm a long time Hopkins fan(favorite fight was Hopkins vs Echols 2)but B-Hop knew what he HAD to do this fight & just didn't do it effectively enough. He had to know that Taylor was watchin' the tapes too & not only picked out what he needed to do against Hopkins but what he needed to do himself. The kid lack stamina the first time & his left jab was almost invisible. U'll see in the 2nd fight the kid was throwin' bombs in the final few rounds & he stopped Hopkins' lead power hooks 'ere time with his re-established jab. Big up Hopkins('ere time)but RESPECT the Kid!!! Who does the kid fight now(Hopkins-Taylor 3 don't make sense right now) I think Winky is the next to step up. Now can ya'll Dig Dat!!!

[BLOODSHED]

Ideally, he'd win in obvious fashion. But look who he took them away from? A legend who is still GOOD.

A writer who bets on a fight that he's covering would be biased, a compromise of ethics.

I say Taylor is underwhelming because I can count the rounds he won in both fights combined on two hands, because he didn't take the belts, but rather usurped them via controversial decisions.

Taylor will show that he is plenty deserving when he successfully defends against other top notch middleweights. He deserves a fight off, which he will likely take, after facing the top middleweight twice in a row, but afterwards, he must face a Winky Wright or Felix Sturm or Kingsley Ikeke or other top five middleweight.

I just couldn't write something positive about Taylor, considering I thought he lost both fights, looking tentative, underwhelming and with flaws that other, prime middleweights would exploit.

We shall see where Taylor goes from here.

Oh, and the last name's not pronounced that way.

You have a decent point about Hopkins being defensive minded, and it was infuriating to watch Hopkins only throw one punch at a time, but Taylor was similarly defensive minded, never opening up and letting go, really, just waiting, waiting, waiting. It shows intelligence in Taylor, that he still found Hopkins to be dangerous with his counters, but it is not how one takes it to the champion and distances himself from the pack.

[Pac Man Fan 83]

There is simply no way you can say Taylor is undeserving. None. He beat the guy who had been the king of the division for as long as anyone ever has, the same guy who was the #1 pound for pound guy in the sport until Taylor beat him. Twice.

You can say Taylor's wins weren't pretty. You can say you thought the fights were close. But to say he is undeserving reeks of ignorance and sour g****s.

[oldgringo]

Ideally, he'd win in obvious fashion. But look who he took them away from? A legend who is still GOOD.

Also true. Taylor deserves respect, because when it's all said and done he had Taylor SD12 Hopkins and Taylor UD12 Hopkins in the books.

I liked when someone pointed out the way that Hatton took the fight to Tszyu and never let up until he willed a win over Tszyu. It was much more of a gutsy performance than Taylors, but then again Hopkins and Tszyu are two different fighters.

Taylor beat Hopkins twice, who even at this age of 40 is a dangerous bastard, but it's hard for people to stomach the fact that Hopkins of 2/3 years ago would have stopped Taylor...and this form of Hopkins still *arguably* won both fights in about half of the fans/writers/experts/analysts eyes.

[BLOODSHED]

Also, I think its unrealistic of the writer of that peice to complain about the fashion that Taylor beat Hopkins. I was telling Bomber, that this match would be a chess match mainly because Hopkins is that kind of fighter. He does not have that killer instinct like a Lacy.

Taylor wasn't going to knock Hopkins out and I knew this. And Hopkins wasn't going to knock Lacy out. It's just not Hopkins style.

So, for the writer to be surprised that the two bouts went 24 rounds, is truly beyond my comprehension.

Also true. Taylor deserves respect, because when it's all said and done he had Taylor SD12 Hopkins and Taylor UD12 Hopkins in the books.

I liked when someone pointed out the way that Hatton took the fight to Tszyu and never let up until he willed a win over Tszyu. It was much more of a gutsy performance than Taylors, but then again Hopkins and Tszyu are two different fighters.

Taylor beat Hopkins twice, who even at this age of 40 is a dangerous bastard, but it's hard for people to stomach the fact that Hopkins of 2/3 years ago would have stopped Taylor...and this form of Hopkins still *arguably* won both fights in about half of the fans/writers/experts/analysts eyes.