Lol @ "Angulo Punched Himself Out". He's A Pressure Fighter!!!

[BoxingGenius27]

He punched himself out after he hurt Kirkland. Thats common knowledge I thought.

Apparently not, if you can't click pay on the video I posted and see that Angulo didn't stop punching in the 1st round until Kirkland landed that HUGE uppercut.

Do you think it's a coincedence that all of a sudden Angulo is backing up and not punching immediately after Kirkland lands a huge uppercut?

[intoccabile]

You're confusing yourself. I'll break it down for you one more time.

Kirkland's punches are what slowed Angulo down in the first, not Angulo being puched out. Angulo then went on to throw combo's in the 3 round as seen in the video I posted. Angulo didn't look like a man punched out in the 3rd round.

You claim the only reason Angulo was able to throw combo's in the 3rd round was because he had 5 minutes to break as if Kirkland wasn't on his ass in the 2nd round.

Fact of the matter is, if Angulo wasn't in good shape/condition, he would've never made it out of the 2nd round because Angulo was done in the 1st.

You're ruling out his intangibles there, completely. A lot of that was heart and toughness there. The man was more durable than anything. I've been in similar situations to angulo for longer periods, it's not like it's an impossible feat. However, the punches he threw in the third (after recovering from being knocked down, etc finally) were only ARM punches, with no conviction what so ever. Which immediately tells you he was fatigued from the first. Kirkland was on queer street too - look at his offense compared to Angulos. One was coming from a fighter who didn't blow his load prior to being attacked and reserved, the other was coming from a fighter who blew his load before being attacked, then got attacked.

[BoxingGenius27]

You're ruling out his intangibles there, completely. A lot of that was heart and toughness there. The man was more durable than anything. I've been in similar situations to angulo for longer periods, it's not like it's an impossible feat. However, the punches he threw in the third (after recovering from being knocked down, etc finally) were only ARM punches, with no conviction what so ever. Which immediately tells you he was fatigued from the first. Kirkland was on queer street too - look at his offense compared to Angulos. One was coming from a fighter who didn't blow his load prior to being attacked and reserved, the other was coming from a fighter who blew his load before being attacked, then got attacked.

No I am not. I don't care how much heart and toughness you have. If you're not in shape and you're getting wacked, you're gonna go.

Secondly, it was Kirkland's conditioning that allowed him to throw as many punches as he did without tiring, not because he was attacking a punched out fighter. After the 1st round, Angulo went on to land some pretty good punches in the bout. Pretty good for a guy punched out.

[B.U.R.N.E.R]

Apparently not, if you can't click pay on the video I posted and see that Angulo didn't stop punching in the 1st round until Kirkland landed that HUGE uppercut.

Do you think it's a coincedence that all of a sudden Angulo is backing up and not punching immediately after Kirkland lands a huge uppercut?

Bro he was dead tired. His punches had nothing on them. His mouth was open. He blew his load its happened in boxing before. Thats not a knock on Kirkland its not Jmes job to make sure Angulo doesnt blow his load. With that said he tired himself out.

[intoccabile]

No I am not. I don't care how much heart and toughness you have. If you're not in shape and you're getting wacked, you're gonna go.

Secondly, it was Kirkland's conditioning that allowed him to throw as many punches as he did without tiring, not because he was attacking a punched out fighter. After the 1st round, Angulo went on to land some pretty good punches in the bout. Pretty good for a guy punched out.

Yes, pretty good, but arm punches. Nothing near as snappy, fast, or crisp as the punches he threw in the first. This is the argument. Nothing he did outside of "moving his arms" was reminiscent of the first round. He was tired.

My kirkland argument should have been explained more. Kirkland was never exhausted before being hurt, so he never had to recover his stamina whilst being defensive. THATS why he continued to throw sharp shots, he was never tired.

Angulo on the other hand, punched himself out (arguably) and THEN had to try to regain himself WHILE kirkland was all over him. My argument here, is if kirkland had thrown 100 more punches prior to being knocked down, he'd have thrown nothing but arm punches in the third round as well.

Angulo was breathing out of his mouth, tugging at the protector, panting in the corner, and throwing punches with nothing on them. Those are things you normally see in the second half of a fight.

That's also exactly what I see in the video in question that you are pointing it. I think we are going to just have to agree to disagree honestly, we're both convinced otherwise.

I concede.

[IronDanHamza]

From what I saw he underestimated Kirkland's toughness and thought as soon as I have him hurt I will easily take him out.

So he threw everything at Kirkland expecting to stop him and in result emptied his tank.

It can happen to anyone, pressure fighter or not.

Kirkland gets absolutely full credit whether he did or didn't anyway. He went into Angulo's backyard and got up off the floor and got him out of there. It's a great win for him.

I'd love to see it again.

[BoxingGenius27]

Yes, pretty good, but arm punches. Nothing near as snappy, fast, or crisp as the punches he threw in the first. This is the argument. Nothing he did outside of "moving his arms" was reminiscent of the first round. He was tired.

My kirkland argument should have been explained more. Kirkland was never exhausted before being hurt, so he never had to recover his stamina whilst being defensive. THATS why he continued to throw sharp shots, he was never tired.

Angulo on the other hand, punched himself out (arguably) and THEN had to try to regain himself WHILE kirkland was all over him. My argument here, is if kirkland had thrown 100 more punches prior to being knocked down, he'd have thrown nothing but arm punches in the third round as well.

Angulo was breathing out of his mouth, tugging at the protector, panting in the corner, and throwing punches with nothing on them. Those are things you normally see in the second half of a fight.

That's also exactly what I see in the video in question that you are pointing it. I think we are going to just have to agree to disagree honestly, we're both convinced otherwise.

I concede.

I can do that. But since I answered your question, just answer this last question.

Was it a coincedence that Angulo went from throwing strong combo punches to lazy punches immediately after Kirkland landed that huge uppercut? Was this a mere coincedence?

I can understand if Angulo gradually stopped punching while Kirkland was covered up in the corner. But if you look at the vid, you can see that Angulo didn't stop is onslaught until he was caught with that huge punch.

[intoccabile]

I can do that. But since I answered your question, just answer this last question.

Was it a coincedence that Angulo went from throwing strong combo punches to lazy punches immediately after Kirkland landed that huge uppercut? Was this a mere coincedence?

I can understand if Angulo gradually stopped punching while Kirkland was covered up in the corner. But if you look at the vid, you can see that Angulo didn't stop is onslaught until he was caught with that huge punch.

No, it wasn't a coincidence at all. It was a lot like the Berto/Ortiz fight, where Berto blew his load as well. The knockdown ruinned all momentum, it zapped whatever adrenaline he had going at the time and then reality set in.

Ever work out, running for example, and notice as soon as you lose your rhythm you can't get it back?

[BoxingGenius27]

From what I saw he underestimated Kirkland's toughness and thought as soon as I have him hurt I will easily take him out.

So he threw everything at Kirkland expecting to stop him and in result emptied his tank.

It can happen to anyone, pressure fighter or not.

Kirkland gets absolutely full credit whether he did or didn't anyway. He went into Angulo's backyard and got up off the floor and got him out of there. It's a great win for him.

I'd love to see it again.

Recovery my friend, recovery.

Pressure guys like Angulo, Margarito, Hatton (in his day) have some of the best recovery around. These guys don't show up to big fights and just get tired to the point of their done in the 1st round. No it just doesn't work like that.

Have you ever heard of a 2nd and 3rd wind??

Is it possible for someone to get tired? yes, but they have the recovery in their stamina to bounce right back within a round. Not throw a bunch of punches in the 1st round then be done for the rest of the fight. No, it doesn't work like that.

Angulo didn't really recover from the punches of Kirkland until the 3rd. Kirk was just all around the better and well conditioned fighter so it really didn't matter after that anyway.

[BoxingGenius27]

No, it wasn't a coincidence at all. It was a lot like the Berto/Ortiz fight, where Berto blew his load as well. The knockdown ruinned all momentum, it zapped whatever adrenaline he had going at the time and then reality set in.

Ever work out, running for example, and notice as soon as you lose your rhythm you can't get it back?

I played varsity sports (basketball) since the 7th grade. I'll be 29 in a few day. I've been an athlete my whole life.

When you're running and lose your rhythm, the only time you won't get it back is if you're not in shape. If you're in shape, you'll go on to get your 2nd and 3rd wind.

The only reason Angulo made it that far is not because of luck and heart. It's because of his conditioning. He took some big punches from a guy that's been through hell and back leading up to the fight... That in itself is no easy feat.