Bradley and Cotto as opponents

[DLT]

Floyd isn't gonna come in as a fully bulked up JMW
Cotto don't look like a real JMW himself as it is
the weight has no bearing on it
Bradley comes in heavier at JWW than Pac does at WW
Pac is sliding too, he'll win but not easily
and the Castillo thing is a bad example; he was done at 140 anyway

he wasnt done at 140. Im not talking about the old washed up JLC. Im talking about his prime. He had a couple of fights there in his prime and didnt look the same.

In boxing every pound counts. Cotto might not be a full 154 pounder but he maybe alot better at 152 or even 150 then he is at 147. Those 3 pounds can make a big difference. Cotto was huge when he was at 140. He was always a WW just fighting at a smaller weight. It was obvious he still would rather fight Pac if all things were even and was willing to come to 150, yet he threw the fight away just 3 pounds lower. That tells you its a real problem for him.

So what that Bradley comes in bigger. Rios comes in bigger at LW than Floyd at WW but that doesnt make him better or stronger at the weight than Floyd. Bradley does not look good above 140 and both Floyd & Pac are bad matchups for him anyways

[DLT]

that killer instinct retired the moment he made congress

I disagree but even if that were true, that doesnt mean that Pac has regressed any. He's just boxing more which will be more than enough against the Cotto's Margarito's, Clottey's, and Mosley's of the world. Its just never going to look as good against master boxers like JMM or Floyd.

I disagree anyways though. Again, that guy was pretty much there against Mosley. He dropped him and tried to chase him all night. He didnt do it much against JMM because he had hell in the first 2 fights so they wanted to try something a lil different or just flat out couldnt anyways because JMM is that good.

Trust me, Bradley will be there to be got and Pac has taken more criticism then at any recent point of his career so he will be hungry and wanted to prove something. Bradley's getting done in

[Jack Napier]

he wasnt done at 140. Im not talking about the old washed up JLC. Im talking about his prime. He had a couple of fights there in his prime and didnt look the same.

In boxing every pound counts. Cotto might not be a full 154 pounder but he maybe alot better at 152 or even 150 then he is at 147. Those 3 pounds can make a big difference. Cotto was huge when he was at 140. He was always a WW just fighting at a smaller weight. It was obvious he still would rather fight Pac if all things were even and was willing to come to 150, yet he threw the fight away just 3 pounds lower. That tells you its a real problem for him.

So what that Bradley comes in bigger. Rios comes in bigger at LW than Floyd at WW but that doesnt make him better or stronger at the weight than Floyd. Bradley does not look good above 140 and both Floyd & Pac are bad matchups for him anyways

Castillo wasn't up for those other fights when he was all over the scale
he wasn't fighting big fights so he looked bad, that's understandable
weight wasn't the issue, motivation was
and Cotto just didn't wanna get jerked around by Pac again
that wasn't about the weight itself, but Pac dictating to him
Pac isn't really a WW, he's just a JWW
Bradley looked just fine in a WW tryout vs Abregu
weight isn't a factor in these 2 fights dude

[DLT]

Castillo wasn't up for those other fights when he was all over the scale
he wasn't fighting big fights so he looked bad, that's understandable
weight wasn't the issue, motivation was
and Cotto just didn't wanna get jerked around by Pac again
that wasn't about the weight itself, but Pac dictating to him
Pac isn't really a WW, he's just a JWW
Bradley looked just fine in a WW tryout vs Abregu
weight isn't a factor in these 2 fights dude

again, I think Floyd & Pac win either way but Cotto has a better shot at 154 and Bradley has a better shot at 140. There are alot of people who would pick Ortiz to beat Cotto right now at WW and lose to him at 154, even though he comes into the ring bigger than Cotto. There are people who think Bradley beats Ortiz at 140 and loses to him at WW.

You are not going to convince me that Cotto is the same fighter at WW right now than he is at 150-154. I just dont believe he is. You are also not going to convince me that Bradley is the same fighter at WW then he is at 140. He's not. You can say that Pac is small all you want but Pac has carried everything to WW and beaten huge guys with ease. He's more comfortable at that weight. Even Roach & Ariza think the same

[tredh]

Castillo wasn't up for those other fights when he was all over the scale
he wasn't fighting big fights so he looked bad, that's understandable
weight wasn't the issue, motivation was
and Cotto just didn't wanna get jerked around by Pac again
that wasn't about the weight itself, but Pac dictating to him
Pac isn't really a WW, he's just a JWW
Bradley looked just fine in a WW tryout vs Abregu
weight isn't a factor in these 2 fights dude

Both of you guys are making good points but I don't think Bradley looked good in that fight at 147.

[Chups]

That, and if Pacquiao fought Cotto... Pac wouldn't want to fight him at 154lbs.

Just as Floyd wouldn't fight Bradley at 140 also.

[Jack Napier]

again, I think Floyd & Pac win either way but Cotto has a better shot at 154 and Bradley has a better shot at 140. There are alot of people who would pick Ortiz to beat Cotto right now at WW and lose to him at 154, even though he comes into the ring bigger than Cotto. There are people who think Bradley beats Ortiz at 140 and loses to him at WW.

You are not going to convince me that Cotto is the same fighter at WW right now than he is at 150-154. I just dont believe he is. You are also not going to convince me that Bradley is the same fighter at WW then he is at 140. He's not. You can say that Pac is small all you want but Pac has carried everything to WW and beaten huge guys with ease. He's more comfortable at that weight. Even Roach & Ariza think the same

Cotto's not the same because he's been through many tough fights
yes he was better at WW, but that's because he was younger/fresher
functionally, he's the same fighter, though with less power
and Pac beat bigger WW's with ease because he was faster than them
has nothing to do with him supposedly growing into a WW frame
Pac is physically just a JWW with speed that allows him to beat WW's
he won't have the same speed advantage over Bradley as other WW's
and he sure as hell isn't gonna be stronger than Tim at WW
don't see any reason why the weight matters in these fights

Both of you guys are making good points but I don't think Bradley looked good in that fight at 147.

just fine, not good
it was nothing but a tuneup/tryout at the weight

[Bushbaby]

To long to read, however there is a very good reason why Cotto is good for Floyd & not Pacman.

It's weightclass. Floyd doesn't need a drained Cotto. However even though the general concensus is that Pacman beats Cotto at any weight, for some really weird reason team Pacman wants none of Cotto above 148. It doesn't take rocket science for me, but others are confused by that.

[The Gambler1981]

I feel both as opponents on certain levels, they are quality guys that were certainly at the front of the line of available opposition. I still don't think either challenger can win though.

I have no issue with Manny choosing Bradley, he is a reasonable credible opponent who is about the same size, Bradley is a bit beefier but height and range they are close. I don't think Manny will run through him because Bradley is good at limiting what the other guys does, but I think it will take everything he has to limit Manny leaving little in the way in terms of offense.

I have no issue with Floyd chosing Cotto because it is a fight people have wanted for a long time plus Cotto seems to be back on track and he is a quality credible opponent. I don't find Cotto all that much different than in the past but I never gave Cotto much of a shot so hard to change that stance.

It is so tiresome getting hung up marginal issues though.

[THE REED]

Just as Floyd wouldn't fight Bradley at 140 also.

But, Floyds at least going up to Cottos weight.

Pac is bringing Bradley up, or would of brought Cotto down.